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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: Austin on January 14, 2008, 04:22:35 PM



Title: headliner
Post by: Austin on January 14, 2008, 04:22:35 PM
I pulled my headliner down so that I can run some over head wires, but the metal is in good shape and had thought about reusing it instead of buying new already cut.  What would be a good way of covering the headliner?? vinyl??? paint I need suggestions


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: tekebird on January 14, 2008, 04:36:47 PM
padded vinyl


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: Austin on January 14, 2008, 04:41:06 PM
how did you install the padded vinyl. Did you go over exising headliner or install new ceiling?


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: Chaz on January 14, 2008, 05:16:41 PM
I also like the padded vinyl, but, Florida Cliff sent me a sample of some pretty neat stuff. Sorry, I forget what he called it but it was a pressed foam type material that looks like the old pressed tin ceilings.
  There are several designs and patinas to choose from. Very cool looking if it fits your decor. It's very light, bends and cuts VERY easy and would probably have a little bit of insulation value and sound deadening. Altho that isn't the main reason to use it. It would be EASY to work with. He got it off ebay.
  Hopefully he will check this thread or you can PM him.

  Sorry I couldn't remember the name.
     Chaz
          Wait a second... Try this:    http://cgi.ebay.com/Antique-Ceiling-Tile-ANET-Copper-Gold-or-Silver_W0QQitemZ190188768565QQihZ009QQcategoryZ37909QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: ktmossman on January 15, 2008, 12:03:53 PM
Here is their regular website:

http://antiqueceilings.com/ (http://antiqueceilings.com/)


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: cody on January 15, 2008, 12:48:07 PM
I saw the project cliff is doing at bussing 2008, he did a great job on it and the ceiling looks great, I could see where it would be very easy to work with and the end result was good.


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: buswarrior on January 15, 2008, 07:40:49 PM
The stock carpet used in the new coaches?

There's only one North American vendor, and they talk to us little people!

Met the rep a few years ago. Happy to sell to one bus owners.

Has all sorts of end runs and left overs at really good prices. Tons of patterns and colours.

Darned if I can remember the name...Prevost and MCI both use them OEM.

happy coaching!
buswarrior


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: lostagain on January 15, 2008, 11:22:27 PM
I used a hull liner meant for the inside of the hull in a boat. Looks like a short carpet. Any colour at an upholstry shop. Glued it on with a spray on 3M glue.


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: Ednj on January 16, 2008, 07:48:54 AM
http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=170.msg2159#msg2159

 ;)


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: buddydawg on January 16, 2008, 11:03:16 AM
I had originally planned to cover my existing ceiling panels with vinyl.  Recently I have been leaning towards painting them.  I am going to try a few with some tan acrylic urethane paint I have, it is semi-gloss and will buff to a nice shine.  I will post some photos when I finish one.


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: FloridaCliff on January 16, 2008, 03:12:29 PM
Heres a shot of my First Class sleeping quarters ceiling!  ;D

(http://)


Cliff


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: buddydawg on January 16, 2008, 03:22:40 PM
Sweet! I like it.  How did you do the install?


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: FloridaCliff on January 16, 2008, 03:30:49 PM
It adheres with tile mastic.

Cuts with scissors

Here's another angle:

(http://)

Cliff


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: gomer on January 16, 2008, 06:52:19 PM
cliff you are sssooo smart LOL   THat is purty and one day I Hope to catch up with you since I live close to you.
Gomer


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: Brian Diehl on January 16, 2008, 07:01:20 PM
Cliff, Thanks for the pictures and links.  The wife and I ordered their sample boards.  It will be real interesting to see how they look in person.  Great Idea!!!!!!


