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Title: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 02:33:25 PM
runs about 3 minutes and shuts off. restarts and does it again my first ddec. on the dash right side is a small gauge it,s at 516 when started then goes down to 513 then shuts off. i thick this is the codes?it is a 1988 mci102c 8v92 auto.thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on November 14, 2011, 02:40:08 PM
Jim, not sure what the gauge is that you see, but it is probably not a fault code display.

You should have an orange/yellow light and a red light together on your dash.  One should say check engine and the other should say stop engine (red).  If one or both come on, there is a fault thrown by the ECM.  If neither come on, it is most likely a fuel delivery problem or possibly a low voltage problem. 

The low voltage problem tends to make the engine run very rough.

If you have no warning lights then I would pull one of the fuel filters and make sure you have fuel.

As I was writing this, I recall one of our members had a problem with the breaker/fuse that supplies power to the ECM.  Might want to check that as well.

Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 02:53:18 PM
thanks jim it does have the lights on the left. we have gone over the fuel system it is getting fuel we pulled the plugs on temp and fuel sending units but it still stops with them unpluged thing it is electric. what about the low voltage? we turn it over so many times we had to put a charger on the bateries. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Sean on November 14, 2011, 03:03:33 PM
Are you certain the CEL and SEL lamps are both working?  They should both come on as part of the lamp test when you first turn on the master switch, then go out within 5 seconds.  If the lamps don't come on during the test, that's the first problem you need to fix.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com)


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 14, 2011, 03:13:49 PM
It would be best to just grab the codes from the ecm end know exactly where to start! You could be chasing it forever without knowing what the ecm knows!


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 03:31:46 PM
thanks sean , the lites do come on;and thanks ace,how do you grab the codes? thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 14, 2011, 03:43:00 PM
There should be a switch someplace maybe even outside that allows you to put the ddec into test mode. After doing that, turn the key switch on and watch the yellow (check engine light) it should flash, then pause, then flash. Count the flashes such as 3 pause 1 pause 4 would indicate the code as 314. With that number, someone here can look it up if you don't have a manual to tell you exactly what the problem is. The 314 ras just a made up code.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 14, 2011, 04:02:17 PM
513 and 516 are OBD2 codes he should be getting 53 and 56 from a reader a OBD2 reader some install on the dash will put a 1 between most codes sounds like he has EEProm problems


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Iceni John on November 14, 2011, 04:04:58 PM
I've just finished completely rewiring my battery cables, and one of the things I encountered were the infamous DDEC injector fuses.   There are two such fuses, each 15A, that supply the injectors, and their power is fed directly off the starting batteries, along with their grounds.   Make sure they're making good contact.   You may also have a fused 5A supply to a DDEC relay, in my bus up front in the main JB, and this also has its own feed and ground from the batteries.   All this is separate from the main ECM power supply.   If any of these fuses are iffy, your engine simply won't run right.

John


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 04:27:43 PM
thanks guys,will try tomorrow ace the bus is at earls in plant city if you want to stop by jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Sean on November 14, 2011, 04:28:17 PM
If neither the CEL nor SEL is coming on prior to the engine shutting down, I doubt that reading the codes will help, because it does not sound like an ECM-commanded shutdown.

I would definitely check the ECM power supply, and then the fuel delivery.  Also check the air induction system.

To definitively check the fuel delivery, I would run a hose out of a jerry can right into the filter, bypassing the line from the tank.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com)


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 04:52:35 PM
sean i did the fuel can into the filter and also pulled fuel from the tank to the back by a electric pump so no air in lines.it is getting fuel starts right up and run great for abount 3 or 4 minutes then something shuts it down. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 14, 2011, 04:58:24 PM
Sounds  like a low coolant voltage issue.
I have a ddec 2 pro link that I could bring by and see what the codes are.
I use it on mine all the time when there are faults but thankfully there have been none in a long while!
Call me if you want me to bring it over. I can do it tomorrow afternoon after my job gets done in Waldon oaks which is in plant city!
8635599067


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 14, 2011, 05:03:55 PM
Jim,you say it is a 1988 model are you 100% sure it is a DDEC11

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 14, 2011, 05:14:48 PM
clifford the motor came out of a prevost it was was a reliabuit about 9 years ago. the bus came with a 6v92 then was changed. i called dd in tampa,fl. they said it was a ddec2 so no i am not 100% sure,they did not want to spend time looking it up thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 14, 2011, 05:21:56 PM
Does it have 2 units or 1 unit for the ECM


good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 14, 2011, 05:49:43 PM
I'm going Over there tomorrow after work with my pro link which ironically is just across the road from where he's at!



Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on November 14, 2011, 06:43:51 PM
Low coolant sensor sometimes gets oil on it and it acts like there is low coolant. It will start when key is cycled but shuts down. take it out and clean it.  Good luck   Gerry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on November 14, 2011, 07:55:22 PM
Low coolant sensor issue should throw a fault.  In DDEC III and IV it will trigger both the check engine and stop engine lights.  I think Jim said he was not getting a fault light.  When Ace hooks up his ProLink, we should learn quite a bit.

Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on November 14, 2011, 08:24:47 PM
Yes when Ace hooks up the ProLink it will tell if it has any codes to tell. But I have on more than one occasion with electronic engines had problems that did not signal a fault!

Just a week or so ago one of our members who has been busy with no bus projects went to take his bus from the storage to his new house w/bus barn.

It would start and run about 3-4 mins and die.

