Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
October 26, 2014, 12:57:07 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an Online Subscription: It arrives at least two weeks before the First Class printed magazine.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Waht is the correct maximum age for tires?  (Read 4097 times)
belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5448




Ignore
« on: January 22, 2011, 02:49:42 PM »

I've heard anywhere from 5 years to 10 years as the maximum age for bus/RV tires.  Is there a correct age?

My tires will be five years old in April.  I have no intention at this point of replacing them this year, but probably in 2012 unless they will last longer than that.  If I had to replace them this year I probably wouldn't be using the bus at all this year.  I should have the money saved up by next year I hope.  My tires don't seem to have any cracking yet.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
robertglines1
steam nut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4024





Ignore
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2011, 02:53:35 PM »

10 yrs=aged out   can't cap over 5yrs old  My philosophy don't buy over 5 don't run past 10...    Bob
Logged

Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
bevans6
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4764


1980 MCI MC-5C




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2011, 03:14:36 PM »

the correct maximum age is when the tire is no longer safe.  Since you have to inspect the tire internally to know that, and x-raying tire carcasses isn't cheap, we life them based on simple age.  My tire guy says he will demount and inspect my tires for me, if I want, since mine are around 6 years old, but he says he's had tires as old as mine accepted by the recapper, and some that are 2 years old rejected.

I think the 5 to 10 year thought is good, it's not what I would call a rule, and it depends a whole lot on what the tires have done and where they've been.  Dry and in the shade is a whole lot different than Arizona sun or Florida swamps.

I like the idea of replacing them two at a time, every two years.  Put a new set of steers on, rotate them to the drives, then to the tags if you have them.  I've lost a drive before, no muss no fuss, drove back to the yard.  A steer position  is where you need your best tires.  Just my thoughts.

Brian
Logged

1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Spicer 8844 4 speed Zen meditation device
Vintage race cars -
1978 Lola T440 Formula Ford
1972 NTM MK-4 B/SR
blank
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1929




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2011, 03:29:25 PM »

  Is there a law as to maximum age a casing can be to recap? I thought that was up to the recap company.

  Ive seen so many brand new tires fail shortly after install, I would feel much more comfortable moving low mileage rears forward as steers than blindly trusting a new set of tires on the front.

  I also think there is a far more interest in tire age, rather than the greater importance of condition, tire quality and grade, proper size, load rating, inspection and maintenence. Makes people believe their tires will magically self destruct the day after their 7th birthday. IOW, I would have far more trust in a set of decent looking 12 year old Goodyears or Michelins, than I would a new set of China brand garbage. You have to keep things in perspective.
Logged
rv_safetyman
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2199


Jim Shepherd


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2011, 03:43:12 PM »

The official word from Michelin is here:

http://www.michelinrvtires.com/michelinrv/toolbox/reference-material.jsp

At the bottom of the list is the document you want. 

Bottom line is 10 years, max.

I have talked to the major Bandag recap facility in Denver, and they told me that they will not recap a tire that has a date code more than 7 years old.  I later found out that the 7 year limit for them is not mandated by DOT regulations.

I have said this several times in other threads, you old 22.5 or 24.5 tire is worth significant $$$ to local truckers.  They use them on trailers and are not bound by any DOT rule.

Jim
Logged

Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
í85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
Somewhere between a tin tent and a finished product
Bus Project details: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog:  http://rvsafetyman.blogspot.com/
boxcarOkie
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1452





Ignore
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2011, 03:51:30 PM »

10 yrs=aged out   can't cap over 5yrs old  My philosophy don't buy over 5 don't run past 10...    Bob

This is going to open up a can of worms for sure. 

I run mine about seven years and then I toss 'em regardless of tread wear.  Rubber compounds and sidewalls tend to break down after about five years, I have run tires that looked like a million bucks with a whole lot of tread. and they failed and blew.  They were nine years old at the time, and had very little actual miles on them.

My last set went to a dump truck owner when I replaced all of mine on the bus.  They had at least 85% of their tread left but they were seven years old.  The tire dealer wouldn't give me anything for them, stating that they "did not buy tires over four years old" and as far as the law is concerned, I know of no such law concerning tire life etc.  Only law I know of is no cap's on the steering axles, that is about it.

