Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
July 26, 2014, 12:15:52 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an E-Mag Subscription: It will not turn yellow, get musty, dusty, and mildewed or fade.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Kitchen/Bathroom design questions  (Read 3303 times)
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« on: January 31, 2010, 08:51:34 PM »

My side aisle design isn't working out so hot.  By the time I install a kitchen it will be hard to move around and get to the side aisle to walk to the rear.  I want to go to a center aisle design.  I have almost exactly 96" inside width to play with.  My thoughts are to install cabinets and a countertop that will project out about 22" from one side.  My aisle will be at least 30" wide which leaves me with 44" for a bathroom.  This is almost too wide, but it might mean I can place the toilet perpendicular to the outside wall to save space.

My main issue is placement of the toilet.  I only have about 30" I can move the toilet back and forth to keep it over the black tank.  I am going to have to keep tweaking to see if I can make it work.  I don't want to have a shower that dumps right into the hallway as I travel with friends and we aren't quite that friendly.

Any thoughts on if I am heading in the right direction with my design thoughts?
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
cody
Guest

« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2010, 09:12:18 PM »

Just as a thought, the design I went with is a center isle with a 22 inch array of cabinets on the curb side, the road side has the bathroom and has an inside dimension of 37 inches by 7 ft, at the bedroom end I put a 36 inch tub/shower module from Bontragers, the tub was 25 bucks (be careful of which end drain a person wants), the shower surround was 35, and I opted for a fold up shower seat, that cost 20 bucks, all at bontragers, the tub/shower takes up 24 inches of the 7 ft allowable, at the other end of the bathroom I placed the toilet, with the back to the bathroom/kitchen partition wall (facing the shower), in the middle of the bathroom on the outside wall I put a vanity, the design allows for the door to be in the center, immediately to the right is the toilet, to the left is the shower and straight ahead is the sink and mirror.  The drawback is the tub drain comes into the wheelwell and has a 90 degree fitting directly below the floor, the sink drains into the same line and goes thru a hole cut into the back compartment to the tanks, the toilet is just far enough forward so the drop is into a 30 degree bend and short straight line and then another 30 degree bend and straight into the black tank.  The rough measurements I used were behind the drivers seat, 10 ft of living room, then 8 ft of kitchen, then 7 ft of bathroom, then 9 ft of bedroom.  Our iggle is a 96 inch wide bus and we have roughly 92 inches to play with inside.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2010, 09:16:56 PM by cody » Logged
Ericbsc
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 489


73 05


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2010, 02:49:52 AM »

I looked at a side isle. Great for privacy, but a lot of unusable space for me. I went with an off set center isle. Kit. cabinets on one side with private toilet area behind it with the shower on the other side. A little more plumbing but I like it.
Logged
robertglines1
steam nut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3969





Ignore
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2010, 04:50:42 AM »

the walk tru bath has worked good for us with pocket doors on each end...Our next coach is going with a butt hutt but we are 102 wide and 45 ft long(just starting it)we use showers with radius doors ,makes location easier..good luck!
Logged

Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2010, 05:44:49 AM »

The walk though bath works good for a family or a couple.  My last few trips I have had nine friends all on the bus at once.  I'm not sure if it would work with that many people who aren't family.

I have lots of great ideas if I could put the toilet anywhere I wanted.  Unfortunately, I can only put the tanks in one bay on the curb side.  That bay is closer to the front of the bus.  The rest of the area is over the fuel tank and the rear axles.

I'm thinking if I made the bathroom 42" or so wide I could put in a 42" shower base.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
James77MCI8
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 338





Ignore
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2010, 06:21:01 AM »

Have you given thought to making the base cabinets 20" wide instead of 22" The extra 2 " makes a big difference.
Logged

77 MCI 8
8V-71 4 spd
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2010, 06:34:40 AM »

Have you given thought to making the base cabinets 20" wide instead of 22" The extra 2 " makes a big difference.

I think the cabinets will actually be 21" wide.  The countertop will be 22".  I can get laminate postformed countertops in that size.  I want to spend the money for solid surface I can get basically any size I want.

Wouldn't a 30" aisle be plenty?  Of course, it could be narrow during cooking.  I don't expect the kitchen will get used much.  It may not even have a cooktop, but just a microwave.  Everything gets cooked outside.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2010, 06:36:14 AM by belfert » Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
Christyhicks
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 544


1991 Beaver Prevost LeMirage XL




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2010, 07:22:27 AM »

If you do a walk-through bathroom, the only thing you need to worry about is your doorways, and with pocket doors or swing doors that stay open except when needed to be closed, you can get by with 24" wide openings.  On BigBus, I was going to do 18" deep cabinets on the curb side, with the lav in the center, and storage on either side, driver's side would have a longer shower protruding closer to the center of the bus, with the toilet next to and basically parallel with the shower.  The back of the toilet was against the outside wall, with the front slightly turned toward the shower, like they did in TempBus.  By turning the toilet just slightly, I would have had the corner space behind it for more openess, yet I would have plenty of room to step into the shower. 