He called me and we went through the codes thing and all it was telling us was that it had a ECM Prom fault.

He called DD and they were of no help.
I talked to him again and had him check and make sure the plug on the ecm was plugged in good and the wires were not pulled out or shorted.

He did that an still did the same thing.
He asked "Will it hurt it if I just drive it until it shuts of, and pull over restart it and go again? I only have a short distance to go, like 5 miles".

I told him as long as it had oil, water and oil pressure I didn't see what it would hurt.

He called about 2o mins later and told me he made it home. Said it died 2 or 3 times and then just kept running all the way home and was sitting there doing fine now that it was home.

Never did find out what it was!
;D  BK  ;D

I also had on that had the infamous fuse issue and one day I got PO'd and yanked out the 2 injector inline fuse holders and replaced them and never had a problem again. (turned out the fuse holders had a lot of corrosion down in the slots and allowed bad connections!)


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: niles500 on November 14, 2011, 11:14:06 PM
99% of the time on a DDEC II the shutdown is low coolant - add some to the surge tank and see what it does - HTH


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on November 15, 2011, 05:16:59 AM
99% of the time on a DDEC II the shutdown is low coolant - add some to the surge tank and see what it does - HTH

Niles this is true. But the one I was helping last week the first thing I had him do was unplug the low coolant sensor and put a paper clip in the plug to jump it. And he still had problems.
But Jim might should try that too.

Jim in your surge tank there should be a low coolant sensor (these go bad sometimes) unplug it and use a piece of wire or a paper clip in the plug to bypass the sensor and see what happens.
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 15, 2011, 05:21:37 AM
If you are going to own a electronic engine you better invest in a reader or software because you are going to need it lol

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 15, 2011, 03:22:37 PM
ace came today, hooked up prolink all the old codes had low voltage issues reset and it shows no new codes,when motor is running the prolink shows 13 volts,after running for 5 to 10 minutes it goes down to 12&11&10 then it shuts down, will start right back up any do it all over.whats next? thanks ace and every body else,jim












7


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on November 15, 2011, 03:25:21 PM
Had one bad battery once. so happens it was one 12 volt ddec tap was off of.   worth a ck.   Bob


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 15, 2011, 04:26:16 PM
bk thanks .i will try the paper clip tomorrow,anyone knows if the equalizer is part of the vanner thats over the batterys or is it separete some where else? mci102c thanks bob i check batterys, jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: bobofthenorth on November 15, 2011, 04:39:36 PM
Not sure what you intend to do with the paper clip but it seems to me you have figured out why the engine is shutting down - the DDEC is seeing a drop in voltage and eventually shutting the engine down.  What you need to figure out now is where that voltage drop is coming from.  I don't know squat about DDEC but it seems to me you'd start with a VOM at the battery(ies) and work from there back toward the computer.  Somewhere something is causing the voltage that the computer sees to drop - my guess would be a flaky connection somewhere along the way.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: edroelle on November 15, 2011, 04:50:02 PM
I had intermittent code problems with a DDEC III.   Since I did the following, I have had no problems.

I disconnected the connectors and sprayed each, and the ECM, LIGHTLY with contact cleaner.  Then applied a very SMALL amount of dielectric grease to the contacts.

I would like to know your results if you try this.


Ed Roelle
Flint, MI


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 15, 2011, 05:23:31 PM
thanks bob&ed we are trying every thing,will let you know when we find the culprit  i have a 6v92 mechanical in my flx and this is a new advenure jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 15, 2011, 05:59:17 PM
After hooking up the pro link, it shows the 8v92 is set up with 400 bhp, 600 rpm, 2110 max rpm.
We checked the id number against what number jim had already found on the engine and they matched correctly.
Now the codes: (all history)
First one was
Low coolant voltage (occured 14 times)
Then
High coolant voltage (occurred 23 times)
Then
Another I can't remember
Then
Low oil pressure (24 times)
Then
84 which the book said low crank case pressure, I think!
 
The ECM voltage at idle read 13.6v but fluttered up and down as low as 10.2v and back up. There were times when the ecm would drop and the engine would try to die but as soon as the voltage went back up, it would keep from dying and continue to run.
Checking the voltage at the two 8D batteries showed roughly 12.8 volts. I wasn't the one checking the voltage as there wasn't a volt meter handy.
Checked the fuses to the injectors and they were 12.? volts. The fuse marked ecm was the same. There was ONE fuse, can't remember which that would not read above 10.? Volts.
Then someone said that while the valve covers were off, they noticed one wire seemed different as in hooked up different than all the others. It could be backwards?
It was also mentioned that one battery would take a charge but after about 10 starts, would be dead. This is the newest of the two.
I never looked at the ecm or the engine as I couldn't stay any longer than I did.
Oh that reminds me. One of the history codes was ecm failure, but no actual code number.
The cel and sel never come on prior to starting but the pro link said they were turned off. The sel DOES come on after it shuts down.

One more thing, I was able to clear all history codes. That took 3 attempts but gumball all were cleared. Once the coach was started and allowed to run until it shut down, the same exact history codes re-appeared and NO ACTIVE CODES were ever present!
That's all I can remember...other than engine sounds good, no smoke and starts easy. When it shuts down, its just like turning off the key switch! It will start right back up without hesitation!



Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: niles500 on November 15, 2011, 06:04:21 PM
Could be as simple as bad batteries - FWIW


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 15, 2011, 06:22:22 PM
Niles that was where I left it. I advised Jim to get 2 NEW batteries and start there and work back to the ecm!


