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Author Topic: 12 volt items in bus  (Read 2114 times)
Ace
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« on: August 04, 2006, 06:01:25 PM »

I'm trying to find someone that can supply me with a complete list of what I need to have my 12 volt items in the bus working. The items I have are as follows:

 One Shur-flo 12 volt water pump

 One 12 volt remote control satellite finder

 Ten  2 inch round 12 volt puck lites

That's it!

Nothing else at this time and I don't foresee any other items in the near future!

I have a Heart  5500 watt inverterwith charger hooked to 6 golf cart batteries and a Wrico 12.5 kw diesel generator. All of the house systems are working without any problems.

Can someone PLEASE provide me with an item list from start to finish? Running 12 volt wiring is not a problem at this time if need be! I want to do it the safest and easiest way to get this coach done. It's just about all I'm lacking to finishing it up except of course some of the frontal area over the driver.

Thanks and remember... the easiest way is best for us so don't get all brainy with technical jargon because Susan will be doing all of this!

Ace
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Ace
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« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2006, 05:27:14 PM »

Ok guys, is it ME or is it nobody really has a clue as to what I need to get this job done?

I'm sure all of you have a 12 volt system in your bus and I'm sure you all are very proud of it as you are the rest of your work so what gives? Is this a simple thing or is it that complicated that nobody knows how to explain it?

It's been two days since posting my question/s  and I'm still waiting for a good safe way to do this.

Maybe you guys just don't want me to finish my bus! Ah yes that's it! Smiley

Ace

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JimC
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« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2006, 07:12:54 PM »

OK Ace,
Before I buttoned it up I would leave as many extra wires as you can fit in the space from the engine compartment or closet area in the back to the front.
You may want to use LED lights in the future as they are coming down in price, and use much less juice than your puck lights, and give off no heat. I fthe wires are in place it will save tearing it all out.
You will want to leave a set of wires over both windshields for future fans if you find its warm driving, or just to blow air onto a fogged up window.
More wires, switches, and or relays  for stereo, CB Radio, fog lights, back up lights, jake brakes, patio lights, step lights, back up camera
While you are at it, and before closing up the electric panel, I would run some of the plastic conduit from somewhere in the compartment to a couple of the bays, and one to under the drivers seat area, for future add ons. YOu can plug these off to keep critters out if you dont use them, but you will play heck putting them in later after all is closed up.
It dosnt matter what you plan for, you will need more than that anyway!
Good luck
JimC 4106
Wisconsin
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Ross
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« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2006, 07:23:53 PM »

I'd run a decent sized cable to a 12V buss bar then pull power to your 12V breakers from the buss bar.  Fuse that cable at the battery end.  If you're making a panel, add some extra breakers.  I added 8 extras thinking I'd never use them.  I now only have two unused.  I have puck lights throughout the bus, fantastic fans, stereo, satelite radio, Power drivers seat, flat screen TV in bedroom, 12V power points (cig lighter receptacles) front and back for accessories, water pump, demand water heater igniter, fridge, bay lights, closet lights, toad light relay box....I think that's about it.   Had a power step but destroyed it the other day pulling out of the driveway.   

Ross
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Ace
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« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2006, 07:42:33 PM »

Thanks Jim and Ross but Istill think you missed my question. I can run wires to wherever from wherever. That's not an issue at this time. The main issue is WHAT the heck do I need as in specific items, such as wire, switches, breakers, panels, fuses, batteries, cables, etc.? Then what hooks up to what such as does any of THIS 12 volt stuff tie into my existing house system and or golf cart batteries? Does any of THIS 12 volt stuff tie into the generator? Do I need a seperate bank of batteries JUST for 12 volt?

I am totally lost on the EXACT items I need to get started! Once I get the basic items installed and up and running I can go from there!

Ace
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Devin & Amy
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« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2006, 09:19:35 PM »

Hi Ace,

I just redid my 12v. I used 10g speaker wire to 3 junction box locations. one in rear, amidships, and forward. The junction blocks were picked up in a stereo shop along with the speaker wire. I also bought a fused main block that I put right next to two 8D batteries where I started the 10g runs. From the junction blocks I ran 12g speaker wire to the lights and appliances(pump, water heater, furnace, exhaust fan) with a dedicated circuit for each appliance and two lights to a circuit. I don't have my 12v connected to any other system in the bus. The batteries are seperate from the bus also.

As for a list of the supplies it just depends on where your batteries are in the bus, and what you think you want to add in the future.
I left 5 open spots at every block for future additions.

The thing to keep in mind is that 12v loses a lot of its power in long runs and with small wire.

Oh yeah, you also need a fuse in the main line from the batteries to reduce the fire hazards. I used a 200 amp inline, also from the stereo shop.

HTH
Devin
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Devin, Amy, and the kids!!
Happily Bussin'!!
Ace
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« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2006, 09:28:57 PM »

Devin thank you much! Now my question is, you said the 12v system was not connected to the bus system. I understand that ok and was wondering if your 8d's are JNUST used for your 12 volt items? Since I have one 12 volt battery being used to start the generator, can that be used for my 12 volt system or do I need a whole seperate bank of batteries for my 12 volt items? If a seperate bank is used how does it get recharged or does it tie into the inverter's charger, bus charger, or a seperate charger?