This is slightly different than the setup in TempBus, which had the lav next to the toilet on driver's side, and the shower and storage across from it curb side.  Because the shower was small and basically parallel with the curb, we had an issue with head room for Larry, who is 6'1".  It wasn't a big issue, but I knew I wanted a taller space in BigBus. One advantage of putting the lav on one wall and shower/toilet on the other, with the aisle in the center, is that when you bend over to wash your face or shave, you're not slamming your rear end into anything.  I also wanted a larger shower, and we didn't do a roof raise, so the design was going to allow Larry to be standing at the tallest portion of the bus when showering.

I don't see where a walk-through bathroom has any more limitations when people stay with you than a side aisle.  Sure, when someone is actually USING the bathroom, you would be limited from exiting the rear bedroom, but with a little communication, I don't see that being a big issue.  A walk-through bathroom just gives you SO much more usable space inside the bathroom as the hallway is actually also bathroom space.  With a side aisle, the hallway is only a hallway, not usuable for anything else.. . .IMHO.  Christy Hicks
Logged

If chased by a bear, you don't need to run faster than the bear, just faster than your companion!
Lin
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4528

1965 MC-5a




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2010, 08:08:49 AM »

I have wondered if a modified walk-through bath would work.  The problem with a side aisle is that the aisle is dedicated space.  In a walk-through bathroom, the aisle doubles as bathroom space.  My thought was to have the walk-through set up with the toilet and sink on one side and the shower and draws/cabinets/closet/washer on the other, but have some sort of door arrangement, maybe sliding or french, that could be used to isolate that toilet/sink area as a separate room if the use required it.
Logged

You don't have to believe everything you think.
Christyhicks
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 544


1991 Beaver Prevost LeMirage XL




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2010, 08:26:33 AM »

Not that my ideas count so much more anymore, since we bought "The Beav", but what I was planning was the stool and shower compartment would have a door that either closed off that compartment or swung across the hallway to meet the cabinet on the other side, effectively giving you two options. . . the entire bathroom to yourself, or privacy in the stool area. . .the other door by the bedroom would swing across and meet the wall also, so if you were using the entire bathroom, you kept the privacy and the heat and humidity in the bathroom, not in the bedroom.  Christy
Logged

If chased by a bear, you don't need to run faster than the bear, just faster than your companion!
luvrbus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 12070




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2010, 08:35:16 AM »

We  have had both the side isle and walk through I like the side isle better but the wife likes the walk through.
One good thing about a side isle you can have more cabinet space and a walk inn closet on the back side.
FWIW I know if I ever built another she would have a walk through looks more open to her and that is all it does looks more open draw it out you don't gain anymore space a walkway is a walkway either on the side or the middle.


good luck
Logged

Live each day like it was your last,one day it will be
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2010, 08:48:53 AM »

With 8 bunks in the rear and everyone's gear back there, there is a lot of traffic back and forth.  There is also the issue of the toilet getting used a lot with 9 folks on board.  A walk through may not work.

I still have a lot of thinking to do on the design and a walk through might still be doable.  My original thought was a seperate compartment for the toilet, but it looks like location of the tanks may not make that feasible.

Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2010, 08:58:28 AM »

My rear bedroom has eight bunks and is close to 14 feet in total length.  For me, a side aisle doesn't really add any room for anything extra compared to a bus with a smaller rear bedroom.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
Tom Y
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 880


80 5C With Cummins L10 in Progress




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2010, 09:17:53 AM »

Brian, why not put the shower and crapper in one room? Do you really need a 42" shower? I put a 32 or 36" in mine and it seems big to me.  Tom Y
Logged

Tom Yaegle
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2010, 10:01:28 AM »

Brian, why not put the shower and crapper in one room? Do you really need a 42" shower? I put a 32 or 36" in mine and it seems big to me.  Tom Y

36" would probably be the ideal size, but in order to turn the toilet 90 degrees to be perpendicular to the side wall I need about 40 to 42" to make the toilet comfortable.

I figured why not do a 42" shower for plenty of room then.  The six inches I save by going with 36" is not going to be usable for much of anything.  A 32" stall is just small.  I stood in one at the store over the weekend.