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on November 15, 2011, 08:28:42 PM
Check and make sure the ground wires from the ecm have a good ground. If it is a DDEC 11 they should be the centre black wires between the red ones. If the grounds are bad and you have high resistance it will eventually fry the injector drivers.    Good luck ,  Gerry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: prevosman on November 16, 2011, 05:27:50 AM
I'm far from an expert, but one thing is critical on DDEC engines and that is good voltage. A while back I chased erratic voltages and while I will never know exactly what I did to correct the problem I did make it go away. I started with the batteries, verified they all were good (one bad battery drives you nuts) and then cleaned and reconnected every single terminal connection and ground. Using the voltmeter I was reading good continuity and voltage everywhere, but obviously somewhere in the bus load of connections and terminals there was one that tested good but wasn't carrying a load until I disturbed it, cleaned it and or retightened it.

I don't know about all coaches but on mine I had some power directly from the batteries to some DDEC circuit breakers so it takes a bit of detective work to find all the terminals. I think Ed has a good idea, but on those terminals I did not think of that. I just kept exercising the plugs to "wipe" the corrosion if any.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on November 16, 2011, 05:31:21 AM
Is this a new install?   Bob  PS  have batt load tested.  will  show true condition/indivually


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 16, 2011, 01:40:09 PM
well worked on it today,took the plug from gauge on overflow tank like bk said bus ran for about 45 minits then shut down the 2 temp gauges by the motor where both at 180 degrees. the motor will start right back up. but over nite it takes a sma ll shot of either? started to cleen plugs have new batterys coming tomarrow. anyone know where to get the manuals? i want paper not cd. really need a least the eletric part thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 16, 2011, 02:44:09 PM
we have a ecm that came off a 6v92 can we use this on the 8v92 to test? what does one cost if we need one, where to get rebuild one. thanks jim









/


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on November 16, 2011, 03:33:26 PM
Jim I will see my buddy John tonight and see if he had one I can borrow! They ain't cheap if you have to buy one!
The first thing I'd do though is start With new batteries, then do voltage checks at all connections then start replacing sensors. I would not bother cleaning them! That's just me! I like to know that what I'm starting with is good!


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: kevink1955 on November 16, 2011, 03:56:34 PM
Sounds like you are chasing other issues when the tests already performed say the voltage to the ECM is droping while it is runing. I would be looking carefully at the fuses/circuit breakers that power the ECM. If they are located near the batterys as most are the batterys gassing off may have caused high restance.

The starting problem could also be voltage related, to low and the ECM will not turn on and fire the injectors. We have had fuse problems on fire trucks, they mount the batterys behind the front tires and expose the ECM fuses to road spray.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 16, 2011, 05:20:32 PM
ace. earl has a ecm off of a 6v92 we just do not know if it will fit the 8v92. thanks kevin i  still checking fuses thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on November 16, 2011, 06:53:18 PM
ace. earl has a ecm off of a 6v92 we just do not know if it will fit the 8v92. thanks kevin i  still checking fuses thanks jim

Jim DO NOT try a 6V92 DDEC on an 8V92 unless you want more problems than you already have!

They are different animals. The 8V DDEC is configured for 8 cylinders & the 6V DDEC is only configured for 6. (have a friend that tried that, didn't work out and caused many head aches.

I have a 8V DDEC unit on the shelf.
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: buswarrior on November 16, 2011, 08:04:48 PM
Good grief.

Get two new batteries, check all the connections/wires/fuses for the ECM ruthlessly for corrosion.

And watch your problems go away?

Leave the ECM alone, nothing in this thread even comes close to touching it.

happy coaching!
buswarrior


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on November 16, 2011, 11:01:29 PM
The best way to  to test an ECM is to purchase a plug that fits the power connector on the ECM, run some 14ga wires to it. one for power one for  ground. put some aligator clips on the ends  use a separate car  battery and start it up. if it continues to run without problems, you have wiring issues on the bus side of the wiring harness.If you still have issues it is on the engine side of the wiring harness.  This is one of the troubleshooting steps in the troubleshooting manual.   


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 17, 2011, 04:07:09 AM
Jim,I forgot where you ask about the OBD2 reader but you buy one even at Wal/Mart for 50 bucks they will read the codes from the J 1587 link only problem they read in the SAE example 45 (oil pressure) will read P1001 then some will with the S like to many SRS will read s210 instead of 41 DD has a table to convert the reading and you can erase some codes with one also and it will not read any sub codes.  
Not a Pro/Link or DDDL but they are better than trying to read the flashing lights lol


good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 17, 2011, 05:02:32 AM
thanks bk,hargraves,buswarriow,luvrbus, jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on November 17, 2011, 05:21:59 AM
Just a bit of clarification on DDEC II.  The data port is an OBD2 configuration.  However, as Clifford points out, OBD2 is a different computer protocol.  DDEC uses SAE J1708 protocol.

The OBD2 reader should not be able to read the codes since it is looking for a different data stream.  That said, Clifford has made it work, but I can't figure out how. 

I am pretty sure that the OBD2 reader will not give you information on what the sensors are reporting.

Bottom line, don't rush out and buy an OBD2 reader thinking it will replace a ProLink or DDDL software.  Clifford says that, but I wanted to make sure that there is no confusion.

Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 17, 2011, 06:28:21 AM
My OBD2 reads J1708,1587,1922,1939 and others BMW is J1708 and I think M/B is also ?

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: bevans6 on November 17, 2011, 08:28:07 AM
Just because I'm interested, I looked up this:  It says that J1708 is a physical interface only.  So I wondered what data protocol DDEC uses?

OBDII Bus Description

OBD2 [On-Board Diagnostics II] defines a communications protocol and a standard connector to acquire data from passenger cars. It was required by U.S. EPA on all gasoline powered cars and light duty trucks manufactured for the U.S. after 1996 to help monitor/inspect vehicle emissions.
OBDII will light a lamp called a MIL (malfunction indicator lamp), also known as the "check engine" light on the dash.
The OBD-II standard allows for multiple electrical interfaces, which complicates the hardware used to interface with the vehicle. OBDII data as defined by the SAE J1979 standard
For a detailed description, Engineering Data, and circuit Interface implementation; see the OBDII Bus page.
   
OBDII to 15-pin Dsub Cable
OBDII Cable

{Automotive Buses Index}
SAE J1708 Bus Description

Serial Data Communications Between Microcomputer Systems in Heavy-Duty Vehicle Applications. J1708 defines the physical layer only. J1708 uses the RS485 bus as the electrical layer.
The cable is a 2-wire 18 AWG wire with a maximum distance of 40 meters. Class A operating to 9600bps. A message starts with a Message Identification Character [MID], followed by Data characters and then a checksum.
The total message length is 21 or less characters. Each character is 10 bits, each character begins with a Start bit [logic low].


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 17, 2011, 02:55:14 PM
wow,you are losing me know. put new batteries in 8d it cured the starting problem started instantly then shut off 2 minutes we unplugged the sensors and by passed them,we found a wire in the engine bay leftside that was loose .it controled the alternater. fixid that so calling mci tomorrow to get electric schematic. really a pane in the a&&. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Rick 74 MC-8 on November 17, 2011, 04:26:22 PM
Maybe too simple. Does his coach have a rear set of switches for start and run. I know nothing how about electronics engines mine is mechanical


    Rick 74 m c 8


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 17, 2011, 04:41:46 PM
Voltage is not the problem Jim if it was Ace would have got the 46 code with his pro/link if your fix doesn't work pull the ECM and have a DD dealer check it they can tell you in a minute if the ECM is bad and it is not going to cost that much.  

You haven't used a welding machine or plasma torch on the engine or bus ? maybe the shut down idle is set to turn it off the DDEC 11 will drive you nuts on a 60 series or a 92 series  

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Flatspot on November 17, 2011, 04:43:02 PM
Being the cheap ... frugal person I am and not wanting to pay the pro link price I remembered that Kent Moore provided the first readers for Detroit. I worked for a fleet that beta tested the 60 series for Detroit and we were provided with the J 36500 Kent Moore readers.
I have found several readers in the past. I currently have serial number 777 so I'm going to stick with it.
Usually they can be had for under a hundred bucks.
They read DDECI and II. It even has some test and reset features for them. It also reads the ATEC transmission ECU.
Just a thought if you don't want to pay the pro link price.
Good luck with your troubleshooting and I am in the 'find what ever is making your voltage drop' camp, not discounting grounds.
Good luck trouble shooting it and I bet you find it.

Happy Trails
Larry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 17, 2011, 04:57:08 PM
Jones did you say "frugal" that is not what I heard it called Lol his voltage falls in stages just like the ECM tells one to do maybe one of the Prevost guys could tell us if that model of Prevost was a 12 volt or 24 volt programed ECM  

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on November 17, 2011, 06:40:04 PM
Every day I learn something new.  I had no idea that an OBD2 reader would communicate with J1708.

Clifford, will it only read fault codes, or does it have the same features that ProLink and DDDL have (read output of all of the sensors)?  If it can read all the sensors, that is a cheap way to get around the ProLink cost.

DDEC protocol is J1708.  The later DDEC versions have the ability to "talk" to J1939 "accessories" like my AutoShift, but the engine controls are J1708.

DDEC II uses the same data port as is found on OBD2 vehicles but it does use the J1708 protocol.  DDEC III and later use the "modern" round 6 or 9 pin Duetsch connector.

My understanding is that OBD2 is the protocol for gasoline and light diesel engines.  All HD diesel engines use J1708 protocol, although I am hearing that some of the recent HD diesels are using J1939 to some degree.  The J1939 protocol facilitates much higher date rate and modern diesel technology will demand that capacity. 

SilverLeaf converts J1708 data for their engine display data.  As far as I know the VMS products will "talk" to all HD diesel engines.

Jim



Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 18, 2011, 08:42:19 AM
up date this morning, moved the bus out of the barn while setting their waiting on air to build watching volt gauge,at 28 volts then it started to go down fast to 10 volts shut down lite came on and motor stop.the motor started right back up , have not done any welding or torch.it is like something large kick on.still on it will get it. waiting on call from mci about a electric schmatic  thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Flatspot on November 18, 2011, 09:00:48 AM

I guess I missed where you are reading the voltage?
What does come back to and how fast does it come back after a shut down?

Larry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 18, 2011, 09:08:26 AM
larry reading from dash guage. when it is started back up starts charging within seconds rev it up goes to 28 then a few minutes starts falling to 10 then shut down lite comes on and engine shuts down thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on November 18, 2011, 09:12:01 AM
run separate feed  12 volt to your DDEC. independent batt.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 18, 2011, 09:12:35 AM
Not clear to me either if he is reading from the dash could be the override engaging the starter that big of drop he would be smelling smoke for anything else you would think.

