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Author Topic: Genset vibration dampners, What are you using?  (Read 5546 times)
grantgoold
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« on: September 05, 2006, 09:18:20 PM »

I am getting ready to install my diesel genset. The unit weighs about 660 lbs. I want to dampen the vibration if possible. I also am going to build a box to quite the unit and install high efficiency fans to help with cooling. The unit is on a joey bed for easy access and maintenance.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.  Cool

3 cylinder Deutz diesel with a 47 kw generator. I know, that is alot of electricity. I got the complete unit at a price I couldn't pass up and the owner had no idea the kw output. Valley Power did a total check and replaced the resistor board and we are off to the races. I have an additional panel on the unit for external connections of 120 and 240 volts. I am thinking of selling power when the first big earthquake or flood hits Shocked


Have a great day! Grin

Grant



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Grant Goold
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Citrus Heights, California
TomC
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« Reply #1 on: September 05, 2006, 09:34:14 PM »

First off, your Deutz will most likely start to wet stack-meaning oil and fuel will be passing unburned into the exhaust from the unit not getting loaded up enough.  Most Diesel gensets like to run at about 80%.  I don't think you have a 37kw load if you tried.  It would serve you better to sell that gen and with the money buy a 7.5kw if you have two roof airs, 10kw if you have three roof airs, 12kw with all electrical, with 20kw (because some 20kw are turboed) being the largest you'd ever need.  Also, since the Deutz is air cooled (I'm assuming) it'll be much louder than a water cooled.  Course, you'll do what you want-just trying to aim you in a different direction so you don't create problems with that too large generator.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2006, 06:06:35 PM »

First off, your Deutz will most likely start to wet stack-meaning oil and fuel will be passing unburned into the exhaust from the unit not getting loaded up enough.  Most Diesel gensets like to run at about 80%.  I don't think you have a 37kw load if you tried.  It would serve you better to sell that gen and with the money buy a 7.5kw if you have two roof airs, 10kw if you have three roof airs, 12kw with all electrical, with 20kw (because some 20kw are turboed) being the largest you'd ever need.  Also, since the Deutz is air cooled (I'm assuming) it'll be much louder than a water cooled.  Course, you'll do what you want-just trying to aim you in a different direction so you don't create problems with that too large generator.  Good Luck, TomC

Tom is right Grant. Sell that puppy on Ebay and buy your self a brand new proprly sized one buddy. heck you'll probobly even pocket some cash if it's in that good of shape. I did just that. Bought a 12kw 3 phase (remeber that guys?) from
gasauctions.gov for $1,600. Turned around and sold it on e-bay for$3,900 who drove all the way from kentcky to pick it up. Bought a brand new 8kw from powertec In Florida for nearly the same money.
Greg Paciga (S.Ga.)
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« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2006, 05:14:42 AM »

Nobody really answered the question on vibration isolators.  Someone suggested using pneumatic tires.  I saw some at Tractor Supply Saturday for $4.99 each that would be great for this.  Basically weld an steel rod to the generator and use that for an axle.  Then put a strap around the tire to hold the generator in place.

Brian Elfert
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Frank @ TX
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« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2006, 06:32:17 AM »

We have a 10KW "Mattin" generator ( 3 cyl Yamar )
I use ( 4 ) vibration isolaters that look like the air bags on the MCI.
I fill them with about 35 PSI.
I think they work great.
Frank
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grantgoold
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« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2006, 06:58:35 AM »

Thanks for the input on the dampners. We contacted a local vendor who builds dampners for larger equipment. He gave us the material he suggested. The deutz genset is "vibration free" and it works nicely on our dampner material. We decided to change out the gen head to an 18 kw (traded in the 47 kw and made some money) and keep the diesel engine with only 40 hours of run time. Installed and it works great. The only issue now is beginning to work on the sound. Lots of suggestions on that deal.

Thanks again.

Grant

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Grant Goold
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« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2006, 08:22:23 AM »

The hardest thing about making a sound enclosure for the Deutz is getting the hot air out.  I'm not sure of the setup on your Deutz, but I've seen some that have the exhaust of the hot air in a rectangular frame on the back of the engine so you could attach a duct to it.  Suggestion-call Dick Wright at Wrico International. He knows of sound deadening plywood, leaded foam insulation, and could advise on duct work to fold the air to quiet the engine.  The idea is to have the air go around at least two corners then it will quiet the air.  I have an Onan 6kw air cooled with Vacuflo air-where the blower sucks the air over the engine then blows it out.  It is one of the noisest engines I've ever heard.  Even with the genset in a sound box, I can hear it running 100ft away.  Perhaps consider making a box inside a box with an electric squirrel cage blower on the intake side?  I still maintain the engine on your setup is to big for the application and you're going to run into problems with wet stacking and carbon buildup inside the engine.  Personally-I would have sold the entire setup and bought a 10kw Kubota powered genset-there's a real good reason why the small Kubota, Yanmar, Isuzu,etc water cooled are used so extensively.  They're quiet, reliable, many service outlets to work on them (Deutz is good too in that way) and last a long time.  Had one truck driver friend with a 7.5kw Powertech 3 cylinder Kubota that had over 23,000hrs on it and was still running without smoking when he sold the truck!  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2006, 11:23:48 AM »

