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Author Topic: Painting question  (Read 8174 times)
ruthi
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« on: June 05, 2010, 06:11:09 PM »

So, I know we have talked about this before, but I still need some advice, plus I dont remember it all, lol. We have a shop that wants to paint our bus, and they seem to know what they are doing, but.......... They said we should not use clear coat, to use urathane instead. They said it will still shine, and hold up as well. I did a little research, and it seems all cars are clear coated. We want to get the best. Will the paint hold up as well without the clear coat? And shine? We have this set up for them to finish the prep work Monday, but, we need to be sure about this. Only want to do this once.
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
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wal1809
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« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2010, 06:41:42 PM »

Ruthi I am no painter but I am a fan of clear coats.  It always seams to get that glossy thick wet look when it is done.  My wife and I have been talking about paint.  One day were going to have to repaint.  Whoever did the conversion did no use clear on my bus.  It doesn't look as good as it should.  When we repaint I am going to drop some serious coin, find the best and have them do it all.  I believe we have settled on real pearl white.  When u was a kid I had a job as a mechanic through high school.  We built a lot of hot rods and my favorite was the crushed oyster shell pearl white with 20 coats if clear.  Absolutely loved that paint job when we got done.
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ruthi
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« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2010, 06:54:42 PM »

That would be a really nice color. We are just concerned that we are getting the best, that will hold up in the long term, and be that really shiny look.
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
Home in middle Georgia, located somewhere in the
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FIRST RALLY ATTENDED: BUSSIN 2011!
bryanhes
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« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2010, 06:55:23 PM »

Ruthi,

I used to do paint and body work. I prefer a base, clear coat method. One of the big differences is the work it takes after the paint to get a single stage to shine like a clear coated paint. You have to do ALLOT of wet sanding and buffing. What is the cost difference between the two methods at the shop?
The nice thing about a single stage is it is sometimes easier to repair a scratch. You don't have to re clear the whole panel and usually more material is there to polish out future light scratches. Whereas a base-clear you do not have as much material that you can sand on before going through the clear. Both have their pro's & con's. If they are both applied correctly you can get a deep wet look from both and with proper care either one will last for many, many years.

HTH,
Bryan
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robertglines1
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« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2010, 07:06:20 PM »

I use both and plan on using one step on next project...with the addition of hardeners it makes a very durable and classier finish.Ck on pearl look can be added to most colors and does some neat lite tricks in sun and under lights...they can paint you a sample on a test panel of each type..put side by side and choose..Looking foward to finished product(pictures required)  Bob
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ruthi
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« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2010, 07:09:22 PM »

I dont know the difference in the pricing. Should it cost a lot more for the labor to do the clear coat? That is an awfully big surface to have to shine with the buffing. I guess the buffing would have to be done fairly often? We only have 3 windows in the coach, so, lots of area. I know a shop in S.C. quoted us about the same price to to the clear coat, as we are going to pay the local guys. But they are also including doing some of the prep for us too. It kinda sounds like maybe we should do the clear coat. Undecided
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
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ruthi
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« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2010, 07:13:01 PM »

Bob, are you talking about using single stage with urathane, or some other product. I have got to figure this out before they purchase the paint.
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
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southeast most of the time.
FIRST RALLY ATTENDED: BUSSIN 2011!
eddiepotts
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« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2010, 07:13:12 PM »

I would look at single stage. One of the things I noticed when buying mine is most buses needed clearcoat repair. I know cars use it but it may have something to do with the surface area it is on. I would think the bus expands allot more in the sun than a car does. The single stage does wax to an easy shine. The cost should be allot cheaper just for the cost of paints. the cost of 20 coats of clear would not compare for five coats of single stage. if it lasted 8 years have it done again for another 8.  You would still be cheaper in the cost in paint and decide if you really like the color .
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wal1809
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« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2010, 07:20:40 PM »