The problems he is having the guy will hate a DDEC if it wasn't in a MCI I would already had changed that one over to MUI engine lol  

good luck Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 18, 2011, 09:27:29 AM
bob we did that so we think the ecm is ok,clifford send me a mechincal engine and i will change it.just kidding i have a 69flx with 350hp 6v92mechical ,i bought this 88mci102c because of the height and the width and the extra 5 ft. norust,smooth sides,the nice bay doors that goe out&up and new all white paint plus newgoodyear front tires (1,000)bucks. paid 5,ooo for it so i thought it was a good deal.i just don't have any experance with dang ddec stuff.thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Flatspot on November 18, 2011, 01:18:41 PM
Sounds like you got a deal.
I suspect that you are learning DDECII, just the hard way.
I really like my DDECI and Clifford will tell you it's because I don't have a Cold Starting Aid adjustment to mess with.
It sounds like you have some kind of external load pulling down your voltage to the ECM.
If you watch your headlights do they go dim and then dark like the voltage meter on the dash?


Larry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: muldoonman on November 19, 2011, 06:24:08 AM
Hey Jim, What model of year model of 8v do you have? I have all schematics of 91 prevost in my coach. I can't read um, but got um. If I can help let me know.

Good Luck.
glen


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 19, 2011, 12:30:46 PM
glen itis a ddec2 i think thinging mid 80,s . called mci friday morning but they never returned my call.was trying to get the secmatics from them.i will try again monday. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Hard Headed Ken on November 19, 2011, 03:44:38 PM
Here is a link to my pictures of the DDEC II ECM pin outs if it helps any.

Ken

http://www.mediafire.com/?agivpxygaw3vcb2,9o8siucilhogdz4,uwkk2y0h7pcms96,aofkpjj6dd54ngj,z9m36dkr2exaxr7,dfn4cium76lnb55 (http://www.mediafire.com/?agivpxygaw3vcb2,9o8siucilhogdz4,uwkk2y0h7pcms96,aofkpjj6dd54ngj,z9m36dkr2exaxr7,dfn4cium76lnb55)


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 20, 2011, 03:09:16 PM
thanks ken for the info jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on November 27, 2011, 02:50:42 PM
So have we any ideas as to what the problem/cure was/is?
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on November 27, 2011, 02:53:11 PM
BK he either got the problem solved or removed the engine and going with a MUI engine lol


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on November 27, 2011, 03:44:27 PM
BK he either got the problem solved or removed the engine and going with a MUI engine lol

 ;)


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on November 28, 2011, 02:28:48 PM
no,did not get fixed yet took off for thanksgiving we borrowed another ecm tried it. did not help.still shuts down. it ran about 30 min. then shut down. jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 01, 2011, 04:46:30 AM
I took the pro-link back yesterday and had a little more time to spend and here's what we have.
No codes no matter how many times it shuts down. It has multiple history codes and I can erase them but after starting back up, they reappear.
Personally, I feel like its a fuel issue. Before I arrived and per my phone call I suggested running the coach from an outside source of fuel. They had about a 15 gallon jug there with both feed and return lines going into it. They said it ran well for about 30 minutes and shut down again. When I got there, it ran but shortly after it shut down as if it ran out of fuel.
After checking one filter then the other both were found to be completely dry. My guess us that there is a fuel line from the primary filter to the pump that is being sucked closed.
The bus will start up almost right away but seems that each time it starts it has a shorter run time. My thinking is the cold fuel is getting warm and causing the rubber in the hose to get soft because in the morning when it's colder the bus runs the longest.
Then again it could be simply the fuel pump acting up too.
I think the next plan of attack is to change the fuel lines that haven't already been changed and start there.
It was also considered to check the idle shut down and I did but to first get around that was to watch the dash while running and just before it would shut down as the cel light came on we could step on the brake pedal which would reset the idle time but after learning that the bus not only shuts down while idling it shuts down while being driven so that was a moot point and the idle shut down was disregarded as the problem.
Also the historic codes were: 15,16,26, 36, or maybe 24 and 34 and about 3 or 4 others but just don't think it's electrical.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 01, 2011, 05:30:53 AM
Strange those are all failed circuit codes except 26 the aux shutdown active code it will be something simple lol 

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 01, 2011, 06:19:10 AM
Is this the one with the fuel cooler for the DDec unit attached to the side of the unit. Be careful with those connections. that fuel cooler is soft brittle material. I broke mine once.    About $100  It's purpose is to cool  DDec system.         Again this install has been run successful in past??  In this bus?   Bob


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 01, 2011, 06:50:40 AM
If he didn't change anything that engine should run


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 01, 2011, 03:01:16 PM
bob this motor is a reliabilt by detroit 8 years ago set for the last couple years. we think that the bus came with 6v92 when new then change to this motor.changing the fuel lines today.from filters to pump and beyound about 4 lines , might be one line collapase when fuel gets hot. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on December 01, 2011, 03:37:16 PM
Jim, I don't know about MCI, but Eagles have a check valve in the delivery line.  If at all possible I would try to replace the line from the tank to the first filter and install a new check valve if you have one.  It is common practice to use DOT tubing which is pretty inexpensive.

If this is a fuel issue (I am not convinced yet), some folks have had problems with the dip tube in the tank developing holes so that it will not pick up fuel below the hole in the dip tube.

