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Author Topic: She blew up today  (Read 5663 times)
Wax-um
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« on: August 16, 2010, 12:08:19 PM »

Sad day, driving to Home Depot to pickup a new refreierator my motor locked up. I knew the motor was weak when I purchased the bus. Now what to do. The bus is in the shop and they are working me a quote. Im goin on a limb to say new rebuilt motor is more than the bus is worth. Hopefully I can find a documented low mile used motor for a fair price. If not I maybe better off buying a different bus or maybe a donor bus. My bus is a 1982 MCI 9, with a 6v92 engine. Hopefully I can locate a good motor close to Oklahoma City.

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« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2010, 12:29:45 PM »

Sorry to hear the news.   There are alot of options with 6V92 transit "pullouts"   

You might want to consider a Series 50 install.   
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bevans6
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« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2010, 12:35:15 PM »

I think that a 6V92 swap with a good used engine might be achievable, they seem to be the more available option these days.  I'm thinking you might have one installed in the $5K region.  From my research a S50 is an excellent option for your bus, they are also available, but the installed cost is more like $15K.  That's what I was told to budget if  I did most of the work myself.

Brian
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1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
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rv_safetyman
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« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2010, 12:36:08 PM »

Some of us have been in your shoes and it is a terrible feeling.  In my case, I lost the 6V92 and my first Series 60.  So, I can relate.

I assume you posted this to get some input and look for an engine.  

In order for us to help you with your decision, we need to know more about your bus.  Is it converted?  Is the conversion done well with good equipment (name inverter, good tanks, name diesel generator, etc.).  If it is well done, it probably makes sense to replace the engine.

If you bus is just a shell, then the answer becomes more difficult.  

No matter what, you coach will not have much value (fact of the market).  Having said that, you can find some real bargains.  However, bargains can still give you $$$ problems.

So the issue you will struggle with is whether you want to stick with the devil you know, or try another person's devil

I think it will be real hard to find a "documented" 6V92.  If you do, you need to be very sure that you get real documentation.  

If you have yours rebuilt, be careful of the re-builder.  The best is a DD reliabilt replacement engine ($20-25K).  Next best is a DD rebuild.  They have three stages of rebuilt:  http://detroitdieselstepup.com/whystepup.asp   You will note that the 4th sage is the replacement engine.  That program seems to be aimed at the Series 60, but I would bet they have the same thing for the two-strokes.

If you have an independent person do the rebuild, be sure to get more than one reference.  Lots of shops are hungry right now and will tell you anything you want to hear to get you in the door.

Jim
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
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« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2010, 12:46:12 PM »

I was typing when the others replied.  They mentioned a Series 50.  Indeed many feel that is a good swap.  Some folks don't like the Series 50 because of balance issues.  In addition a Cummins M11/ISM also make a great conversion.

Any conversion to a 4-stroke is a very big undertaking.  One of the biggest issues is the gearing needed to run the 4-stroke in the proper RPM range (need 30% "overdrive" to make them the happiest).

Also, I don't often disagree with Brian, but there is no way you could do a conversion for $15K unless you did all the work yourself and then you would have to find a pretty good bargain on the engine.

If you at all consider doing an engine conversion I suggest you review the three part series on engine conversion considerations that I wrote for BCM.

Jim
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
Gary '79 5C
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« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2010, 12:46:49 PM »

Are you sure it is terminal ? I know locked up is not a vague term, but what has happened ? Any thing leading up to this ? Ran out of oil, or was it just "time".

As others have said, many promises to get you in the door, And it is a real bad spot to negotiate once your engine is apart on their shop floor.

I dunno if Nimco is of any assistance in Lovely North Jersey. Best kept property on that block is the Jail..

Best of luck,

Gary
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« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2010, 12:59:03 PM »

In my opinion, documentation is a distraction since it is way too easy to fake paperwork or to ruin a perfectly good motor in a few of miles of abuse from an uninformed driver. If you drive a 2stroke like a 4stroke, you will hurt it.

As for used motors - Best bet is to find one that you & your preferred mechanic can hear & see it run (test drive is even better). If you can't run the motor, I'd work a deal where I could have the compression checked before I bought it - if the compression checked good, pay the man & leave with your new motor. Have the rack run (- you'll have to since the injectors were removed) & I'd also install new bearings while it is out. Then put her in & enjoy the ride.

