Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
November 24, 2014, 12:18:04 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an Online Subscription: It will not get torn up or crushed if you back over it with your bus.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Rope lites for marker/running lites  (Read 3106 times)
jjrbus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2313

MCI5C/N Ft Myers FL




Ignore
« on: July 24, 2006, 07:22:59 PM »

 I've got a 79 MCI5C Saudi model (rumored to  be Osama's personal bus). The bus has the double, 2nd, outer roof or whatever you want to call it. Anyway the upright has 1 1/8 inch holes about every 1 3/4 inch the lenght of the bus. I was looking at the roof one day and had a thought. I decided I could far out tacky anything the sticks and stapels could do by installing rope lites inside the roof shinning out throught the holes. Looks cool, just about every hole has a lite in it. I was going to run the lites up the CB antenna, but thought it might be a bit much, tackys OK but I dont want to be garish
 Now my qestion is I used amber rope lite, would this be leagl as marker/running lites?
                                                                                                                      Work?/Play safely Jim
Logged

Remember, even at a Mensa convention someone is the dumbest person in the room!

http://photobucket.com/buspictures

http://photobucket.com/buspictures
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6899





Ignore
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2006, 09:10:07 PM »

NO!
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
John MC9
Guest

« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2006, 09:50:07 PM »

Sure! A light is a light!
 
 
Logged
Clarke Echols
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 116




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2006, 10:39:19 PM »

Sure! A light is a light!

Not so.  All marker, tail, brake, and other lights have to meet federal motor vehicle safety
standards which specify color, brightness, dispersion of light, visibility, and other factors.

A lot of truckers have a lot of marker lights along the top of their trailers (some as many as 10
or more along a 40 or 53 footer).  The rules are that only the lights at the rear are red; all
others are amber (marker, tail, clearance, etc.).

If you have the required marker/clearance lights at front, rear, and mid-ships locations, if
you were to run rope lights elsewhere, I don't know that it would be illegal, but it would
definitely be tacky. Smiley  Nothing wrong with tacky if you like being tacky.

Reminds me of the poster from the 1970s or so.  Picture of a skunk with the headline:
"Why be difficult when with a little effort you can be a real stinker."  Smiley :'D

Clarke
Logged
WEC4104
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 779





Ignore
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2006, 04:49:58 AM »

Clarke made some good points and I'd like to expand on these a little.  I think that what you will be permitted to do with your lighting hinges on the following criteria:

1) You first need to meet the regulations and start with the proper lights in the proper location. For reference, I include the following link  http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/standards/conspicuity/TBMpstr.html   (covers U.S. and Canada)  It doesn't matter what additional lighting you add, if you do not first meet the basic requirements you are illegal and unsafe. (Although my 4104 does not meet requirement #12a., never having the center marker)

2) Colors - Pay special attention to where you place colors.  Red, in particular.  Limiting red to the rear helps other drivers quickly tell from a distance which way your vehicle is facing. Same reason as boats and aircraft use green to starboard, red to port. The second reason is they only want emergency vehicles to have forward facing red lights. It prevents some yahoo with red lights on the front from cycling them on-off-on-off to simulate police/fire/ambulance vehicle.

I also seem to recall one busnut who got his hands on one of those scrolling signs like bars use to announce sports scores and other news events.  It was about three feet wide, six inches high, and could be programmed to scroll messages using red LEDs. The busnut wanted to rig it up in his destination sign location.  After checking into matters, he found the red color of the LEDs was a problem if he was putting it on the front.  If his sign had yellow LEDs, that would be a different story. I can't imagine any cop pulling you over and citing you for the incorrect light dispersion, but displaying red lights on the front of a vehicle is another story.

3) As long as it does not present a safety hazard, what you do with additional lighting is pretty much up to your own personal taste (or lack thereof).  I do seem to recall some additional restrictions regarding using lighting on vehicles for advertising signs, but do not recall the exact specifics. To paraphrase the Beach Boys:  "Tack it up, tack it up, buddy ..."
« Last Edit: July 25, 2006, 05:27:41 AM by WEC4104 » Logged

If you're going to be dumb, you gotta be tough.
DrivingMissLazy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2634




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2006, 04:55:14 AM »

Hey John, Welcome aboard. I was hoping you would join us.
Richard

Sure! A light is a light!
 
 

Logged

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
DrivingMissLazy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2634




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2006, 05:00:57 AM »

I do not know about other state laws, but in California it is illegal to put lights in the wheel wells of automobiles.
I do not recall the details, but it sure made a lot of hot rodders and low riders unhappy.
I never read the actual law, I was just told about it. LOL
Richard
Logged

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
FloridaCliff
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2458


"The Mighty GMC"




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2006, 05:21:35 AM »

I have had a little experience with the local troopers and my lighting, a good one.