Lastly I, again, want to strongly recommend that the primary and secondary filters be replaced with a Fuel Pro filter:  http://www.davco.com/DFP-_fp382.htm (http://www.davco.com/DFP-_fp382.htm)   These are a bit pricey (some find them on ebay).  They will tell you in one second if you have a fuel delivery problem (via the clear fuel bowl).

Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 01, 2011, 03:52:26 PM
Jim does it blow any black or white smoke before shutdown ?


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 01, 2011, 03:53:45 PM
jim.i ran the fuel lines into a 15 gallon of fuel from filter and the return line from the head. the motor ran about 20 minuits. when the fuel heated up it shut down. it will start right back up but then only runs 6 to 8 minutes. which is why we think maybe one of the lines on the engine might be collasping.thanks for your advice jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 01, 2011, 03:55:32 PM
clifford . no smoke thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 01, 2011, 04:32:26 PM
Doesn't sound like fuel is the problem if it start right back up hope it is for your sake,most of the time when they run out of fuel they will puff black smoke for a few seconds 

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 01, 2011, 04:59:05 PM
Hate ghost!!! If all else fails put a electric pump in line.  See if it makes difference?  what you got to loose.  Keep it for emergency prime for future use.  Would definitely rule out fuel transfer pump. could temporary plumb thru piece of clear hose to watch fuel flow to filters.  Grasping here but eliminating allot of fuel system.   Bob


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 01, 2011, 05:24:54 PM
Dumb? Did the Mci have a elect pump in tank that would act as ck valve?  And the engine application like mine out of the prevost depend on the mechanical transfer pump on the engine? If so could the inoperative elect mci pump be the problem??   Just throwing that out there----probably wrong!   Bob


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: stevet903 on December 01, 2011, 06:38:18 PM
Did the voltage issues on this ever get straightened out?  The DDEC will stop working when the voltage is 10V or less.  Another thing to check is an intermittent in the ignition line to the DDEC box.  With the ignition on, it should have 12V on it.  If it gets interrupted, the engine will shut off and leave no code, just like turning the key off.  Does it have a rear start switch?  Will it shut down if you start it from the rear?  You can try operating the switch several times and it may wipe any corrosion inside and allow the switch to work consistently.

Steve


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 01, 2011, 06:51:07 PM
Wow usual, lots of opinions but if you read everything you would have read that anything in the tank was eliminated and all the way back to the rear bulk head since the lines were removed at that point. The lines coming from the engine were lengthened and put into a 15 gallon jug of fresh fuel. It made no difference. It still shut down so it's either the pump or a line from there but not going forward to the tank.
There is no smoke before during or after shutdown.
Being a ddec it should show some sort of code after shutting down IF it's being shut down by the ECM. Even a loose connection will give a code as low or high voltage. I should know that one all to well.
I'm no expert but from what I'm seeing I'm sticking to a collapsing fuel line or bad fuel pump.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 01, 2011, 06:59:14 PM
Ace at this point : I forgot about remote fuel supply-- just as confused as most---ghost hunting..That cooler on side of ddec shouldn't be concern. I've broke mine and replaced: didn't see much to it.  Just a observation. suppose to keep ddec cool.  Good luck and do let us know--when you guys find the ghost so we may benefit..Will keep throwing thoughts out.  Some might be out there...   Did he say when fuel got hot?           The exhaust  has not been rerouted closer to the ddec or fuel lines? Mainly ddec...  Again out there... fuel cools DDEC   on my 89 prevost.   Bob


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 01, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
It just seems the returning fuel may be warming up the fuel that would ultimately cause a line to become soft and possibly close off the flow. Yea I'm reaching too but what else to go on with no codes?
I'm leaning on a fuel problem since we just experienced the same type scenario coming back from Daytona in a friends Rv.
Funny thing is how the more it runs and shuts Off the less amount of time it runs!


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 01, 2011, 07:31:56 PM
With your bike back ground etc. You know this type of problem .  Let us know.  Might help some one down road. I'll ck my troubleshooting prevot book tomorrow just in case.Some time they do weird apps it their specks. Probably not in this case. Will look though.  Bob.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 01, 2011, 07:33:33 PM
Ace does his fuel pump have 3 lines 1 suction and 2 supply lines ? or the standard 2 lines


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 01, 2011, 07:41:16 PM
I think it's just like mine and standard 2 lines with the ddec mounted cooling plate.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 01, 2011, 07:52:44 PM
OK here is another question about fuel. Does it have a check valve in the return line coming from the head to the tank?
I had a 60 Series that had one of those go bad and it would act similar to this.

Also a way to surefire rule out DDEC voltage issue is to unhook DDEC wires from bus batteries and hook to a 12V car battery sitting there next to the bus. (then hook a 12V charger to it) And see how long it will run then. If it continues to run it's voltage/wiring, if it doesn't that is ruled out.

IIRC correctly you said you tried another 8V DDEC right?
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 01, 2011, 07:59:12 PM
After they installed two new  8D batteries the voltage appeared to stay more consistent in the mid 12v range fwiw


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 01, 2011, 08:50:31 PM
After they installed two new  8D batteries the voltage appeared to stay more consistent in the mid 12v range fwiw

Ace I understand what yer saying, but if they truly want to rule it out my suggestion is the easiest way.
And anytime I have a PIA problem like this I like to rule out as many possibilities as possible!
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: rv_safetyman on December 02, 2011, 04:58:37 AM
BK, the part that is mounted to the head in the return line is a "restrictive orifice".  According to my manual it is an 0.080 orifice.  I can't imagine why it would have to be changed.  On an Eagle there is not a check valve in the return line - only on the supply line to keep the fuel from being siphoned out of the filters back into the tank.

