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Author Topic: Another Point of View. A personal Rant.  (Read 3803 times)
bobofthenorth
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« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2010, 06:29:59 PM »

First off, if they live east of Manitoba and west of New Brunswick then all bets are off and I won't be responsible for their behaviour.  

I never did like slideouts so I can't help you there.

27 bux a night seems like a pretty fair price assuming BNSF's mainline doesn't run through the middle of the campground.

Now, as to the pullthrough thing, perhaps I can offer a suggestion which I encourage you to remember comes under the category of free advice and therefore possibly worth slightly less than you will pay for it, but I'll offer it anyway.  Let the marketplace handle the problem.  If your regular sites are $27 per night then post a higher price for the pull throughs.  It doesn't really matter what that higher price is because most of the time you won't charge it anyway.

That way when Mr. Class B "I need a pull through" shows up you can say "no problem, that will be $47 (or $38 or whatever) please".  And who knows, he might even think that was a good deal.  For the rest of the world, when you see a nice guy with a towed behind his bus or some behemoth 5th wheel, you can say "well, we don't really need to charge you the extra for the pullthrough - just consider it Cat's special deal of the week".  Everybody is happy.
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R.J.(Bob) Evans
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bubbaqgal
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« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2010, 06:34:02 PM »

Sean, you obviously didn't get the point of that. It was a comment just as an example of costs that go with running a campground.  Too many people can afford a high price motor home but expect camping costs to be free or negligible. People will go out of their way to find a cheap campground and then complain about the amenities. I was trying to make a point here that campgrounds cost money to run but obviously it went over your head.

Bob, that would be great but I don't own the place or set the prices.   Grin
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« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2010, 06:44:24 PM »

Dallas, the way you do a pull thru is the way our friend at Williams AZ does all of his sites are 120 ft long with 2 complete hookups on each site if you want a pull thru you pay for 2 sites he cuts people a little slack but not much and he has been doing that for years 


good luck
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« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2010, 07:05:46 PM »

Dallas,

A couple of thoughts>

One, you need to come back to the Carolinas.

Two, Walmart has plenty of pull thurs

Third, Once upon time I had a single engine inboard boat and it would be an event to watch each time I backed into my slip.  But I would rather back into a parking space than pull in.

And after I rant I usually feel better, do you?

Art
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buswarrior
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« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2010, 07:10:43 PM »

There has never been a time in history that serving the public has been easy.

Anyone who thinks otherwise has allowed time to scar over the wounds.

Try working in public transit or line run service where they'll assault the driver over a $3 fare...

The reward for public service is biblical in nature, there will be little thanks this side of the afterlife...

but it's a living!

happy coaching!
buswarrior

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Chopper Scott
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« Reply #20 on: March 30, 2010, 07:22:02 PM »

Dealing with the public is and always will be a non stop problem from time to time. Basically on the forum we are dealing with different personalities and there are issues from time to time here also. We had problems at the KOA in Kissimmie Florida that never got fixed and the prices were $105 a night and we were there for 5 nights. A bad breaker that kept going off for no reason. It was obvious that the breaker was junk. I about went over to Walmart and got one and switched it myself. Shower doors that the locks didn't work. We never complained. We just made sure they knew of the problem. When we left they still hadn't been resolved. I had enough cord that I plugged into an unoccupied site finally. And we were staying in one of the top sites they advertised. For what it's worth where we generally camp during the summer (weekend and such) the sites are $18 for 50 amp and no sewer/water. Nice showers and shade. But you are secluded somewhat and it's actually camping. Campfires, grills and the whole shebang! If that was what fulltiming was I'd be all for it!
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« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2010, 08:30:37 PM »

Sean, you obviously didn't get the point of that. It was a comment just as an example of costs that go with running a campground.  Too many people can afford a high price motor home but expect camping costs to be free or negligible. People will go out

But, you're also exaggerating the cost of what having a camp host costs.  It is only costing the owner $10,000 a year if every day of the year you had to turn away one nightly customer because the campground was full.

Put it another way, would the owner pay the camp host $10,000 a year addiitional wages if that person lived elsewhere?  Probably not as the camp site doesn't really cost the owner $10,000 a year.

A campground is way down on my list of businesses I would want to own.  They are expensive to keep up and campers keep wanting more amenities like 50 amp service, wi-fi and sewer at every site.  A properly done electrical service that delivers full voltage to every outlet in a full campground on the hottest day of the year is not cheap.  I don't know how you could make money on a new campground.  Every $10,000 spent to build a single site means that site has to be rented for a full year at $30 a night to pay back the up front cost.
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« Reply #22 on: March 30, 2010, 08:35:27 PM »

I have never full-timed, but we do go to campgrounds in the bus.  We do like to get a good rate and have experimented with some camping clubs.  They can work out okay.  It is normal for everyone to see things from the perspective of their own benefit.  Some people buy an RV and think they will travel for nothing since they have invested heavily up front.  The campground fees can get in the way of their delusion, so they complain.  I know that I do not want to think that I am paying as much at a campground as I would at a motel.  

A large percentage of drivers are really not that great at backing up whatever rig they have.  Getting a pull through site solves that stress for them.  It would be exceptional for those drivers to think that the pull through spot could be more essential for someone else.  If it's available, they'll grab it using the first-come philosophy.  Since it seems that those sites are premium, it is not unreasonable to charge extra for them.  Those that do not need it, will opt to save the money.  If the campground owner does not want to do that, there is no reason that you must try to ration the spots.  First come, first serve and the rest is out of your control.  The owner could post a policy that pull-throughs are only for certain setups, but again that is out of your control so don't worry about it.

