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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: TexasBorderDude on October 28, 2013, 10:37:44 AM



Title: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 28, 2013, 10:37:44 AM
This past August I blew a right front tire and CoachNet sent the service truck (a great value CoachNet is).  I just didn't want to spend so much for new steer tires, so I agreed to buy an unknown (to me at least) Wanli Chinese tire at $450/copy.  I was really pissed when the DOT date was 18 mos. old, but I just swallowed hard and came the last 200 miles on in.  Well I've gotten ready to head out again and found a bubble in the sidewall of my new tire.  Couldn't find anything on the internet for Wanli but did see that Les Schwab Tires in Dallas carried Wanli passenger tires, so I called 'em.  The kid on the phone is still laughing.  He said "You know this is Dallas, Oregon... not Dallas, Texas right?"

Ok, today I got the guy I bought them from and it took him a while to find someone nearby that could get a replacement tire from Wanli.  I'll have to pay for the new tire and mounting, etc and then they'll see what kind of a refund they will allow on a 65 day old, 200 mile tire.

So I asked him what he could do about changing to Toyo or something I have confidence in.  He said if I'd drive back to Kerrville, he'd put the Toyo's on for the original difference (about $220)  Which I thought was a great deal and will head out tomorrow.

Long and short of it is although we hate to spend any more than necessary, you do get what you pay for (at most!)  Seen it here with folks trying to save money on inverters, etc.  only to find they are dealing with non-factory authorized resellers who can't provide warranty.  Kinda like these tires.  Get the best deal you can, but go with the known quantity.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: saddleup on October 28, 2013, 10:44:02 AM
And who knowes what type of oil them chinese use to make there tires...


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: luvrbus on October 28, 2013, 11:03:21 AM
Coffee told him not to buy that tire and he didn't listen ::)


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Dave5Cs on October 28, 2013, 11:31:15 AM
But ya know Doyle I saved  over 1,100.00 on that inverter and I still after all is said and done thank you to Brandon for putting it up. I think I could get it fixed for that if needed and if the issue was forced I think Magnum would come around.  :o
Now a bubble on a tire that could be life threatening if it blew and I like Toyo's also so Ya done good!... ;D

Dave5Cs


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 28, 2013, 11:58:21 AM
Clifford, when will I ever learn to listen to my better-half! ;D ;D  Hell, if I'd learned that, I might still be married


Dave,  thanks for the encouraging words.  I'm glad it worked out for you and saving money is never a bad thing!

Yep, just one front blowout at 70 is plenty for me.


Title: Re: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Dave5Cs on October 28, 2013, 02:40:33 PM
Doyle Your 70?

Dave5Cs from Galaxy S III


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 28, 2013, 03:07:54 PM
 ;D ;D Soon, but 70 mph, heart-rate 185!


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Lin on October 28, 2013, 06:05:58 PM
I did not find many reviews on Wanli commercial tires, but they seem to have been around a while.  I would be curious to find out if they have a lot of such failures or you just got lucky.  I am sure that, based on price, they must be inferior to the premium brands, they still may be okay for our use.  I bought a couple of cheaper Chinese tires a couple of years ago for drives and have not had any problem yet.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 28, 2013, 06:22:01 PM
Lin, I spent a good deal of time on Saturday googling Wanli tires.  They are a major state run Chinese outfit but apparently very little market penetration in the US.

Found this in one of the sports car forums

'Wanli makes great tires. They come on Ferrari's, AMG Mercedes, BMW's, Porsche's, and Aston Martins from the factory."

Someone had a great sense of humor.  I think the guy that sold me the tires was talked into stocking a couple by his jobber  (18 month DOT date) and hadn't had any real experience with them.  Any way it's on to Toyo and greener pastures.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: niles500 on October 28, 2013, 07:20:41 PM
Wanli is the Chinese spelling of Pirelli  ;D


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: B_K on October 29, 2013, 08:21:14 AM
Wanli have been around the US for a while and the tire guy we used to use up in Union City was pushing them for a while.
I know he pushed them for at least 2 yrs before we moved and have no idea if he still is on not that was over 3 yrs ago.

