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Author Topic: Modified Sine Inverters??  (Read 6357 times)
luvrbus
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« Reply #45 on: December 28, 2009, 12:41:41 PM »

Ever check the battery on a Saturn or some of the high end German made cars John they are inside the car with flooded cell batteries. 



good luck
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JohnEd
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« Reply #46 on: December 28, 2009, 08:41:28 PM »

Clifford,

That was what I said in the second paragraph of my last post.  I am sitting here with this experience of a VIOLENT explosion in my memory, having heard that "you can't do that" for many many years, and all of a sudden I remember that all of my VW's had the battery "inside" the car.  Makes me wonder what to do with my convictions and deep reservations.  I can't say that I like this particular feeling but it has always meant that I am missing some rather salient point.

For all this advice of "you have to vent the batteries" I can't recall ever hearing about a vehicle exploding from it.  And in my personal experience, if an 8D went "OFF", well, we would all have heard about it.  I give up. Tongue

Be well and happy Sir Clifford,

John
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The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato
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cody
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« Reply #47 on: December 28, 2009, 09:40:51 PM »

John, I assure you, the sky is not falling, the other shoe may be dangling but it's actually secured quite nicely by a common thread lol, (hey, I liked that one lol).  Many of the things we do may not be recommended or may actually be condemned by the federal government or could in fact result in UN sanctions being applied against us but hey, what do we care, we're bus nuts, we do things our way and damn the torpedo's, right?  I realize that some of our projects may not be quite as kosher as they could be but I'm really having a hard time picturing the results being equal to the end of civilization as we know it.  I've even carried a fuel can in my bays from time to time and my LP tanks are in the same bays as my batteries and even my inverter, do I know it's wrong? probably but my bays are all wide open, no partitions so I guess I'll risk it, do I recommend it to others? I tell others to make up their own minds. I do take the time to listen to the others that know far more than I do, then I do it my own way anyway, yes, I admit it, I'm an individual with limited computing power and very few brain cells but I'm me and nobody else, sorry about that but thats who or what I am.
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luvrbus
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« Reply #48 on: December 29, 2009, 06:19:57 AM »

Sorry John if I hurt your feeling but I have a problem understanding what you talking about sometimes make it a one liner for me and I can understand it LOL but these long and detailed posts I read about 1/2 of the post and that is a mistake on my part but I am to damn old to change .
 Fwiw John I been around the heavy stuff trucks, construction equip and buses all my life only saw one battery explode and that was my AGM Lifeline battery.

good luck my friend
« Last Edit: December 29, 2009, 06:33:05 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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Barn Owl
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« Reply #49 on: January 02, 2010, 10:59:26 PM »

Quote
Barnowl,
Does your inverter have a (hardwire) connections on the inverter?  do you have a photo if not how you choose to hook it up for use?  I thought of using a smaller full sine wave also for the fussy appliances, oh heck this can drive you nuts.  It is just difficult to set up and be as efficient as Sean is even though you want to be.
Gary

Gary,

No hardwire, I Put a 12v power outlet in a overhead compartment where I was going to hide the inverter. My children piled so much stuff on it that it would overheat and shut down so I moved it (while on my trip) to behind the TV. It is a very inexpensive 400w inverter I purchased at Sam's Club many years ago before I bought my bus. It will run a VISO 19" flat screen and a DVD player just fine and maybe charge a cell phone or ipod at the same time, but it likes lots of cool air. It also runs a macbook laptop computer without any problems. I delayed posting in hopes of getting to the bus for a photo but never made it. Nothing to see really. I don't know if it is a modified sine or square wave, but at $30, I know it's not a true sine wave LOL! I see many fretting over what to do about these things but it is a non-issue for me, because I don't have the coin for the good stuff, and have found that I get by just fine with the "junk". When I need to run the microwave I just turn on the generator. I don't FT so I cannot justify the cost of a big inverter system. I can buy lots of gen fuel for that cost, and my genny needs a good run once in a while anyways.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2010, 11:09:11 PM by Barn Owl » Logged

L. Christley - W3EYE Amateur Extra
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Barn Owl
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« Reply #50 on: January 02, 2010, 11:04:59 PM »

I need to add that I use a power strip plugged into the inverter because the inverter only has two receptacle holes. It save me the hassle of plugging/unplugging everything.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2010, 11:08:01 PM by Barn Owl » Logged

L. Christley - W3EYE Amateur Extra
Blue Ridge Mountains, S.W. Virginia
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JohnEd
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« Reply #51 on: January 02, 2010, 11:25:41 PM »

Clifford,

Now that hurts

Sorry John if I hurt your feeling

make it a one liner for me and I can understand it

Brevity isn't my long suit but if com is at stake I will even translate it to Spanoish.  Sorta.

I am to damn old to change .

Don't do that, Cliffy....Don't change.

that was my AGM Lifeline battery.

AND THAT MAKES MY POINT  The AGM aren't supposed to vent.

good luck my friend

Count on that....even if you have a short attention span...errrr... I mean ahhhh  aw crap! Grin Grin Grin Kiss

I can't figure it out.  That has always been such an inflexible rule "double vent and separate".  Maybe it is because that "once" can kill or blind you.  I am slightly exasperated.

Don't install a battery under the head of your bed.

John.....most probably.
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"An uneducated vote is a treasonous act more damaging than any treachery of the battlefield.
The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato
“We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.”
—Pla
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« Reply #52 on: January 03, 2010, 07:01:39 PM »

John, all batteries present a risk if they store sufficient power. The different types just present different kinds and levels of risk. I wouldn't recommend putting any spark source in a battery compartment because if one does vent, the gases are explosive and corrosive. I think any of them would be dangerous if the charging system ran away.

Making sure the battery compartment is vented is probably the most common way of avoiding damage in most equipment. I also think that most of the electronics in these inverters is sealed, but they often use relays in their transfer systems.

On our boat, each of the alternators is equipped with an over voltage cutout that will prevent cooking of the batteries if the charging system runs away. Sometimes, these things just happen.

For what it's worth.

Tom Caffrey
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Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
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JohnEd
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« Reply #53 on: January 03, 2010, 08:45:44 PM »

Tom,

Always serious value in your posts to me.  Thanks for the info.

Admittedly my 453 Marine is not modern state of the art.....its guts are not sealed in any way and the circuit boards are not conformal coated.  I can imagine anyones little heart going pitty pat if their inverter went on the fritz and they removed the case to find the thing is "growing" inside.

In thinking about this, batteries exploding, I seem to recall in the dim past comments about the internals of a bat coming loose and sparking.  That was one scenario for them exploding.  Another was lifting the positive post connection "first" though that never made sense to me I do it their way.  Lastly it was a spark in the immediate environment/ proximity of the bat while charging or discharging.  So from that it would seem that those VIOLENT and destructive explosions were the result of that small space on top of the cells filling with H and O and getting a spark.  If that is true, and I am not certain, then a baggage compartment filled with that mix would blow the bus in half, I can easily imagine.

My bat enclosure in the elder Winnie has a rear wall that is open to the underside of the coach so this Little Feller ain't a'skert.  I think this subject is very serious though and new Knuts need an emphatic warning.  And that's coming from the guy that has the indelible rep for cutting corners.

Thank you very much, Tom.
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"An uneducated vote is a treasonous act more damaging than any treachery of the battlefield.
The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." Plato
“We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.”
—Pla
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