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Author Topic: Pictures of the blower and the broken impeller blade from my turbo  (Read 4163 times)
RickB
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« on: January 09, 2010, 03:40:45 PM »

Hey everyone,

Pulled the turbo and manifold and got a good look at the blower today. Also pulled the valve covers evrything looked great in the heads, still wet with oil, no rust, the rack rod wasn't frozen. Happy. Used a breaker bar on the crankshaft bolt and the motor is not froze up.

Here's the part that concerned me. The blower vanes had oil on them, no major nicks, didn't turn the motor enough to see them entirely. But here is the main issue, there was caked oil on the manifold but none in the intake tube from the turbo but the actual top of the blower had alot of built up sludge that I am hoping does not have dirt in it. When we pulled the motor the large diameter rubber intake hose just kind of came apart as we tried to take it off it was definitely dry rotted so if that thing was like that when the motor ran there is a good chance it sucked alot of dust directly into the intake. So, judging from the pix are the more experienced among us willing to comment? Is that kind of buildup normal for bad blower seals. The turbo didn't seem like it had dumped a bunch because the rubber intake was clean

There are also a couple pictures of the broken impeller blade. I saw know evidence that the piece went through the blower but I didn't see all side os the blower vanes.









Thanks for the help I really appreciate it.

Rick







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luvrbus
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« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2010, 03:48:05 PM »

don't look good Rick pull the blower and look at the after cooler then pull the aftercooler and take a look  inside the air box not looking good for you sorry to say

good luck
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RickB
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« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2010, 03:52:39 PM »

Clifford,

not looking good like inframe kit or not looking good junk? I always knew that it may need to be rebuilt but is there more to this than a rebuild?
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luvrbus
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« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2010, 04:32:39 PM »

Rick, you may not even have dirt on the other side.
I hope that is just build up from setting, as long as the crank and heads are ok a inframe will do good but I always replace the blower even on a inframe.


good luck
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RickB
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« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2010, 04:46:09 PM »

Clifford

I had kinda hoped that this thing would be a turnkey but I had a hunch when we got to N.C. to pull it that this motor was gonna need some work and $ it is safe to say I had my doubts.

I got it reasonable enough that even with an inframe kit, blower, and turbo  I still think it's a good deal. I am also considering having the heads gone through as well. It would be so nice to rest easy knowing that everything that needs replacing is replaced.

BTW I am interested in those parts we discussed in last weeks posts how do we proceed?

Let me know and thanks for your guidance and help Clifford you are so valuable to this board my friend...

Rick
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hargreaves
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« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2010, 04:52:50 PM »

Wow It's a wonder it still ran. The turbo with the broken blades would take out the turbo bushings pretty quick. It looks like its been sucking dirt and what have you in for a while. I bet if you take the blower off the intercooler is almost plugged. Definite overhaul material. OUCH!! One good thing is the cranks are tough.

Good luck, you'll need it.   Gerry
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BUR
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« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2010, 05:17:09 PM »

      Rick   My engine let me down on a trip a year and a half ago. It was a stressful time, I knew it would happen at some point but there is never a good a time. So I bit the bullet an had half of the engine rebuilt in Salt Lake, brought in home and had the other half bebuilt (time constrands of the trip). I wasn't happy about how much money it cost me, but I am very glad i had it bebuilt, I can drive down the road now and not worry about when it will leave on the side of the road in God forsaken place. (not saying that Murphy won't strike) So keep your chin up and enjoy after the rebuild.     Happy Bus'n   Bur
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RickB
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« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2010, 10:20:50 AM »

Good morning all,

Is there any chance that the residue on the top of my blower is coked oil without dirt?? Haveany of you ever encountered anything that looked like this that wasn't dirt?

Don and Tom C I would appreciate your input on this. Just trying to get to the bottom of what this stuff is that's on the top of my blower.

Thanks in advance,

Rick
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gumpy
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« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2010, 10:33:08 AM »

Did you say the air cleaner on the donor truck was oil bath?
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« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2010, 11:11:53 AM »

Rick, that engine has never ran with the build up on the rotors the clearance is so close that a business card will lock one up off the engine.   


good luck
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RickB
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« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2010, 11:49:34 AM »

Gumpy,

It had a dry element filter that looks almost new. I am not real sure what the remote mounted assembly was the motor has a spin on oil filter and it could have been an extra oil filter.