I ran a set on the drives of 1 of our buses for a while. They did fine and ran out til they were wore out w/no problems. (I didn't trust them for steer tires, but looking back on the service they gave me on the drives I suppose they'
d been fine!)
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TomC on October 29, 2013, 09:04:42 AM
As I've said before, tires are much more then big round rubber black things that rotate. The tires are what holds the bus up and more importantly, is the traction between the tire and street. Michelin makes over 50 different truck tire models for various applications. Please get the proper tire for your bus and bite the bullet and pay the premium for the best, name brand tires. Good Luck, TomC


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 29, 2013, 09:26:13 AM
(http://www.helpusanetwork.com/images/hosting/screenshot00035.jpg)

I probably would run this one on a drive or bogie... but NOT the steer.  Will get the Toyo's if I can limp back the 200 miles to get 'em changed out.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: belfert on October 29, 2013, 09:37:43 AM
As I've said before, tires are much more then big round rubber black things that rotate. The tires are what holds the bus up and more importantly, is the traction between the tire and street. Michelin makes over 50 different truck tire models for various applications. Please get the proper tire for your bus and bite the bullet and pay the premium for the best, name brand tires. Good Luck, TomC

Would you care to explain what a "proper tire" for a bus is?  To me, if I need a tire for my front axle the proper tire would be a regional (or long haul) 11R24.5 tire that is all position or steer.  If I need a tire for the drive axle I have a few more choices as I can use an all position or a drive tire and drive tires can have a few different tread patterns.

Wanli is a brand name, is it not?  It is the name of a brand just like Toyo, Goodyear, Michelin, and all the rest.  Is it a brand name I would use?  Probably not.  Goodyear has a really bad name in the ST trailer tire market and the #1 recommendation for ST trailer tires is usually Maxxis made in Thailand.

Tire problems can happen on any brand.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: twostick on October 29, 2013, 08:29:18 PM
If it was me, I would buy the best steer tire I could afford. If the budget won't go for a premium brand like a Michelin, Bridgestone or Goodyear, I would at least spring for a Firestone, Dunlop or maybe a Toyo. Drives I would have less of a problem running second string tires but any of those off/unheard of brands I would tend to stay away from. Reliability is pretty much unknown and they by and large have horrible rolling resistance numbers which means whatever you save in purchase price you will likely spend in extra fuel burnt and then some.

No such thing as cheap tires.

Kevin


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: sdc53 on October 29, 2013, 10:29:51 PM
FWIW I had a horrible experience with the Kumho garbage korean tires that came on my S&S class C from the factory.  Had a rear blowout, boy that'll get your attention.  Over the following months had to replace a couple more due to bubbling, etc - and they didn't stand by the warranty on the tires, which was complicated by the fact that when they failed, we weren't dealing with a retailer that actually sold the damn things. Not many choices when you are on the side of the road or in the boonies. They'll never get another dime from me, or hopefully anyone I know.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: wg4t50 on October 29, 2013, 11:44:24 PM
We all have choices, I have run a few brand names, Toyo, Bridgestone and Michelin, No problem with any of them, I just replaced all 6 on my coach, the michelin XZE-3+ 275/80R22.5 LRH cost thru the FMCA $531.00 + FET each, plus $435.00 for all six Road Balance, new stems and mounting.  Not cheap, but I have other things to worry about.
I learned to only use "all position" tires, once I used a lug type on the drive, within about 30,000 miles they looked like a sawtooth, very steep leading edge with the heals worn way down, guess due to a heavy foot and lots of hp, anyway I stayed with the all position type, they just wear smooth & round & quiet.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Jon on October 30, 2013, 04:37:34 AM
We all hate to pay for tires. They cost a fortune and we rarely wear them out before they age out. But one thing to consider is that if one fails, the money we saved by trying to nurse them beyond their natural life or by buying the cheapest we can find could prove to be false economy.