Driving down the highway a trooper drives up along side me and then drifts back and forward, stares for what seemed like a minute

and sped ahead.

Ended up stopped at the same quick stop getting a drink and he offered "wondering what I was looking at?", of course I was curious

and said "Yes"

Told me he noticed the lower rear side marker lights were not lit(leds I am adding), but also that I had reflectors(factory) and that I

met the legal requirement, but might want to get them fixed.  Explained I was converting and they weren't wired yet and had a

pleasent conversation.

So again, as long as you meet the minimum requirement you are OK, as I see lots of trucks that light up the Interstate at night.

But on the other hand how much attention you want to draw is very subjective. Roll Eyes

Cliff
Logged

1975 GMC  P8M4905A-1160    North Central Florida

"There are basically two types of people. People who accomplish things, and people who claim to have accomplished things. The first group is less crowded."
Mark Twain
Beatenbo
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 275


1993 MCI 102 C3 Cat Power


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2006, 08:36:43 AM »

Little different twist.. I have regular white rope light mounted under the bottom bin rail on my coach and at nite is has a soft glow all way round the bus. Never turned on going down the road but is cool in a campsite
Logged
boogiethecat
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 634



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2006, 09:08:52 PM »

Actually I looked a little closer at the California rules a few years back, after having done my marker lights totally wrong, and found that the basic rule is (regarding marker lights),
anything behind the rear axle should be red, anything in front of it should be amber or yellow, and NO red  showing on the front of the bus anywhere.
Beyond that, it's my personal "opinion" that most anything goes. 
  I was surprised to learn about the rear axle being the line... until then I had no clue but after I read that, then started to observe every truck I ever saw, yup, that's the key...
Cheers
gary
« Last Edit: July 26, 2006, 01:06:54 AM by boogiethecat » Logged

1962 Crown
San Diego, Ca
RJ
Former Giant Greenbrier Owner
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2858





Ignore
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2006, 11:14:21 PM »


Actually I looked a little closer at the California rules a few years back, after having done my marker lights totally wrong, and found that the basic rule is, anything behind the rear axle should be red, anything in front of it should be amber or yellow, and NO red showing on the front of the bus anywhere.




Note that the rear turn signals can be amber - they don't have to be red.  And, IMHO, they should be amber - you can see them better, in all kinds of lighting situations and weather.
Logged

RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
Clarke Echols
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 116




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2006, 12:31:29 PM »

Note that the rear turn signals can be amber - they don't have to be red.  And, IMHO, they should be amber - you can see them better, in all kinds of lighting situations and weather.

Amber was standard in Europe back in the early 1960s.  It just took a long time for the US
to catch up.  Also, Europe had amber/yellow fog lights in front as mostly standard fare.

Clarke
Logged
DrivingMissLazy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2634




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2006, 04:47:31 PM »

I have been told that the amber headlights from Europe are not legal for use here in the US.
Richard


Note that the rear turn signals can be amber - they don't have to be red.  And, IMHO, they should be amber - you can see them better, in all kinds of lighting situations and weather.

Amber was standard in Europe back in the early 1960s.  It just took a long time for the US
to catch up.  Also, Europe had amber/yellow fog lights in front as mostly standard fare.

Clarke
Logged

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
RJ
Former Giant Greenbrier Owner
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2858





Ignore
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2006, 06:06:01 PM »

Richard - Clarke said amber fog  lights, not headlights. . .
Logged

RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6899





Ignore
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2006, 09:37:04 PM »

When travelling from state to state like we do, it is just best to follow the lighting requirements for commercial buses.  You'll have the least amount of problems with the law.  If you want to add lights on top of them, great, but put them on a separate switch so you can cut them off at the appropriate time.  Good Luck, TomC
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
DrivingMissLazy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2634




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2006, 05:06:03 AM »

Yes, I know. I just wanted to caution everybody that the headlights used in France, for instance, are not legal here. At least as far as I know. Be careful before you start changing type of bulbs or lights.

There are also hi intensity headlights used in Europe that are superior to what are common here, but again they are illegal here. Someone on the board, RJ maybe, mentioned using them and never getting stopped, but I personally would be very hesitant to try something like that. The liability, in case of an accident could be horrendous.
Richard

Richard - Clarke said amber fog  lights, not headlights. . .
Logged

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
RJ
Former Giant Greenbrier Owner
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2858





Ignore
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2006, 08:09:26 AM »

Yes, I've used the European-code headlights since the 1960s, and have never had any problems, including an accident.

