Bus Conversion Magazine Bulletin Board

Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: PCC on February 04, 2013, 09:08:41 AM



Title: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: PCC on February 04, 2013, 09:08:41 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/tour-bus-crashes-east-la-multiple-deaths-050525955.html (http://news.yahoo.com/tour-bus-crashes-east-la-multiple-deaths-050525955.html)

And this was a comment made by a reader:

"These tour bus crashes are happening too often. Obama and Feinstein need to aggressively plead to the people and claim that the majority of Americans want to limit the number of people aboard tour buses to no more than 10 people to minimize loss of life."

Maybe the bus is being seen like a firearm??? OMG


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: bkelly1011 on February 04, 2013, 10:34:34 AM
Keith -

Well, 10 folks on a 55-passenger bus wouldn't be very green - so we'd have to get some programs in place:

1.) The Cash for Crushed Coaches Program - re-direct DOT fine monies to buy up all the 14+-passenger coaches and crush them.
2.) The Many Mini-Buses Program - stimulus to manufacturers to re-tool to build 10-passenger coaches - might as well make them electric, too.
3.) The Smaller is Better Program - re-train and hire additional drivers to drive the smaller buses

Wait until (and not looking forward to it, of course) there are a couple of plane crashes in a short period of time.  They'll need to then make an empassioned plea to govern airspeed at 10 mph.

Take care,
Brad


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: PCC on February 04, 2013, 11:53:11 AM
And 10 passenger planes? Trains? Ferry boats? Vans? Seats at sporting events (Bleachers)? Concerts? Movie theaters? Restaurants?

Point taken?


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: wyle.e.kyote on February 04, 2013, 12:04:36 PM
Maybe the bus is being seen like a firearm??? OMG

Is it black with a folding stock?   Bingo!


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Van on February 04, 2013, 04:50:51 PM
I'LL NEVER GIVE UP MY ASSAULT BUS! ;)


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 04, 2013, 08:55:57 PM
Sounds like it was a Mexican bus company that had been sited often for violations.  It is questionable whether they should have been allowed to operate at all.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: luvrbus on February 05, 2013, 06:06:40 AM
I find it hard to believe there is not more accidents with Mexican buses our highways here in AZ are covered with Mexican buses thanks to NAFTA you will see American carriers buses red flagged at weight stations but never a Mexican carrier with 50 people in 40 passenger bus


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 05, 2013, 09:01:31 AM
You think they have proper insurance?


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: luvrbus on February 05, 2013, 09:16:28 AM
I doubt it Lin kinda not like us going into Mexico we have to have their insurance they probably use a Mexican insurance company that is not even registered to do business here


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Len Silva on February 05, 2013, 09:34:24 AM
I can't read the carrier but it looks like it has US DOT and ICC numbers.

(http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/H0Q_XES_sB5Z.soO.oHoWA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD0xMDI0O3E9Nzk7dz0xMzg3/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/Reuters/2013-02-04T172238Z_2115258830_TM4E9240VLZ01_RTRMADP_3_USA-CRASH-CALIFORNIA.JPG)


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: FloridaCliff on February 05, 2013, 09:47:26 AM
More Information on Carrier:

http://fox5sandiego.com/2013/02/04/safety-record-of-bus-company-involved-in-deadly-yucaipa-crash-questioned/#axzz2K33exsTx (http://fox5sandiego.com/2013/02/04/safety-record-of-bus-company-involved-in-deadly-yucaipa-crash-questioned/#axzz2K33exsTx)


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: akbusguy2000 on February 05, 2013, 10:07:57 AM
Here's a comprehensive report:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323807004578284141341375974.html (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323807004578284141341375974.html)

tg


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Iceni John on February 05, 2013, 12:23:56 PM
Unfortunately I cannot open the WSJ's article, but last night's TV news said that the full investigation would take "weeks" to be completed.   There was a view of the bus being towed away behind a HD tow truck, and it clearly showed heavy damage to the right side and front.   However, the bus was still on its wheels, albeit across the roadway, after the crash  -  did this mean it rolled a complete 360 degrees over and back onto its wheels, or even onto its right side than back onto its wheels?   If so, that's unusual.

Scapadas Magicas appears to be a US operator because it is based in National City CA, just north of the border.   What intrigues me is the mention that "According to Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, Scapadas has a satisfactory safety rating, but was cited for at least 30 safety violations, including several related to brake issues".   Yikes.   What does it take to get an unsatisfactory rating?   This brings into question the whole way our federal friends assess bus companies' safety ratings.   It would be nice to think the entire process is transparent and beyond question, but as with so much else emanating from Washington DC the reality may be less than wholesome.