Jim, I recall reading somewhere that some MCI buses have what is called a "lift pump".  I picture it as an electric pump that is located close to the tank to overcome the "head" caused by the elevation that the fuel has to be lifted to get up and over some path before it gets to the first filter.  You might want to check your manual to see if you have such a pump.  If so, that would be the first place I would check.

Jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 02, 2011, 05:40:17 AM
BK, the part that is mounted to the head in the return line is a "restrictive orifice".  According to my manual it is an 0.080 orifice.  I can't imagine why it would have to be changed.  On an Eagle there is not a check valve in the return line - only on the supply line to keep the fuel from being siphoned out of the filters back into the tank.
Jim

Jim just throwing ideas out there! I didn't know if the 8V's had them or not. But I know that on our 60 series it was bad and creating a similar situation. Once changed no mo problem.
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 02, 2011, 05:44:43 AM
Ace will your Pro/Link read the version of software his ECM has ?

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 02, 2011, 05:58:46 AM
Clifford I'm not sure, why?


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 02, 2011, 06:34:18 AM
I was talking with Cole about it not giving any codes on shut down and he was telling me version 151 which he should have with a rebuild from DD if harness wasn't up dated from a 121 version it won't give codes on shutdown.

These thing are complicated with codes ,sub codes ,harnesses ,versions of software and etc lol I found out the Pro/Link and DDDL will only read the primary codes takes the DD software to read and delete the sub codes


good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Hard Headed Ken on December 02, 2011, 08:10:32 AM
I've use a test light, volt meter, LED and resistor, scope or what ever I had at the time to comfirm if the injector was receiving the signal to fire. I've done this many times on fuel injected gasoline engines. I've never needed to use this method on a DDEC, but I think it would work. That way you at least you know if the injectors were receiving the electrical signal to fire. If they are firing after the engine dies then it a fuel supply problem, if not it's an electrical problem.

Ken


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 02, 2011, 09:38:05 AM
up date bk we changed the backflo valves,on both lines and changed the fuel lines on the engine,going from first filter to pump, then to second filter and on to the engine,still stopped. so back to electical.thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 02, 2011, 10:01:35 AM
So easy to take the ECM into a DD dealer and have it read you will go broke chasing problems lol just because you tired another ECM doesn't mean much if you have a bad timing sensor.
DD can dig deep into a ECM with their software 

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: robertglines1 on December 02, 2011, 10:25:34 AM
real dumb!!  put & keep a cold wet towel on it see if it (ddec) still shuts down.  Could just be overheating and shutting down.. cool down a few degrees and restart.  Just like any other computer.  reaching here---but simple.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Flatspot on December 02, 2011, 03:54:13 PM
Just out of curiosity there has been no discussion about an engine idle shutdown. DDECII has the option for the engine to be shutdown to avoid extended idle.
Is the idle shutdown enabled?


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 02, 2011, 04:18:37 PM
I asked Larry but never got a reply back ? will the fast idle engage on a DDEC 11 if the idle shut down feature is enabled

good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Flatspot on December 02, 2011, 06:26:57 PM
Clifford,
I should have known that you would have ask, I missed it.
On the fleet that I worked with, yes but that said there was a way the ECM looked for a input on the power control wiring or brake input signal... I just can't recall specifics other than there were a lot of firmware changes made by Detroit because the drivers had too much time to figure ways around the way the engineers enabled things.
For instance initially they would set the trailer brake to hold the rig and the tractor could idle indefinitely (PTO time in the log) time for a firmware change.
We had a company owner/CEO that wanted a fleet average of 7+mpg and idle time killed the average.
I guess this is a qualified 'yes' depending on the firmware rev of the EEPROM.
Disabling the idle shutdown feature would be a simple fix if that is the reason this engine is shutting down. I wonder if it shuts down while driving?

Larry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Ace on December 03, 2011, 01:18:35 AM
Yes it shut down twice while driving it home a short distance!

The idle shutdown was previously mentioned and checked and was determined to not be the problem. There wasn't a way (at least for me) to turn it on or off via the pro-link although it was listed in the parameters.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 05, 2011, 03:40:59 PM
update, took ecm to detroit diesel, no new codes, idel shut down is turn off. they said every thing fine,does anyone know how to turn the hours on the motor to miles? put another restricker in the return fuel line. fired up motor shut down in 10 minutes. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: busguy01 on December 05, 2011, 05:22:13 PM
Generally speaking the return line restricter keeps fuel from draining away from injecters - making the engine hard to start. Should have no bearing on your issue. As I recall you said filters were empty when the engine stopped. If so, you have a fuel DELIVERY problem not an electrical one. Get a bucket and a electric fuel pump. Run a line DIRECTLY to the first filter in system. Run engine - if it stops check which filter has fuel and which has not - simple from there.
Jimh


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on December 05, 2011, 07:31:34 PM
Jim not sure if DDEC 11 had the 12volt 24 volt option.It should run on 12 volts. Disconnect the power harness from the bus and make up a separate one.  Use a separate set of batteries on both the positive and negative sides. Install this harness. If the engine still shuts down the problem has to be on the engine side as you have just eliminated the bus side of the wiring That is if the problem is electrical.

