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Author Topic: NFPA 1192 Standard on Recreational Vehicles  (Read 6816 times)
Slow Rider
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« on: October 25, 2010, 03:21:59 PM »

There was a thread on tank venting the other day.  Sean pointed out there is a code ( imagine that lol ) NFPA 1192 that covers RVs.  You can download this code for 30 to 40 dollars or...........

For general knowledge you can access this standard on line for free.     Go to the following link : 

http://www.nfpa.org/aboutthecodes/AboutTheCodes.asp?DocNum=1192

In the center near the bottom  it says View 2008 Edition on line .  When you click on that link it will open a new page.

You must go to this registration page and follow the bouncing ball.  Once your registration is complete you will be sent an e-mail.  Once you follow the directions in the e-mail you will receive access to the standard.   You may not copy or save it.  You can only view it on line.  But until you decide to buy a copy this will get you started.

Hope this helps,

Frank
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Geoff
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« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2010, 05:19:12 PM »

The "code" is voluntary.
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Geoff
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« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2010, 05:58:54 PM »

Geoff,

By no means am I telling anyone they need to use it.  I am just trying to save money for anyone who is interested in looking at it.  I am a cheep old geezer and see no need to spend the cash if you don't need to.

Frank
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Lin
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« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2010, 07:09:30 PM »

Don't they have it on Netflix yet?
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Sean
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« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2010, 09:32:29 PM »

The "code" is voluntary.


That goes state by state.  In many states NFPA 1192 has been adopted into law, and in those states, it is mandatory.

-Sean
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cody
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« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2010, 09:35:44 PM »

Here we go again, Sean, now explain a variance to me.  Code is subject to local variances, if it were law it would not have variances allowed, and they are allowed by law.  Administrative Law Judge Charles Goodman, 97th district court in L'Anse, Michigan will explain the difference if you are confused, pm me for his phone number, I've talked to him and he is a very nice and patient man, very much more so than I am.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2010, 09:43:09 PM by cody » Logged
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« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2010, 05:12:11 AM »

I do not understand the almost visceral reaction every time someone mentions "Codes".  There goes the damn gummint (probably liberals) telling me what to do again.

Code violations on your own property are not generally crimes, in the sense that you will go to jail, only that licensing authority and/or insurance can make things difficult for you if you have a fire or other catastrophe.

Keep in mind that every line of (almost) every code is a memorial to someone who died because something was not done right, and that (almost) every line is nothing more than common sense.

It's your bus, do whatever you want, but don't jump on those who do want to follow the codes.
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« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2010, 05:47:59 AM »

What irritates me is a person saying that a code is the 'law', this is not the case, a code is a guideline and not a statute, a statute cannot be modified in anyway, it's cast in stone as to how it will be done, a code is a guideline that is a suggested means to do a project of some sort, it can be modified by a variance and can differ from community to community and from state to state, this is how it was explained to me yesterday by the very person whose job it is to interpret it, an administrative law judge, I realize many people misguidedly think that it is the law and as such proclaim it to be law but that doesn't change the fact that they are guidelines and guidelines only.  In any group of people you will find a few that imagine themselves to be a doctor, or an engineer or whatever and that segment will proclaim whatever it is that makes them feel comfortable as being cast in stone because at some time they may have been told that by somebody else who may not have understood the situation completely. An example of it could be a wiring project, depending on the kind of wire used and the particular application there may be several perfectly acceptable ways to get the job done and stay within the accepted guidelines for doing it.
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« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2010, 05:50:14 AM »

I don't about  the codes being voluntary building box stores for for 20 + plus years the big 3 codes were a part of the permit and before you received the CO and final they were met I know the stores were not a bus,I would think one would want some type guide line to go by converting a bus YMMD




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« Last Edit: October 26, 2010, 06:03:57 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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cody
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« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2010, 06:04:48 AM »

An example is burial of wire, how many acceptable ways are there to bury a wire, it depends on the wire and if the wire is to be encased in a conduit of some sort, some wire is perfectly fine with direct burial while others may require encapsulation in a protective wrap like conduit, this is where code come into play, it serves as a guideline on which choice might be best given different circumstances but the final choice may be one of several possibles, that is why communities are given the latitude to apply codes in varying ways thru variances.
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Len Silva
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« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2010, 06:08:37 AM »

<SNIP> An example of it could be a wiring project, depending on the kind of wire used and the particular application there may be several perfectly acceptable ways to get the job done and stay within the accepted guidelines for doing it.

AFAIK, there is only one area of legitimate controversy as far as wiring methods for our buses, and that is the use of "Boat Wire".  We all know that it is safe if properly installed and is not approved simply because of the expense to the manufacturer to get approval for a very limited market.  So, even though it is technically not approved, no one is going to fault the use of it.

On the other hand, there are busnuts who advocate the use of extension cords for wiring a bus.  Clearly a blatant violation of the NEC and not a safe practice.

Common sense works fine here if you clearly understand why a particular code section exists and that your proposed method is safe, then I don't have a problem with it.

Of course, there is also stupidity and little we can do about it.

I have seen with my own eyes, improperly secured propane tanks in the same compartment as the batteries, inadequate wire sizes, improper or no fuses, etc.
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JackConrad
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« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2010, 06:16:01 AM »

We all know this is a "hot" subject. Most have a strong opinion on this subject and anything you say will not change that opinion, so let's keep this civil and respect everyone's opinion, even if we do not agree with it.  Your friendly moderator
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cody
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« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2010, 06:32:37 AM »

Jack, its for that reason that I contacted a federal judge who specializes in this, we can all argue until the cows come home, he clearly has what must be concidered the legal understanding of the subject and is available to enlighten anyone that needs it explained.  A wannabe doctor is no better than a wannabe engineer, each envisions themselves as having the final word and absolute knowledge on a particular subject but are not empowered to interpret it legally, even 10 different lawyers can argue it 10 different ways but the judge is the only one that can say which is correct.  If you take a particular code for california and compare it to a simular code for hawaii, you'll find any number of differences and adjustments to it, thats why it isn't listed as law, it can be changed to meet local needs.
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FloridaCliff
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« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2010, 02:11:26 PM »

What irritates me is a person saying that a code is the 'law', this is not the case, a code is a guideline and not a statute, a statute cannot be modified in anyway, it's cast in stone as to how it will be done,

Sorry but you are completely wrong on this, and you do everyone a disservice to keep proclaiming it.

A quick Google search will provide all the information needed, try  "difference between laws and codes" for a start.

Maybe its time to quit being a "wannabe lawyer"    Wink

Cliff
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cody
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« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2010, 02:16:42 PM »

I'll stick by what judge goodman said, he's the one that makes the call.  A law cannot be altered by a variance, a code can be, a code can carry a monetary penalty just as a late library book can but it still doesn't make it a law in the eyes of the court, thats according to the federal judge, he is in a far better position to make a legal interpretation than google or any of us, he's not a wannabe.  The judge is the real thing. I won't be pursuing this any further, if I do I'll just get mad and quit the board so I'll just leave it alone, go with whatever interpretation that you like, I'll go with the judges opinion, I really don't care if anyone wants to wire their batteries with zip cord, thats their business and not mine, I don't care anymore, go worship your own demigods and I'll find my own.  I didn't think anyone would have the guts to answer my question about variances.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2010, 02:25:40 PM by cody » Logged
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