The bus looks like a Van Hool T-840.   I wonder if it had seatbelts at every seat?   While it sustained heavy damage, I wonder how many fatalities were caused by passengers being ejected from it as it rolled?   The bloodstains on the outside under the window may indicate that this occured.   I just got back from a three week trip around Mexico, during which I used the consistently-excellent long-distance buses there between Toluca, DF, Puebla and Cordoba  -  every bus I was in had seatbelts at each seat and seemed to be in impeccable overall condition.   Wouldn't it be ironic if it is found that Mexicans travelling in a US-owned bus in this country are at greater risk than if using their own buses in Mexico?

John




Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Len Silva on February 05, 2013, 02:35:47 PM
On the other hand, there are people complaining about too many rules and regulations and the government wasting taxpayers money.  We can't have it both ways.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: belfert on February 05, 2013, 04:31:56 PM
The WSJ article explains that there are a number of categories that make up a motor carrier's safety rating.  The motor carrier scored well in most of the ratings, but poor in maintenance.  They had an overall rating of satisfactory because of the good ratings in the other categories.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 05, 2013, 04:44:50 PM
That's pretty interesting to learn. I would have thought that poor maintenance, particularly on brakes, would pull the coaches from service.  What are the other safety categories?


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: luvrbus on February 05, 2013, 05:21:12 PM
DOT regulations are enforced by the states a DOT inspection beats nothing but things can happen shortly after one most inspections are done by carrier  

There are some buses in this area that are in terrible shape but sport the DOT number on the side much and that much gives them a free pass at a weight station some even have the electronic passes they don't even stop

 Rarely do you see a DOT inspection at a station on a passenger bus the stations are setup for trucks and a full inspection takes about 2 or 3 hrs for a trooper to preform that would be a lot of unhappy travelers even it might save their lives they would probably get a little ups   

Notice you never saw the Hounds MCI 9s and 12s with duck tape holding the lights and windshield in place with wire holding the doors on at weight station naw just going down the road with 40  people on board


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Hobie on February 06, 2013, 06:18:24 AM
The National City address is just a mailing address.   The buses are based in Tijuana.   And after what Clifford just said,  ..Hmm.  


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Len Silva on February 06, 2013, 06:32:50 AM
You just can't do the same level of inspection on a bus compared to a truck without a lift or pit.
Florida gave up it's vehicle inspections some years ago but, when they did do them, you would drive up on a brake testing machine and apply the brakes.  It would measure the relative braking at each wheel.  It seems that something along those lines could work for buses.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Jeremy on February 06, 2013, 08:10:51 AM
I have the maintenance record for my bus which includes an MOT test every month (for comparison, cars are tested once a year here). I've no idea how our MOT test compares to your DOT test - but certainly the really obvious stuff like testing the brakes only scratches the surface of what they check. I'd have to pull out the paperwork for my bus to check the monthly sheets, but I seem to remember it needed something every time which required work or money

Jeremy


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: belfert on February 06, 2013, 12:44:45 PM
That's pretty interesting to learn. I would have thought that poor maintenance, particularly on brakes, would pull the coaches from service.  What are the other safety categories?

A failed safety inspection of a single bus will still get that bus out of service.  It won't automatically change the safety rating from the FMCSA.  Safe driving, passing drug tests, and having insurance are the other categories considered for the safety rating.  You can have a bad rating in mechanical and still get an overall satisfactory rating if the other three categories are good.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 06, 2013, 04:09:19 PM
So much for a chain being as strong as its weakest link.


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 08, 2013, 10:42:35 PM
Better late than never?

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/09/us-usa-crash-california-idUSBRE91801T20130209 (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/09/us-usa-crash-california-idUSBRE91801T20130209)


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: luvrbus on February 09, 2013, 04:05:58 AM
They will be back next week under a different name lol they will have one of the online outfits buy their permits for 400 bucks and on the road again sad but true,no experience required,safety program, nothing just money for the permits FWIW

 Van Hools are always being recalled for brake problems the ones here are always a problem but then our DOT says plastic air lines are ok 

Its frightening to me going down the road knowing all the newer stuff has plastic air line with push in fitting on a truck and trailer hauling 80,000 lbs at 75 mph DOT approved so it to be safe BS


Title: Re: Bus/Truck accident
Post by: Lin on February 09, 2013, 07:23:39 AM
Come on, what's the big deal? Isn't everyone replaceable?