Fixed my horrible typing
« Last Edit: February 01, 2010, 02:18:00 PM by belfert » Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
PCC
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 495


Serving Those Who Have Served


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2010, 02:12:24 PM »

A 32" stall is just small.  I stood in one at teh sotre over the weekend.

My daughter once tried testing a commode in a plumbing store. I was able to stop her, before she fully tested it !!  LOL  (She was only 2 years old!!)
Logged

For some, patience is a virtue.
Dealing with me, it is required.
Thank God - He is always patient.
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6674





Ignore
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2010, 02:57:13 PM »

I also have about 97" to play with interior wise.  On my transit, because of the rear door, I built the bathroom on the right side around the rear door so that there is direct access into the bathroom from the outside-nice when you're sandy or muddy, or just plainly outside and want to use the bathroom and not get cleaned up.  My kitchen is on the left side and is 24" wide, continuing back to the refer, washer dryer, and hanging closet-all still 24 inches wide.  Then a 24" wide hallway (it is wide enough-since it is unused space-I'm 6'3" and 310lbs-and it is enough room).  My bathroom is 47" wide and 50" long with a 36" x 36" shower stall behind with 10" wide linen closet against the wall.  Besides the exterior entrance, I have an entrance from the hallway to the bathroom, and another door directly from the hallway to the shower stall.  We like this arrangement so much, we are repeating it on the truck, sans the exterior door and sans the shower door.
Don't be afraid to offset your toilet from your black tank.  My black tank runs down the center of the bus and the toilet is offset from the tank by 3ft.  Have NEVER had a problem with any backup, and with 45 gal capacity, can easily go a week before dumping (with the two of us).  Good Luck, TomC
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2010, 04:04:33 PM »

I think I'm going to look at bus pictures here and on Ebay to see how others did things.  I may also look at pictures of older motorhomes without slides on Ebay for ideas.

I do have an issue of not being able to offset the center aisle too much.  I already have a 30" wide aisle in the back bunk room that is centered.  I think I can link a slightly off center aisle to the centered aisle without too much issue.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
Jerry32
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 726





Ignore
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2010, 04:35:34 PM »

I built the side isle and like it very much as you have pass thru with someone using the batha area. Jerry
Logged

1988 MCI 102A3 8V92TA 740
niles500
Niles500
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1184


ROSIE




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2010, 01:05:39 AM »

Brian - Could you post a rough floor plan of your bus as it now exists - I have many solutions but am confused as to which one to give you - please show your holding tank locations also - thanks
Logged

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")  

- Niles
Ace
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1148





Ignore
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2010, 11:15:19 AM »

Brian I made our bath with a center door at the front and a side door at the rear! Gives you a walk thru and privacy in the Br without closing the Br off. I used a large neo-angle shower and you walk around it to get to Br door. The toilet and vanity is on the opposite side of the shower which is on the drivers side! This also gives you plenty of dressing area after showering! I used a pocket door at front and swing door at rear to Br that either closes off Br which we hardly use or the closet next to shower! Again, its sort of a center and side walk thru configuration! Your ideas are endless regardless of your tank placement! Just means extra plumbing and planning!
Logged

Ace Rossi
Lakeland, Fl. 33810
Prevost H3-40
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2010, 12:05:39 PM »

Brian - Could you post a rough floor plan of your bus as it now exists - I have many solutions but am confused as to which one to give you - please show your holding tank locations also - thanks

It will probably take me a few days to get something drawn up and then figure out how to make it small enough to post.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: February 02, 2010, 02:52:01 PM »

I spent some time looking at floor plans at pplmotorhomes.com.  Boy, I have to wonder if I am making my bathroom too large after looking at a lot of the floor plans there.  I already reduced the size of my bathroom once because it was way too big the first time around.  Some of the bathrooms on these floor plans do seem almost claustrophobic, but I guess it leaves room for the rest of the motorhome to be larger.

Now, a good reason to build your own bus conversion is to be able to build a larger bathroom if one wants to.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6674





Ignore
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2010, 07:57:10 AM »

The total time you spend in the bathroom is less then an hour a day.  Make it big enough that you're not banging into all sorts of stuff, you have enough space at the toilet to comfortably do paper work, and not to make it so big as to be able to dance in it (unless that's what you want!?).  With the separate shower stall in an enclosed bath, two can use the bathroom at once.  I personally don't like the walk through since it blocks off the back of the bus while someone is using it.  But-that's why we're building our own.  Good Luck, TomC
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2010, 09:02:39 AM »

Even with 9 people on the bus we've gotten by so far with a regular bathroom with toilet, shower, and sink all in the same room.  I'm inclined to leave it that way in large part because I want the toilet to drop straight into the tank.