Thanks again...

Ace
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JimC
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« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2006, 09:39:04 PM »

OK
let me see if I understand now, is your coach 12 or 24 volt?

If both house and coach are 12v like mine, I seperated everything that I need to drive;
fans, stereo, guages, running lights, fog, camera, ect. ect.

Then I ran interior led lights, reading lights, vent fan, water pump, and everything else I need (plus extras)off of the house system.

For heater blower motors, and the webasto, and other things I would need both driving and camping, I have a switch so I can power them off of either house or coach.

Most of my 120v runs through the inverter (other than dedicated circuits like engine heater, air  compressor, and a couple of outlets (one in engine bay and one toward the front)

The way it is now, if the generator takes a puke, I can plug in to recharge, if not I still have lights and fridge for a while.  If I am running down the road, I dont worry about using the house system.

I also have a solenoid that I can charge the house from the bus alternator while going down the road that was there when I bought the bus. I can also charge the house batterys in a pinch from the Detroit if I have to.

If I blow the inverter, I can open the 120v panel and use one jumper wire to the side of the panel that powers the inverter circuits and run the generator or plug into a pole somewhere.

I used my rig for two years before I took it apart and rewired it so I knew what it was doing and I could trouble shoot it. I still get in over my head sometimes, it helps to have a buddy that is an electrical contractor.

hope that helps, or what you were looking for.

JimC4106
Wisconsin
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between Milwaukee & Madison
JimC
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« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2006, 09:44:03 PM »

ACE
after reading your other comments, I thought I would ad that I run my house 12v off of a fork lift battery, that battery is charged by the inverter charger.
The bus 12v and the generator runs off the two coach 8D's.
JIMC
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4106 - 8-71/730
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between Milwaukee & Madison
Buffalo SpaceShip
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« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2006, 10:28:08 PM »

Ace, since those are "house side" items, just run those loads off of your inverter battery bank. If your inverter is 24v (a 5500 watt would be, I would think), use the equalizer or 24v to 12v converter we talked about in your previous thread.

I'd pull a big line (6GA would be good) off the 12v side of the equalizer or 24-to-12 converter and fuse it with 50A or so, run that big wire to a fuse panel (or circuit breakers, if you prefer), and then the branch loads to wherever they go. You then have the capability to run moderate 12v loads for anything else you add in the future... cigarette lighter taps, etc.

HTH,
Brian
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Brian Brown
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TomC
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« Reply #10 on: August 06, 2006, 09:30:39 AM »

Ace- for my 12v fixtures (my bus is 12v only), I ran a 000 cable from my deep cycle batteries to a knife switch, then to two fuse blocks that I bought through NAPA.  Each 12v fixture is fused (I changed the plug in fuses to plug in pop out circut breakers).  This method can be used by you also to add anything you want.
As to intigrating the inverter/charger into the system, I have 2-8D AGM deep cycle.  I wired the inverter (0000 cable) with a 300amp slow blow fuse directly to the inverter.  The 12v service mentioned above is taken from the other battery so to have the battery as a buffer when the inverter is in charge mode.  Also from the service side of the deep cycle batteries I have a jumper going to the starter batts (000) through twin 160amp continuous duty relays that are wired in parallel (have a heavy steel strap connecting the two with the batt coming in the center of the strap) so to have deep cycle charging going down the road, or to jump the starter batts in a pinch.  The relay control is wired to the dash with a on-off-on switch with one side being wired through the ignition to activate the relay through the starting batts and the other side through the deep cycle batts so if one of the batt banks is dead, the other can activate the relay.
Hope this helps, Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2006, 03:42:44 PM »

Ace,

List as I see it:

12vdc off of your existing equalizer or you need one.

Run wire of correct size to match your equalizer output (max amp draw) to distribution point

Put fuse at output of equalizer to match wire size/load.

At distribution point put 12vdc auto reset breakers with bus bar to one side of each circuit breaker.

You may want to split(on different breakers) your lights up (dont know your plan) so that a single failure wont leave you in the dark.

You will have to figure breakers based on total amp draw of lights.(rule of thumb is never exceed 80% of rating)

From other side of breaker run sized wire(based on total amp load) to switch and then to fixtures.

Run a ground on each circuit completely back to distribution point.

Alot of this is depends, because I dont know the loads etc...You could also do relays depending on what you want...

On mine I ran the 12vdc to my drivers control panel, bought the breakers, breaker holder and made a bus bar to attach them all to the 12vdc source.

I added extra breakers for the future as it was a pain to mount in that location.

All my 12vdc can be shut down at the drivers seat if wanted.

I also ran a seperate circuit for red led lights that can be on while I am driving that wont mess up your night vision, or cause a massive reflection on the front window.

HTH

Cliff
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