People can be difficult.  Some feel that if they are paying for something, you are their personal servant.  Why should they walk the trash to the dumpster when they have a servant like you?  Others will realize that they are paying for a campsite, and it is their responsibility to leave it a clean as when they arrived.  One could hand out a rules sheet that informs them of that and any other rules.  Anyway, that's the nature of being in a service industry.  Please don't expect people to change.  In all the time you have been managing this campground, I'm sure you know what the percentages are.  They will continue to be the same.  If you do not like the odds, the job is not for you.  One thing you can be sure of, no matter how bad the worst camper you can remember was, there is someone worse heading your way right now.
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bubbaqgal
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« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2010, 08:37:07 PM »

It looks like you are missing the point also Bryan.  I am talking about campground costs.  As I said to Sean.....I was only trying to make a point that things cost money so people should not keep expecting to camp for nothing. Obviously neither of you get my point so I am going to stop wasting my time trying to get it across to you.  Perhaps I should go back and delete that part of my post since it is over your heads.
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eagle rush
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« Reply #24 on: March 30, 2010, 09:13:31 PM »

Dallas and Bubbaqgal, which campground are you located if you don't mind me asking because wed are going through Texas soon and would love to stop by and see you both, we have read a lot of your post and you seem like super people. thankyou Richard
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bubbaqgal
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« Reply #25 on: March 30, 2010, 09:18:03 PM »

We are at RV Relay Station in Franklin.  We are about 40 miles north of Bryan/College Station.  We would love to have you stop by and visit. If you need more information about how to find us just email me at the addy in my profile.
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Dreamscape
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« Reply #26 on: March 30, 2010, 09:35:44 PM »

It's a great place to hang your hat, sit and chat, cool your heals and get to know some great folk!
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« Reply #27 on: March 30, 2010, 09:57:18 PM »

When we go to a campsite-I'm perfectly happy if I just have electricity (have big tanks).  And with the sharp turning of the transit bus, can easily back into any space provided-which are more likely the scenic ones compared to the pull through. When we pull into a spot, it takes about two minutes to back in straight, another minute to hit the leveling valves, and another 6-7 minutes to hook up the electricity. In another words, we're into our space and done in about 10 minutes.  We've seen some fivers take close to an hour to back in (with the wife madly screaming at the husband not to run over the power pole), hook up and get leveled.  The grand scale of the competence in most of the RV'rs is down right scary at times.  And yes, some of the full timers are your basic RV trash (most are not-but the bad ones really stick out).  I always keep to the Boy Scout way of leaving the campsite cleaner then when you arrived.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #28 on: March 30, 2010, 09:59:11 PM »

The wife and I have been in the koa system for 3 years now, both in the the workcamper role and management role from $30 a night to our current $70 a night in Nashville... We deal with the crazies that think dumping there tanks on the ground is ok or the ones that don't understand why we only have 100 channels of cable! The later is aggravating. Or those special people saying or utilities are messed up that are attempting the 50 amp connection with a cord made of ducktape and 2 orange Extension cords. The. You have the ones that say they paid for the best site in the campground when j. Reality the got the value water electric only next to the sewer lift station.... And then the ones driving the million dollar conversions that don't understand you do eventually have to mow the grass and can't keep putting it off because they are there !

Yes Dallas j feel your pain!
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Sean
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« Reply #29 on: March 30, 2010, 10:40:57 PM »

Sean, you obviously didn't get the point of that. It was a comment just as an example of costs that go with running a campground.  Too many people can afford a high price motor home but expect camping costs to be free or negligible. People will go out of their way to find a cheap campground and then complain about the amenities. I was trying to make a point here that campgrounds cost money to run but obviously it went over your head.


Whoa.  No need to get testy or make a personal assault on my intelligence, Cat.  Your point did not "go over my head" -- I understood it completely, and I said nothing whatever about whether or not I agreed with your underlying premise (I do).

However, someone questioned you on the $10,000 number, and you insisted it was correct -- it's not.  I've run a lot of businesses and I know about opportunity costs.  I know all about the costs of running a campground (and a hotel, restaurant, gas station, public utility, and about a dozen other businesses), and if you want to give examples of those costs, I am all for it, just be realistic about them.  This "example" was anything but.

When your campground is running at anything less than full occupancy, giving a site away costs nothing other than utilities and maintenance.  That's why it's done -- it's way cheaper than wages to get the equivalent work done.  The only time a site occupied by a host (or out of service for any other reason) results in $27 (or whatever the full rate is) in lost revenue is when all other sites that could be sold are already full.

Since you seem to want to make me argue your other points as well, which was not my intent, I will:

What someone paid for their rig has no relationship whatsoever to what they can or can't afford for camping.  There are people right here on this board with putatively expensive Prevosts who can't afford the fuel to take them out of the barn.  Would you say to them "you have no business having a bus, since you can't afford to drive it right now?"

Some of us actually spent extra money on our rigs explicitly so they would be capable of avoiding expensive campgrounds.  Possibly not a trade-off you would have made, but it is a personal choice -- our differences are what makes the world an interesting place.  And, yes, actually, I am one of the people who "expects" camping to be free or negligible, because I've already paid for it many times over, and I researched it ahead of time.  I would never have built the bus otherwise.  What I do not expect is a full-service campground to be free, and when I need one, I expect to pay for it.

None of which excuses boorish behavior on the part of any customer.  Presumably, people who stay at your campground do so because they need hookups, or WiFi, or a reliable address, or they just want the company of other RVers.  Assuming they are treated fairly by the business, they should behave accordingly.

There are bad apples in any group.  Without maligning anyone on this board, our experience has been that the RV community seems, at times, to have more than its fair share of them -- that's one of the reasons we stay out of RV parks.  You have every right, from the other side of the counter, to be annoyed with them.  But please, don't make sweeping generalizations about the rest of us.  And don't insult my intelligence just because I took exception to one little part of your premise.

-Sean
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