I don't think the bus would require 20 coats of clear.  That was a 1967 camero we did in pearl white and 20 clear coats.  That was in the early 1980s and they paid $5000 for that job.  I never knew that much money existed back then.  The last poster had a point of repainting every decade with a single base paint.  Nothing that goes down the road a lot will last a decade still looking brand new.  So he has a good point.
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bryanhes
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« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2010, 07:28:41 PM »

Ruthi,

No you should not have to buff hardly ever o the single stage if a good wax is used a few times a year. IMO only waxing once a year will not cut it. The reason most have to buff is because of lack of care over several years. There is something to say for the durability of a single stage urethane w/out clear.
The biggest reason for clear coat peeling is in either the prep, mix or even age of clear or the paint it is trying to bond to. The clear peels typically because it is not remaining bonded to the paint underneath. And typically 3 coats of clear are normal.
With either method it requires the proper prep, prep & more prep. Is the shop giving any kind of warranty on the paint job?

I have also looked at photos of buses done by Willy's Custom paint that did Clifford's bus and would bet they are base-clear coat. Here is a link to the site. http://www.willyscustomconcepts.net/coachgallery.html
You can see Clifford's Eagle from the side and rear. That is a base-clear.

Bryan
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ruthi
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« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2010, 07:29:52 PM »

That is true about how long it will look good. Cry Oh well.............. Well, maybe we will stick to the original plan. The guy that is painting it has done a lot of expensive cars and some prevost, so, I am sure he knows what he is doing. If all goes well, it should have paint on it this month. We are going with the copper color that is on the 2010 ford lariats,metalic copper,  and a black stripe. We wanted to keep it simple with a clean line. Cant wait! Thanks for the advice, as always.
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
Home in middle Georgia, located somewhere in the
southeast most of the time.
FIRST RALLY ATTENDED: BUSSIN 2011!
robertglines1
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« Reply #11 on: June 05, 2010, 07:38:42 PM »

I have done both base coat clear coat and single stage with hardener...over time (8yrs) the base coat clear coat has faded more than the single stage.with the hardener or wet look additive.I actually think the clear coat has fogged...time of painting is a problem(drying) the longer it takes to apply the more likely of a stray bug or dust in paint...a bus is huge and takes a long time to coat so more exposure time...If you trust the guys with your money and bus listen to them they are the people your going to see if you have problems..I'm sure they are more comfortable with the urethane based products for their set up and time...It is my opinion that the single stage will hold up better to acid rain damage..a short coming of the old clear coat...newer systems are (clear coat). are a little better.I have prob over stepped my self,I will be using single stage with hardener...Bob ps was typeing at same time..good decision
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« Reply #12 on: June 05, 2010, 07:42:30 PM »

Quote
most buses needed clearcoat repair

I see that a lot also......

You can buff an old single stage paint job to look good again. Failing clear coat will require professional repair. You probably will not know if the painter did a bad prep job for several years. I see many cars from the '90s in need of new clear coat. How long are you going to keep your bus? Heavily oxidized paint looks better to me than clear coat gone bad. This is only my observation because I know nothing about paint unless it comes out of a can, and even that is little to nothing.
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« Reply #13 on: June 05, 2010, 07:43:37 PM »

Ruthi, You do not need to wax urethane to make it shine. I have seen a few buses that the clear coat went bad and yellowed. Clear is nice as you can paint all you colors and then clear coat. with the single stage paint you need to let each color dry longer. My last RV was single stage and then I scuffed and put on stripes and clear coated them. My bus now is urethane and it shines  just fine. I wax the front to help get the bugs off. You will have a tape line with the single, the clear coat will help hide the tape line. I am not a painter by trade, so these are my thoughts only but I did paint my own.  Tom Y  
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ruthi
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« Reply #14 on: June 05, 2010, 07:45:06 PM »

What is a normal time frame for a warranty?
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Mixed up Dina, ready for the road as of 12/25/2010
Home in middle Georgia, located somewhere in the
southeast most of the time.
FIRST RALLY ATTENDED: BUSSIN 2011!
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