Please understand that the E-code lamps are NOT any brighter than the US-code, matter of fact, they use the same replacement quartz-halogen bulbs (H1, H3 or H4, depending on the lamp).  Back in the '60s and '70s, they were brighter, simply because they used the q-h bulbs while the US was still stuck on incandescent.

The real difference is in the OPTICS of the lens, and the way the light output is focused.  E-codes have a very sharp cut-off to the left, reducing glare to oncoming traffic, and a sharp rise to the right, concentrating the light output way down the road.

When properly adjusted, oncoming traffic will see LESS glare than with US-code lamps.  Adjusting them is simple - all that's needed is a flat wall, being able to park 25 feet away on a level surface, a tape measure, paper to tape to the wall so you don't mark it up (unless it's your own wall and you don't care), a marking pen, and whatever tool the vehicle needs to adjust the headlights, be it a Phillips screwdriver or small socket.  No fancy gadget needed.

Originally, the reason the E-codes were illegal here in the US was because they used a separate bulb inside the light housing - in other words, they weren't "sealed beam".  That argument's gone away now, because EVERY newer vehicle on the road today is using separate bulbs.  Then they weren't legal because they didn't have the three "pips" on the outside of the lamp lens for the headlight-aiming gizmos to center themselves on, so you "couldn't adjust them properly".  Yeah, right.  Some of the worst-aimed headlamps I've ever seen had been adjusted with that stupid contraption. . .

Today, the illegality of the E-codes is questionable - my 2000 Toyota Tacoma has stock headlamps that have some of the E-code characteristics.  The idiots at the USDOT can't figure it out, let alone see their noses in front of their face, and it's obviously not a high-priority item for the bureaurats.

I was involved in an accident in February of 1970, 9:30 at night, with E-code headlights.  Guy pulled up to a stop sign, looked right, and pulled out - I was on his left, and t-boned him at 40 mph.  Guy said he "never saw me coming". . . headlight type or whether or not they were on wasn't an issue with his ambulance-chasing liar-for-hire - my insurance co. squashed that immediately due to the location of the accident and the time of day (not to mention the citation given to him by the CHP for "failure to yield").  (And, for the Looky-Lous in the audience:  He was driving a Dodge Dart sedan, I was in a 66 Corvair Corsa Turbo Convertible.  I hit him right at the front wheel / firewall - another split-second and I'd have hit the driver's door, probably killing him instantly.  As it was, he ended up with four broken ribs, a concussion, and 18 stitches to a head wound.  Didn't have his seatbelt on - he bounced around inside that car like a billiard ball.  I received two bruises on my hip bones from the seat belt, that's all.  Totalled both cars.  The Corvair's front end collapsed right up to the windshield w/o breaking it - from there back, the car was intact.  Bought it back from the ins. co at the salvage auction and parted it out to other Corvair nuts. . . End of "war story".)

I realize that several of those in the busnut community cannot take advantage of the E-codes, simply because they reside in a state that requires mandatory vehicle inspections.  Sad. . . (but it would be interesting to see if an inspector even noticed them!)

I will continue to promote the E-code headlamps for our coaches, because my feeling about them is:  What price SAFETY??

FWIW. . .
Logged

RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
Brian Diehl
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 986




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2006, 08:25:23 AM »

Russ, where is a good source for these bulbs?
Logged
DrivingMissLazy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2634




Ignore
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2006, 08:32:40 AM »

Russ, thanks for the great rundown. Now if I can just put it somewhere so that I can find it a year from now. LOL

BTW, really sorry to hear about the Corvair. Always wanted one of those turbo engines. I had seventeen  Corvair's  sitting in my back yard in California that I was using the engines to build sand buggies . Never could find a turbo though.
Richard
Logged

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
RJ
Former Giant Greenbrier Owner
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2858





Ignore
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2006, 03:42:14 PM »

Brian -  www.cibieusa.com  Not cheap, a set of four stock 5" round hi/lo & hi lamps will set you back about $250.  (What price SAFETY???)  24vdc bulbs are available too.

Richard -  Yup, the turbo's were fun. . . cruise along at 3000 rpm (65 mph), just under boost.  Punch the throttle, and by 3200 it felt like you'd just gained four extra cylinders and away you went, up until 5500, when the back pressure in the exhaust would exceed the boost produced by the turbo - sort of a built-in governor.  But boy, what a ride for those 2300 rpm!!  (Of course, a 95 hp Powerglide would outrun a turbo up to about 30 mph, as the boost really didn't start to come on until the top end of 2nd gear. . .)

BTW, the entire powertrain from the wreck was sold to a friend of my insurance agent, who promptly shoehorned it into a 912 Porsche.  Talk about a sleeper!

Nader was wrong, eh?   Cheesy

HTH. . .
Logged

RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!