In 1990 we had transit engines shutting down on the road with no warning. It ended up being the e prom in the ECM vibrating loose. Roger Penske had 150 ECM,s flown out from Detroit so we could run our buses.  They ended up putting a hold down clamp on the E prom. The problem was extremely frustrating because when the engine cooled it would start up and run.   Good luck  Gerry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 06, 2011, 04:21:09 AM
jimh, thanks already did that. jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on December 06, 2011, 08:59:38 AM
Sorry Jim, getting old, find i'm repeating myself. Lol. sounds llike you have the electrical side covered.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 06, 2011, 01:53:00 PM
thanks gerry. this is what happen today,on the ecm the center plug is the 12 volt power, it is a 6 plug2 out side are 12 volt,2 on the other side is 12volt, center 2 are ground. the other 6 point plugs one on each side of the center12 volt plug. these control the injectors one for one side and one for the other side of engine.well we unplugged one side and engine does not shut down anymore. we are driving it tomorow. know understand this motor replaced a 6v92 about 8 years ago, so the wiring is not all stock, it has some splices and new wires. yes i know it does not sound right.will update tomorrow about the drive. i know there is a lot of busnuts want to know the outcom. thanks to every jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: kevink1955 on December 06, 2011, 02:20:25 PM
With 1 injector harness unpluged it should only be runing on 4 cylinders, is it?

Would think you could not drive it that way

Does it continue to run more than 10 min no matter what injector harness you unplug or is it only 1 harness that alows it to run.

Going out on a limb here but if only 1 harness stops the 10 min shutdown could be an injector that shorts when it warms up causing a high current draw shuting down the ECM, a harness going to ground could do the sane thing.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 06, 2011, 02:30:30 PM
OK speaking from experience here. Yes it will run with one side or the other of the injectors not getting power. But it will be GUTLESS! It won't have enough power to get out of it's own way, and will probably not even build enough RPM's to shift!

The one we had that had bad fuse holders did this one morning after it'd been running fine. Dad went to leave on a trip and called me telling me to bring fuel & filters because he thought we had one stopped up.

Well after pulling the filters and finding them full I changed them anyway. But no improvement.
Called Setra's best tech support guy they EVER had and with-in 2 minutes he had me checking those fuses.
As soon as I touched the one that had a bad connection the engine speed picked up and smoothed out. Had dad put it in gear and try to drive it. He took off like a rocket and I had to chase him down to grab my tools & close the battery & engine compartments! (I only wanted him to see if it would go a short distance, not just take off on me)
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 06, 2011, 03:10:47 PM
bk &kevin first off bk the fuses by the batterys  seem to be fine and engine is running on 8 clyinders.sounds fine when you push the fuel peddle. thanks jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: kevink1955 on December 06, 2011, 04:03:10 PM
On page 5, Ken provided the harness pinouts for the ECM. With 1 of the injector harnesses unpluged it should be runing on 4 cylinders.

Let Us know how it goes when you try to drive it, like BK said it should be a slug


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 06, 2011, 04:38:36 PM
bk &kevin first off bk the fuses by the batterys  seem to be fine and engine is running on 8 clyinders.sounds fine when you push the fuel peddle. thanks jim

Jim I'm not saying that IS your problem, just trying to shed some light on how it will act if that is the problem.

And FWIW my fuses & holders LOOKED OK too.
But in reality over time corrosion had built up inside it, and it made poor connections from time to time. After a while I finally got fed up with it and cut both fuse holders out and replaced them. Never a problem since then 6 yrs later!

The only way it's going to run fine with one of them unhooked is if someone has tied them together on up the line somewhere.
And that is highly possible.

The one you unhooked could have a short in it and they could have bypassed the short.
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: kevink1955 on December 06, 2011, 05:18:11 PM
Is it even possiable to hook the harnesses together, does the 2 stroke fire 2 cylinders at the same time?   If not you would be injecting fuel in the 4 spliced cylinders at the wrong time, I guess it would not inject till the rocker pushed the injector. Not exactly sure.


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: luvrbus on December 06, 2011, 06:19:41 PM
Firing order on a 8v92 DDEC is different than a mechanical  

DDEC reads
3R  
3L
4R
4L
2R
2L
1R
1L

Mechanical
1L
3R
3L
4R
4L
2R
2L
1R

The DDEC 1 fires the sames as a mechanical if I remember right and so does a DDEC 11 up to a certain serial number,WW Williams set me some late model cams for a DDEC 11 I installed in a mechanical engine the thing would not fire If I missed the firing order forgive me I just made 72 lol



good luck


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: hargreaves on December 06, 2011, 06:39:56 PM
Jim I think you are very close to solving your problem. Probably an injector harness grounding  out.  Good luck     Gerry


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: jimsflx on December 09, 2011, 03:25:48 PM
 :-*update ITS FIXED. found the ghost wire. it was in the rear box on drivers side. there is about 6 breakers in a row one wire was still hooked to the top of breaker but the breaker was cracked. wiring papers said it went to engine shut down.this was 12 volt that fed ecm on all the time.took it for about 20 miles,runs great. i am a happy camper. thats to all of you ideas, good luck jim


Title: Re: heip 8v92 ddec2
Post by: Busted Knuckle on December 09, 2011, 04:14:29 PM
Wooo hooooo! Glad to hear ya finally found it.
;D  BK  ;D