Best of luck to you!
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bevans6
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« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2010, 01:03:45 PM »

No disagreement there, Mr RV, the $15k price was what I was told a person with many years of bus experience and complete capability to do the job himself spent doing the job himself.  I personally think the experience was what let him do that, it wasn't his first rodeo  (gent I met at the Palmetto rally in March/april this year, had been full-timing in his bus for 20 odd years, and this was about the third engine he had put in it - Some of you know who I mean but I don't know his name.  He chaired the discussion session in the clubhouse.)

I think the engine bit is great, but the electronic control bit would be very very hard to get right.  There were three or four S50 powered MCI's at the rally, all done a bit differently, particularly the turbo install, exhaust, TPS, things like that.  I just brought it up because someone else mentioned Series 50.

Brian
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1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Spicer 8844 4 speed Zen meditation device
Vintage race cars -
1978 Lola T440 Formula Ford
1972 NTM MK-4 B/SR
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« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2010, 01:22:42 PM »

Nimco in New Jersey has a running take out 6V92 that is out of a MCI I think for $3500.00 FOB Newark,NJ.They can ship by truck to your location.Good folks to deal with. Grin
800-526-8055 as for Jim Robinson
Nick is no longer with Nimco. Angry
jlv
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uncle ned
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« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2010, 01:43:57 PM »



We could just wait til Hard headed Ken get the series 50 in the silversides. Then we will know the real cost.

And also know how much work it is.  and if he does you can be assured it will be right.

uncle ned

PS wish the 50 were as avaliable 3 years ago as now. one would be in the back of huggy. No heating problems
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rv_safetyman
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« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2010, 01:54:00 PM »

Brian, I am glad that we are not in conflict  Grin Grin.  Yes, an engine swap can be done in the 10-15K range by the owner.  I would count on at least 2-3K just on parts to make it happen.  The last I heard, when Southern Oregon Diesel does an engine swap (they supposedly don't do them anymore), they charge over 40K from what I hear.  Having done one, I think that is a fair price for a good shop.

Just to be clear here, I don't have a bone to pick with the Series 50.  I was repeating what some folks have reported.  I have talked to several folks who have done Series 50 swaps and they are happy.  Have not talked to anyone who was not happy.

If the person who had done the multiple swaps owned an Eagle, it was probably Jack Campbell.

Jim
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
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« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2010, 01:59:16 PM »



Yes Jack's is very well done and so is his son jerry's.  one is a eagle and the other is a mci.

And they removed big 8v92's

I think Lynn Silver over looked and kept jack straight. LOL LOL  both great guys

uncle ned
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« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2010, 02:07:02 PM »

You might want to look at this. It has been forsale for a long time. You could make a deal and drive it home and may have a little resale coming back to you.

http://houston.craigslist.org/rvs/1822329787.html
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rv_safetyman
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« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2010, 02:11:25 PM »

Don't know my GM models very well.  Would this be a reverse rotation engine?

Jim
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
Wax-um
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« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2010, 02:26:53 PM »

Wow, what a day. Maybe good news but I doubt it. The shop was able to get the engine to turn over and fire but It wont stay running. He said it is very possible its a head gasket but the oil was also extremely low. Im puzzled were the oil went I checked it a few days ago. We will know more if we find metal shaving in oil pan. I constintantly monitor engine temp. It has never been over 180 since I have had it. Maybe time for a new temp gauge. I believe I had a warning sign a few days ago. I had bus idling for awhile and when I shut it off the engine contunied to run for a few seconds. With gas engines we call this dieseling. It sometimes happens with gas engines predetionate when they overheat. I should have known better.  I know sometimes weird things happen with blown headgaskets. Lets cross our fingers for the best. What a setback. I have had the coach two months and almost have the conversion completed. I have about 20k invested in bus. I dont really want to start over on a donor. This is really a nice coach.

Also they said when the tow truck showed up their was alot of antifreeze on the ground. To me it appearded to be diesel fuel mixed with anifreeze
« Last Edit: August 16, 2010, 02:35:09 PM by Wax-um » Logged
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