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: NJT5047 on January 16, 2008, 07:47:52 PM
Austin, keep in mind that Cliff's coach has a raised ceiling (a really high..like 10'?, raised ceiling ;D), which means a 'flat' interior ceiling.  You cannot properly apply his approach to your rounded ceiling, unless you have raised the roof, or lowered the ceiling and flattened it.
I've got the same problem. MC9 (identical ceiling as yours) and no headliner. 
I bought Ozite...that's the lightweight marine overhead and wall liner...1/8" carpet if you will.  Nice looking stuff.  Came from Ronthebusnut's outlet.  It's two rolls of about 60' X 120"
I've had it for 2 years...I know...lazy.  But I've been told the stuff is hard to keep clean by almost everyone that has used it.   Seems plausible.  So, the delay in installing is not without an excuse.   ;)
If your bus is unconverted, you can use padded vinyl with an automotive fabric 'headliner' look.  The vinyl is rolled onto a strip of wood every 1.5' or so.  The stick is fastened to the ceiling, and the fabric is pulled to the next stick hiding the previous.  This is a good bit of work.  The fabric isn't glued to the ceiling. Just stretched.  It looks really nice...but, I'd guess that it's really fragile too.  Looks like it would have to be pulled down to repair a tear.  Typically, this type of ceiling goes in first.  Before walls and such.  Then the walls are pushed into the headliner and it hides a lot of poor cuts.
Dave Galey's "general" conversion book shows how this is done. 
The round upper corners of your coach makes attaching anything, other than glueing material right to the aluminum panels, difficult. 
I suppose one would reinstall the trim strips where the panels butt together.  Otherwise every joint is going to be visible. 
I think a highly textured finish would work as well.  Terri doesn't think so.  It doesn't have to be soft....just look soft.   Not sure what would stick to the aluminum panels.  My ceiling panels have a thin plastic film on them.   Some adhesives may work on the film.   Not sure.  What I am sure of is that automotive vinyl roof (landau tops) adhesive is what is used on interior bus glued ceilings.  It can take the heat of the sunshine on un-AC'd buses.  Probably need to consider respiratory protection when using this sort of product.  May be hazardous to your health...may be flammable too....I dunno.   Be safe!
Post what you decide...I need some ideas too!
I'm watching this thread for ideas... ???   
Best, JR


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: JackConrad on January 17, 2008, 05:13:07 AM
  Here are a few other options from the past (circa early-mid 80s) 
  When we converted our 4106 (before the internet and Bus Conversions Magazine), we took our OEM ceiling panels to a friends cabinet shop. Using his bulk contact glue spray set-up was much cheaper than buying spray cans. We sprayed contact cement, a layer of 1/4" or 3/8" foam (can't remember which it was), another layer of contact cement and then glued white Naugahyde over the foam. The panels where then re-installed and the joints were covered with 1 1/2" x 1/4" lattice that was stained and varnished. The lattice had the be steamed before bending to match the ceiling curve near the wall.
     About this same time a friend with a 4104 applied a thin "Skip Trowel" texture using paint mixed with drywall mud. When it became discolored or dinghy from cooking, etc, he would get a few cans of flat white spray paint and re-paint it. 
     A few years ago, another friend did the ceiling in his MC-7 (which has a very open floor plan with only 2 interior divider walls) by painting the entire ceiling a flat light blue, then painting a few fluffy white clouds and a few birds. When you look at the ceiling it looks like you are looking at the sky. 
    Just a few ideas, Jack


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: Chaz on January 17, 2008, 07:24:29 AM
Excellent looking, Cliff!!!!!!! I'm glad you posted those. (by the way, when Cliff becomes famous, I have an actual piece of that ceiling!!!  ;D )
  JR,
    Why can't that be done to a rounded ceiling? I have a piece of that stuff and it bends VERY easy!! Maybe the "look" of it wouldn't be the same, but I do believe (without having actually done it) that it wouldn't be hard to do. A little contact cement and a little time holding it there and viola! Actually, it's so light that you probably won't even have to hold it.
  Hey Cliff, what do you think?
    Chaz

  p.s. Thanx again, Cliff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: H3Jim on January 17, 2008, 07:31:27 AM
Buswarrior - Please find the name and phone of the rep. I still need to do my ceilng and some other areas and I am looking at all options.  That would be a great lead.  Thanks,
Jim


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: NJT5047 on January 17, 2008, 08:16:03 AM
Excellent looking, Cliff!!!!!!! I'm glad you posted those. (by the way, when Cliff becomes famous, I have an actual piece of that ceiling!!!  ;D )
  JR,
    Why can't that be done to a rounded ceiling? I have a piece of that stuff and it bends VERY easy!! Maybe the "look" of it wouldn't be the same, but I do believe (without having actually done it) that it wouldn't be hard to do. A little contact cement and a little time holding it there and viola! Actually, it's so light that yopu probably won't even have to hold it.
  Hey Cliff, what do you think?
    Chaz

  p.s. Thanx again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cliff's going to be famous soon enough! 
The first few feet of the front and the rear 5 or 6 feet of an MC12 have compound curves.  I doubt you'd ever get the relief panels to conform.    Most of an MC12 could utilize Cliffs panel.   They may also peel off due to stress of being bent could be greater than the foams tensile strength...or something like that.  The foam may separate with heat and pop off??
If the bus had overhead cabs, the area beween the cabs would be easy to fill in with Cliff's panels.
Strictly as a scientific test, glue up a couple of the panels in a 10 or 11" radius and see how it goes.   ???   
Another idea is the textured wall paint in the 'techy' paint sections at Lowe's and Home Depot.  They are really unusual looking.  Expensive too...but not as expensive as Ozite.  Enough new Ozite will cost ($500 -$600 bucks?)  I bought two 30' remnents for about $250 shipped. 
No idea what adhesives would cost to install the stuff.   
Installing the headliner first, at least before any cabs and walls go in, would be the smart way to build a conversion.  Doing it last is a mistake...it was for me.   
While in the 'deciding' stage, oughta look at Ace's and Nick's headliners too.  Plywood substrate covered with padded vinyl.  Both look great.   Cannot describe the process.
JR
 


