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Author Topic: Can an MCI E-4500 be fitted with a Cummins ISX?  (Read 5692 times)
CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2010, 09:45:32 AM »

The choice is yours and you have to do what works and what you want in the long term. I do however hope you do go with the CUMMINS. I own stock in them. Smiley
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morefire
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« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2010, 09:53:50 AM »

The choice is yours and you have to do what works and what you want in the long term. I do however hope you do go with the CUMMINS. I own stock in them. Smiley

Nice!  So I can get the new 2010-2011 version for a smoking deal through you? Grin Grin
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David G
Toronto, Ontario
2009 Bluebird 40' Coach
Cummins ISX-675HP!!
CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2010, 10:14:13 AM »

Sure if I get a bonus out of it but I can't hold my breath that long. Smiley
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rv_safetyman
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Jim Shepherd


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« Reply #18 on: November 30, 2010, 10:51:05 AM »

As I step back from this for a minute, I reflect on several conversations I had with folks who had done engine conversions. 

Many years ago Sonnie Gray and I started doing engine conversion seminars at Jack's party (finally led up to the three part article in the magazine).  In preparation for those seminars and at the various rallies, I would make a point to talk to everybody I could find that had done an engine conversion from a two-stroke to a four-stroke (as well as upgrading two-strokes).  I asked several folks why they did it and got a couple of:  "because someone said it could not be done!!!".  I love it!!!

That is not quite the case here, but it is a case where a fellow wants to do it "his way" - even if it defies logic Grin

Jim

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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
wildbob24
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« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2010, 11:26:00 AM »

I believe that, for most of us, just owning the bus defies logic  Wink

Bob
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P8M4905A-1308, 8V71 w/V730
Custom Coach Conversion
Duluth, GA
morefire
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« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2010, 11:33:16 AM »

Bottom line,  I really just want to know if there is enough space in the engine bay to actually fit a 15liter ISX engine.  I don't want to purchase both the bus and engine if I cant fit it in there without redesigning the chassis.  If it can physically fit, I'll find someone to do the work.  Wink

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David G
Toronto, Ontario
2009 Bluebird 40' Coach
Cummins ISX-675HP!!
rv_safetyman
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« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2010, 11:53:12 AM »

morefire (wish I could address you by name, but no signature), be very careful about who you have do the work if you proceed.  There are a ton of hungry mechanics out there that will tell you they can do the work because they stuck a Cadillac engine in an old Ford.  Not the same animal by any huge stretch of the imagination.  Maybe one in a hundred of those folks could do the job correctly.  

There will be a lot of fabrication and electronic work to be done.  At the very least, the person should have (and be familiar with) with a ProLink or other form of HD diesel electronic diagnostic equipment.  They will need to have, or fabricate, a very large dolly to remove and install the engine (or a fork lift).  They will need all of the huge tools that diesel mechanics have.  Get a reference if you don't know the person's capabilities (personal skills and equipment).  Be prepared to pay $100 per hour if a shop is involved to cover the labor and overhead.  I would guess that you will have to pay $15K to get the job done correctly.

If you do this project, be very careful of the engine mounts.  I used the truck mounts and I have some vibration.  Trucks don't care much, because they have big frames and isolated cabs.  Buses do care.  I would try to find a way to modify the MCI/Series 60 mounts.

As far as the engine fitting, I think others have said that all of the big four-strokes are roughly the same size. Most of the engine manufacturers supply dimension data, or you could visit a used truck lot and find trucks with both engines and compare the dimensions.  I don't think width will be an issue.  I would guess length and height (probably the most critical dimension) will not be an issue.

Jim
« Last Edit: November 30, 2010, 12:02:54 PM by rv_safetyman » Logged

Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
luvrbus
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« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2010, 12:23:31 PM »

If you need help Sonnie Gray is installing a ISX and a auto 12 speed in a Eagle for a friend of ours right now and I am sure there is more room for the ISX in the 4500 than a Eagle with a drop box and a boggie axle with a 6v92 ,btw he wanted a C-15 also but the ISX was a better buy for him.
Bruce installed a ISX in a older MCI but he added a 1 foot or better to rear on his  

good luck
« Last Edit: November 30, 2010, 12:50:36 PM by luvrbus » Logged

Live each day like it was your last,one day it will be
morefire
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« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2010, 12:56:06 PM »

If you need help Sonnie Gray is installing a ISX and a auto 12 speed in a Eagle for a friend of ours right now and I am sure there is more room for the ISX in the 4500 than a Eagle with a drop box and a boggie axle with a 6v92 ,btw he wanted a C-15 also but the ISX was a better buy for him.
Bruce installed a ISX in a older MCI but he added a 1 foot or better to rear on his  

good luck

well, if it can fit in an Eagle, it can fit in an MCI.