I am still doing some creative thinking and am playing around with designs that include possibly placing the toilet diagonally into the corner.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
gus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3487





Ignore
« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2010, 02:19:29 PM »

You don't have to place a toilet directly over the tank. This is a myth.

My commode is on the opposite side of the bus from the tank (one tank only). The sewer pipe passes forward into the next bay, then across that bay back into the rearward bay and then into the tank!! It has very little slope anywhere!! And there are two 90* Ls in the line??

This toilet sewer pipe is about 12' long and is also connected to the kitchen sink and shower!!

 According to everything I've read on the forums this won't work, but it does, even on an opposite slanted parking spot??

This thing defies all common sense. It was on the bus when I bought it but works fine.

The only thing I can figure that makes it work is that we always use plenty of water to flush.

Long may even be better because you aren't exposed to the whole black tank every time the toilet flapper opens. Since my sewer pipe goes into the bottom of my tank the only surface area my toilet sees is whatever is in the drain pipe.
Logged

PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2010, 03:10:29 PM »

I guess I don't want to use lots of water to flush.  I have enough problems with my tank filling up as it is.

I know we shouldn't emulate everything RV makers do, but I figure they have good reasons to put the toilet over or very close to the tank.  For the moment I am going to stick with the toilet over or near the tank unless I really can't come up with a good design that way.  I looked at macerating or air toilets, but they seem a bit expensive for my budget.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
Sunchaser Art
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9





Ignore
« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2010, 10:44:17 PM »

When we were building our Eagle, I had a similar problem. . .I was about two feet too far behind the tank.  After much head scratching, I finally went with the electric macerator toilet.  It's a buck or two, but it helped the design flow so it was worth it.  Take a look at the attached website:  
http://www.webcove.com/eagle/log/2008-04-08.htm

The marine toilet is supposed to be good for a 20' horizontal run with an 8' lift if need be, so my two foot run to the wall isn't a problem.  Not sure if that's what you're looking for in a design, but I guess any idea is okay for head scratching.

Good luck,

Art
www.webcove.com/eagle
« Last Edit: February 03, 2010, 10:49:23 PM by Sunchaser Art » Logged
kyle4501
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3122


PD4501 South Carolina




Ignore
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2010, 01:03:32 PM »

With a walk thru bathroom, you severely limit access past the bathroom when it is occupied. Sad  Not so good with 9 on board.

If I were planing for 9 people, I'd split the bathroom - a toilet & sink in one room & the shower/ dressing area in a separate room. This way one doesn't have to 'hold it' if someone is taking a shower.
With a side aisle, the shower can be against the outside wall & the space towards the center can be the dressing area.
Maybe the toilet can also be against the outside wall & the sink squeezed in where it fits best.

I've seen old pictures of sinks that fold down from the wall over the toilet - that'd save some space!  Cool

With the toilet dropping straight into the black tank, you can reduce water usage to less than a pint per flush.
Some use a trash can with a pedal operated lid to dispose of the paper instead of putting it in the black tank. The advantages are numerous, including less trouble with buildup in the tank, less water needed per flush since you don't have to rinse the paper down, less problems with the toilet valve since there is no paper to stick in the seal. . . .

Logged

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (R.M. Nixon)
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5391




Ignore
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2010, 02:05:05 PM »

The shower doesn't get used too often because of limited water resources.  The bus only has 105 gallons of fresh water and 105 gallons of holding tank.  While at an event we try to use the portapotties provided to reduce the tank load.

I haven't given up completely on the idea of a seperate toilet room, but not entirely sure I can make it work.  If I could move the toilet 18 to 24 inches over it would be fine.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
gus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3487





Ignore
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2010, 03:20:47 PM »

I'm not saying don't put your toilet over the tank, I'm saying that if you do it won't be any problem. I have no idea why the PO placed my toilet so far from the tank? He did a bunch of other pretty puzzling things also, but if you do a conversion you can do it any way you want I guess? It is obviously cheaper and easier to put it right over the tank, saves a bunch of plumbing. There was plenty of space to place it over the tank?

The one thing I do like about it is having the toilet drain go into the bottom of the tank and exposing the toilet flapper opening to much less waste surface area.

Water usage is not a big problem for us because we seldom dry camp, we mostly travel, which calls for a much different layout. With reasonable water use we usually go 3-4 days before having to dump.
Logged

PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!