I love this board. All the suggestions are great! I was able to make the transition to a smaller genset and actually make money. I know there are better options. As I send kids away to college and such, I hope to be able to exercise those options, right now I live with what I have. I am in the entire genset project less than $500.00 and the additional monies are spent on more frequently used items inside the bus or in maintenance.

Thanks again for all your help! It really make have the "beast" a bit more acceptable to the family when I sound like I know what I am talking about.

Regards,

Grant
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Grant Goold
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« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2006, 12:15:15 PM »

I do not think you made a transition to a smaller genset. You made a transition to only a smaller alternator. The engine is still somewhere in the 50-60 hp range. Much too large for the size alternator you installed. I think that is what Tom is talking about which will cause wet stacking and carbon buildup from running the engine so lightly loaded.
Richard

I love this board. All the suggestions are great! I was able to make the transition to a smaller genset and actually make money. I know there are better options. As I send kids away to college and such, I hope to be able to exercise those options, right now I live with what I have. I am in the entire genset project less than $500.00 and the additional monies are spent on more frequently used items inside the bus or in maintenance.

Thanks again for all your help! It really make have the "beast" a bit more acceptable to the family when I sound like I know what I am talking about.

Regards,

Grant
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Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
grantgoold
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« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2006, 04:17:05 PM »

I did make a mistake. I did go with a 28 kw not 18 kw alternater and the 3 cylinder Deutz engine. Per the Deutz mechanic he thought that the engine rated to run at 1800 would not wet stack after I explained to him the types of loads I would be asking of the genset. And the time I would be using the unit. I was very specific based on the feedback of this board regarding any issues of underloading the unit. Although I realize I am fitting in the non-traditional genset into the system, I plan on using the system very little and only when my 50 amp service is not available.

I also cannot afford the 5,000 to 15,000 dollars for the nicer better fit units.

I have also heard of something that provides a phantom or false load on the genset to keep wet stack at a minumum. Anybody had experience with these units?

Thanks again for all the input. I love the challenge and the feedback.

Grant

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Grant Goold
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TomC
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« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2006, 04:26:05 PM »

At generator shops, they use big heating coils to load up the generators for load testing.  Maybe you could get a 10kw heater for that purpose.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2006, 04:36:26 PM »

Yes, these are big heating coils and are called load banks and they are fairly large generally. They also have a large fan to remove the heat from the coils. I do not think you want to go there. From the use you describe, I think you will be OK.
Richard

At generator shops, they use big heating coils to load up the generators for load testing.  Maybe you could get a 10kw heater for that purpose.  Good Luck, TomC
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Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body. But rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, a good Reisling in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming:  WOO HOO, what a ride
Greg Paciga (S.Ga)
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« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2006, 06:43:38 PM »

"a 10kw Kubota powered genset-there's a real good reason why the small Kubota, Yanmar, Isuzu,etc water cooled are used so extensively.  They're quiet, reliable, many service outlets to work on them (Deutz is good too in that way) and last a long time.  Had one truck driver friend with a 7.5kw Powertech 3 cylinder Kubota that had over 23,000hrs on it and was still running without smoking when he sold the truck!  Good Luck, TomC'

Just to add to that Tom. Fred Hobe has almost that many hours on his Kubota 8kw powertech. That's why I bought mine.
NOW..The real proof. We have the Red cross come into our Distribution center once a year for the annual blood drive with the bluebird bus they ususally come in with. Just last month I happen to notice they had the generator door open. Guess what they had??
A 4 cyl. Kubota driven 12.5 kw powertech. I couldn't help but lean down and scrap the crud of the hour meter. 42,200+ hours. I'm SOLD.
LOL

Greg Paciga (S. Ga.)
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Chris 85 RTS
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« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2006, 06:45:45 AM »

I used air tires to support my PowerTech Genset, 8kw, and provide a way to roll it out the back for service.  See pic below or here for more pics:

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cpeters1_32950/album?.dir=4b68

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belfert
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« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2006, 07:15:09 AM »

I used air tires to support my PowerTech Genset, 8kw, and provide a way to roll it out the back for service.  See pic below or here for more

I just bought the same genset.  Doesn't the Powertech already have vibration isolators built in so none have to be added?  My reason for buying the Powertech is so I wouldn't have to do soundproofing and vibration isolation.

Brian Elfert
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