I am also woking on a 2009 BLUEBIRD Bus that came from the coachworks bankrupcy auction.  I have a thread going over on "Wanderlodge Owners Group".  Good bunch of guys over there.   I am trying to sort out some paper work issues with that bus...if I dont get  it sorted out,  I am switching to the MCI 4500 with an ISX600 project.
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David G
Toronto, Ontario
2009 Bluebird 40' Coach
Cummins ISX-675HP!!
RJ
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« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2010, 08:03:28 PM »

David -

You're in luck!

Buswarrior is in your neighborhood, a wealth of operational knowledge literally at your back door!

Perhaps an invite to share a Molson in front of a roaring fireplace can answer lots of your questions?

FWIW & HTH. . .

 Wink
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RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
Busted Knuckle
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6 Setras, 2 MCIs, and 1 Dina. Just buses ;D


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« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2010, 09:00:55 PM »

Quote from: Busted Knuckle
More power, more power! Just like our hero Tim the tool man Taylor says.
Grin  BK  Grin


Quote from: morefire
All my friends call me that Embarrassed


But I think it would be an awesome coach with an opened up ISX600 installed.  Re programed to bypass all the emissions stuff and run an opened up muffler, and reset it to 650hp Grin


Shoot why stop @ 650? Let's go 850!
Or better yet get ahold of these guys - http://www.pittsburghpower.com/index.php?manufacturers_id=4&sort=4a&filter_id=24

They been making sic horsepower cumaparts for yrs! Wink (1250-1650 hp street-able coal haulers!)
Grin  BK  Grin
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Busted Knuckle aka Bryce Gaston
KY Lakeside Travel's Busted Knuckle Garage
Huntingdon, TN 12 minutes N of I-40 @ exit 108
www.kylakesidetravel.net

Grin Keep SMILING it makes people wonder what yer up to! Grin (at least thats what momma always told me! Grin)
luvrbus
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« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2010, 07:13:39 AM »

FWIW I have a friend very high up in the food chain at Southern Plains Cummins and he said not to take that engine above 570 hp or you will regret it


good luck
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TomC
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« Reply #27 on: December 01, 2010, 07:16:35 AM »

If you like the Caterpillar engine so much, why don't you run it?  The C12 is an excellent engine available up to 500hp and 1650lb/ft torque for motorhomes.  The C12 is much smaller then the ISX and weighs about 700lbs less.  Any Caterpillar engine that is 2006 or older is good.  They ran into problems with their ACERT technology and twin turbos after 2007 engines.  If you want a big block, the 3406B or C mechanical are, in my opinion, the most reliable engines ever made.  The 3406E, C15, C16 are good too-but physically very large.  ALL Caterpillar engines that were used in trucks are still in production.  One of the considerations on my 1985 Kenworth conversion was the availability of engine parts for my 3406B mechanical jacket water aftercooled engine.  Caterpillar is still making the 3406C which is almost exactly the same engine for generator, pump and compressor applications.  Truck service centers are going to continue to service Caterpillars for a long time since there are still thousands running in trucks and buses.  

Trying to run a 2010 engine is going to be a real challenge.  Not only do you have to have all the electronics, but the exhaust after treatment has to be used-the engine will not run without it.  Except for International Maxxforce engines, all others are using a catalytic converter, particulate trap, and DEF (Diesel Exhaust Fluid made from Urea and water) reaction chamber.  Freightliner has an all in one unit that uses twin cats and traps, and twin DEF reaction chambers in what looks like a rectangular fuel tank-very compact.  If you do go this route-probably have to find a wrecked truck with all components still in tacked to use.  Not an easy way to go.  Also-will have to find room for a 13 gallon DEF tank.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
usbusin
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« Reply #28 on: December 01, 2010, 11:02:59 AM »

Why mess around with an ISX?  Here is a real engine!  3424 hp

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/11/30/video-ever-seen-a-v24-diesel-rock-the-dyno/#continued
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Gary D

USBUSIN was our 1960 PD4104 for 16 years Ustruckin' is our 2001 Freightliner truck conversion
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« Reply #29 on: December 01, 2010, 01:11:08 PM »



Did I see Don Fairfield hiding in the corner looking on.  Bet he will have to top this soon.

uncle ned

we will alcohol injection in stead of nitrous
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4104's forever
6v92 v730
Huggy Bear
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