I cannot get the recent 8 fatality bus crash out of my mind which was attributed to a left front tire blowout. But I am also aware of at least two coaches I personally know that had substantial and expensive damage as a result in both cases of a drive or tag axle failure. The one with the drive axle failure took out the upper wheel well liner, did damage to the interior of the coach, destroyed an air bag, and a brake chamber air line. The second was a tag axle failure and it damaged the muffler, the wheel well, and did some body damage to the tune of $15,000. Tires are a big deal.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: belfert on October 30, 2013, 05:43:51 AM
I decided to buy Cooper Roadmaster RM185 tires for both steer and drives.  They are made in China, but they are at least made by a major brand.  I was thinking about Firestone FS560 Plus tires, but I was told they are made in China now too.  I found out just recently that the Firestones are still made in the USA.  I most likely would have purchased the Firestones if I knew they were still made in the USA.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: luvrbus on October 30, 2013, 06:09:34 AM
Here the Casinos buses are using Double Coin or something like that they are having good luck with the tire here in Aug the heat separates the boys from the girls I lost a new Michelin yesterday from a sidewall blow out on the van   


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: robertglines1 on October 30, 2013, 06:11:48 AM
I had a 3yr old Goodyear explode with proper air on right front-- no road hazzard.   FWIW   Still upset about that one!   So who makes what?? And what does name brand mean anymore???


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: luvrbus on October 30, 2013, 06:39:28 AM
According to all the truckers and carriers reports the new 315/80 from Goodyear is the best tire on the market for wear,handling and ride but they cost more than a Michelin with the same rating,none of the tires have a warranty worth a crap the Michelin I lost yesterday was my fault as I knew they would say lol


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 30, 2013, 06:47:08 AM
Well we all know the old saying "the buck stops here."  Well with most, it don't stop for long, just keeps going out.  But great news, we're (the over 65 crowd) gonna get $19/mo COLA from Uncle Sugar 'cause everyone knows there's been only slight inflation, yet the Firestone FS 560's I bought in '08 for $330 per copy are $545 now.  Ever so slight!


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: B_K on October 30, 2013, 12:40:01 PM
IMHO Michelin's are a waste of $.
Yes they ride smooth, but they wear out faster than any other brand tire we've EVER run!
I have run many other brands and find most of them to be pretty comparable in quality.
;D  BK  ;D


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Eagle Andy on October 30, 2013, 02:48:18 PM
Doyle I just decided to change my 10 year old tires and i found Firestones 11r 24.5 for 480.00 mounted I think there FS 507


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 30, 2013, 03:43:49 PM
Doyle I just decided to change my 10 year old tires and i found Firestones 11r 24.5 for 480.00 mounted I think there FS 507

I've got probably 10 year old FS 507's on the bogie and 6 year old FS 560's on the drives... will be looking for some Firestones as I travel about.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: pabusnut on October 31, 2013, 01:53:27 PM
Doyle,

Be thankful you aren't one of Uncle's employees w/no raise for 3 yrs, and a 3% pay cut this year due to Sequestration & Gov't shutdown!  More to come next year, since the kicked can is still rolling down the road!

Steve


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: belfert on October 31, 2013, 03:40:37 PM
I work for a private employer and didn't get a raise for 5 years with a 2% raise this year.  I am grateful I still have a job since more than 50% of the employees in my department got laid off.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: Dave5Cs on October 31, 2013, 04:12:04 PM
Yep Brian you beat me to it. They can join us in a private sector job or like me self employed. I took a 100% pay cut in 2009 and 2010 in the construction industry and still no raise!...and hope to live on the Bus again soon.

Dave5Cs


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: TexasBorderDude on October 31, 2013, 05:55:32 PM
.... I took a 100% pay cut in 2009 and 2010...

How does the math work on that one?  Man the grass is always greener and the helmet is always browner! I don't know anyone who's cutting a fat hog, as the saying goes.


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: pabusnut on November 01, 2013, 04:39:53 AM
Yes, I am thankful for employment!  Been on both sides of the fence, and each has its own green!
 ;D


Title: Re: Penny-wise and pound-foolish
Post by: belfert on November 01, 2013, 07:11:37 AM
How does the math work on that one?  Man the grass is always greener and the helmet is always browner! I don't know anyone who's cutting a fat hog, as the saying goes.

I assume he means he was unemployed in those two years.