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: FloridaCliff on January 17, 2008, 11:07:18 AM
Guys,

The mastic is for walls and ceilings, not regular floor mastic, very tacky.  The panels get about 8 little dabs, look like little pyramids, sort of and push up, let go and it stayed.

I bent the tile to at least a 45 degree angle, just playing, without any distortion, so it should work in a curve, gluing and holding maybe the only issue.

Some of the things that I really like about this product is the ease of application, hundreds of patterns to fit your decor, can be painted (by You) to your color at a considerable savings per piece.

It can also be put up last, which allows it to be repaired (replace just a piece) if it is damaged.  Try that with a ceiling that goes behind a cabinet or wall. (one of my concerns)

Glad that some of you like it, just another alternative.  I really spent a lot of time contemplating my ceiling covering, and I am so glad I found this product, really just by doing some random searching.  (see its not wasted time, just  browsing the internet  ;D)

If anyone else tries it, I want to see your pictures!!!!!

Cliff


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: gumpy on January 17, 2008, 11:48:12 AM
Cliff,

That looks real nice. Are those the plastic panels that are available at the home center?

I found them locally at Home Depot and Menards. Some are marketed as backsplash panels. They have several different colors and patterns, but most have to be special ordered. The panel size is about 18" x 24" and are $17 each!!  Ouch!

They also had a ceiling panel which is 24" x 48", and is all white, and costs about $19 each. I also found that rustoleum makes spray paint for plastic, and they also make a spray primer for plastic, and say you can use any of their other paints on plastic if you primer it first. So... I bought some of the white plastic faux tin panels and a can of primer and a can of hammered copper paint, and when it warms up here, I'm going to spray the panels. I intend to use them in the bedroom area on both sides. I have a lowered section on each side where the air ducts are that is 24" wide. I will build a wood nose for the edge that allows the panels to slip into a slot, and I'm hoping to use velcro to hold the rest of the panel up. That way, they can be removed easily so I can get access to the duct area where wiring runs will be.

Will see how it goes, and then decide if I want to continue with it in the front of the coach.

craig



Title: Re: headliner
Post by: FloridaCliff on January 17, 2008, 12:12:19 PM
Craig,

They are actually a pressed foam.

Here's there regular link.  http://antiqueceilings.com/

So many patterns to chose from.  I am going for a themed interior of an Old Train Car, so you can see why I chose the one I did.  There web site really sparks the imagination. 

I saw the ones at HD, Lowes and they are different and much more expensive.

I am glad they were so high at the box stores, made me dig and search and I think this product is much better.

I think I paid $5.70 each.  The unpainted ones, I believe are $2.00 cheaper.

I used the plastic Rustoleom to paint my A/C vents to match, going to paint the ceiling fixture tonight.

Brian D just ordered there sample pack, so you will have to check his out.

Best of luck

Cliff



Title: Re: headliner
Post by: gumpy on January 17, 2008, 01:16:18 PM
Cliff,

What's the thickness of these tiles?

I assume they're easy to cut?  Do you just use a utility knife?

That's a pretty decent price compared to the ones I've found at HD.  Biggest problem I see is they are only 20 inches, and my side ceiling areas are 24 wide. Would end up being a lot of waste.

They have some really nice patterns.


Brian, let me know when the samples come in. I'd like to see them.

craig


Title: Re: headliner
Post by: FloridaCliff on January 17, 2008, 03:24:29 PM
Craig,

About a 1/4 max.

You can cut with scissors.

I wasn't of a fan of the 20x20 size either.

I ended up putting mine up on a 45 angle to the outside walls.

The reason is two fold.  Allowed me to adjust for the size so the smaller pieces didn't stand out and
the consumate problem with using square material, it will show anything you have not perfectly in square.

The angle fixes all that.

Plus whatever you cut off one end can finish the other side with.

I only ended up with two halves as usable scrap.

Need to order the rest so I have at least a few full pieces for any future fixes.

Cliff