Clifford, I was able to turn the motor over with a beaker bar and the rotors of the blower turned when I did that so they don't appear to be locked up.

The gunk you see on them in the pictures is more like a stain than actual buildup I couldn't even feel it when I touched the rotors.

The reason this is troubling me is that although in all likelihood there was a tear in the intake 90 degree rubber intake elbow that allowed dirt to come into contact with oil (and if that's the case I'll order a inframe kit) but I remember seeing deposits like these  inside the valve covers of gas engines more than once in my younger days. There was certainly no opportunity for dirt to enter those valve covers and my assumption was that this must just be a by product of oil that has been heated and cooled over years and it became what we might refer to as oil sludge. Couple that with a few years sitting around in the heat of summer I am questioning whether or not it could just be crusty dried up oil. Not a dirt and oil combination, that's why input from someone who has seen this condition before would be so helpful, that doesn't mean I'm not grateful for the advice I'm getting, I am.

I am hoping my mechanic will say yeah we've seen this before and here's what we know this crusty brown stuff is.

I can't really lose either way because I bought the motor at such a reasonable price.

Rick




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« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2010, 04:17:00 PM »

Rick;

How many documented miles are on this engine.   IF you had a tear in the intake boot you would pull all sorts of dirt and debris into the turbo/blower and engine.    It doesn't take much to "dust" your engine..   The damage to your compressor wheel was very recent.    You have been pushing thru the front compressor side seal for awhile.   The brown staining tells us that.

Pull a head off and do some inspecting.   Head gasket kits are cheap.   Allows you to pull vacuum on your valves and check your coppers.

It would be sad to do all the work of installing it to have to take it back out, or worse...
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RickB
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« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2010, 04:54:57 PM »

Zeroclearance,

Thanks for the input the truck had 66K on it. Does it matter that the turbo spins perfectly?

Also, are you saying that the staining could have been caused by oil without debris/dirt Huh The oil on the inside of the blower intake/turbo mount seems to have come from the blower vanes up as the actual inside of the intake manifold was quite clean from the turbo to the last part of the manifold. That was why I leaned towards blower seals and away from turbo seals. It just eludes me why the turbo inlet isn't dirtier if the intake boot was allowing unfiltered air into the motor.

Whether or not coked sludge is capable of looking like these pictures without dirt/contamination seems to be the 5-10 thousand dollar question. LOL! I have spent too much time today researching different types of sludge and their respective causes and it still seems a toss up. Some oil sludge buildup is caused by water mixing with oil, some from idling too long, some from operating too hot, some from too cold, some with dirt and some with antifreeze. Kind of a brain freeze for me...

What kind of charge for a rebuilt turbo? Anyplace you recommend?

I am planning on pulling the blower over the next week but I can't do it until I can get the motor pressure washed there's too much caked on junk on the motor to risk contaminating it even more than it possibly is now. Isn't it funny that everyone on ebay always takes a picture of the parts that aren't caked with greasy junk? I certainly didn't expect this motor to be as dirty as it is. Dump truck/ heavy equipment folks don't seem to mind that stuff as much as bus nuts do.

zero, why did you ask about the mileage?  Also, what are the black circular marks on the intake housing of the compressor side?

Thanks for your help... I appreciate it

Rick
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Don Fairchild
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« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2010, 03:33:27 PM »

Rick;

Sorry but that thing looks dusted out to me. You need to change the compressor wheel.

You say you are going to rebuild it so pull the heads drop pan and remove the kits. Have the head pressure tested and rebuilt. Put it new kits and main and rod bearings with new thrusts as well as new relief and regulator valves. Have the water pump rebuilt. If it were mine I would pull the flywheel housing and go all the way to the block. it is far less expensive to change gaskets now and stop oil leaks as apposed to after it is installed in the bus.

If you need any thing else call me 88847three three626

Don
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DaveG
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« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2010, 04:36:00 PM »

Well Rick, you have the best in the business on it now. Thanks Don for you input and offer to help.
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