I agree with Bob ... rather throw them away than go to the ditch.

BCO
Logged

belfert
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5448




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2011, 05:00:49 PM »

I bought all 8 tires at the same time, so I probably need to replace them all at once.  I suppose I could start tire replacement this summer two or four at a time, but the tires replaced this summer would still have a year or two left in them.

My real question is what is the right age to replace them at?  Answers seem to vary all over the place.  Over at RV.net I see a lot of people advocating 5 years and Michelin says up to 10 years.  10 years seems extreme to me, but 5 years is probably too early.

I have an enclosed trailer with tires that are almost 10 years old now.  I took the trailer to a tire shop in 2009 and they said the tires were just fine at that point.  I should probably get them replaced this summer since they will be 10 years old.
Logged

Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
white-eagle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1184





Ignore
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2011, 06:33:11 AM »

i think some others already alluded to this, but wear and tear and how much you sit has a lot to do with how well the tires age.  Our Michilin's were 02 and 03,  with minor spider cracks going part way around close to the rim.  the tread was good.  Michelin told me 10 years is no issue as long as you ran them enough to keep the rubber additives moving around within the tire by driving regularly.  i'd been told that by others also.
i changed out the front's this year becuase i wore out the edge's due to bad bearings.  i put the old front tires on the bogies.  then i blew a rear outside dual.  i had a spare which really looked bad, so i got a deal from goodyear, and trade-ins on the remaining 3.  i would have run the drive's for another couple years at least if i had not blown one and gotten a good deal on the others.
i have 11r24.5's also, which means it's a commercial grade vs RV grade.  another reason the RV folks say change after 5 years.  but they sit a lot all winter in florida and texas.  i don't.

Bottom line with me because we drive a lot, is how's the tread and the stress cracks, not the age.  i suppose if they were over 10 years, i'd have figured i got my money's worth.
Logged

Tom
1991 Eagle 15 and proud of it.
8V92T, 740, Fulltime working on the road.

Fran was called to a higher duty 12/16/13. I lost my life navigator.
jjrbus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2313

MCI5C/N Ft Myers FL




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2011, 11:18:22 AM »

 It seemed reasonable to sell the Michelin steer tires at 6 years old and replace with new rather than let them age out. Why ride on tires that may or may not be ok?? Tag's/drivers maybe, steers, not me! The tires mounted and balanced were an easy sell on Ebay   JIm
Logged

Remember, even at a Mensa convention someone is the dumbest person in the room!

http://photobucket.com/buspictures

http://photobucket.com/buspictures
Ace
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1217





Ignore
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2011, 12:18:37 PM »

Ok get this! While in Acadia,i put out 2 very good almost new 315-80rx22.5 Michelen's mounted on alcoa polished wheels for an asking price if 700 bucks and although a lot of lookers, no buyers. Rumor had it that the date was too old being 2002. These have never been stored out in the sun.   Always been in a garage even when on the coach. I was told they were dry rotted from the inside out. I hardly think that its the case but more likely to be a lack of funds although one local non busser offered me 300 for the pair. My comment was, if I didn't use them myself, which I still might, I would have a bon fire wheels and all! If you looked at these, you would think they were pretty new!
Logged

Ace Rossi
Lakeland, Fl. 33810
Prevost H3-40
loosenut
Confidently Ignorant
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 407




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2011, 03:28:10 PM »

FWIW, I write this only to give you some data points.  The OO told me the Michelin tires were original to the bus meaning 24 years old when I purchased.  There were no symbols on the tire to collaborate her testimony. 

In addition to many 10-20 mile trips to the beach; I made a couple of longer excursions without problems, approximately 200 miles each, while arranging for new tires.  I bought new tires mainly because of this site.  The tires only had 34,000 miles on them and minor checking.

I recently found the bus's mileage log indicating that most of OO's longer trips, including one to the east coast from the west coast were after the tires were 10 years old.  I don't know if that reflects on Michelin or tire technology in general.

It's entirely possible my experience is an anomaly because as an amateur I drive slower and much shorter distances per day.

Mike
Logged

Sold 85 Neoplan 33ft 6V92ta, sadly busless
white-eagle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1184





Ignore
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2011, 04:37:16 PM »

and i know another who was driving on 20 year old tires, and in his opinion, safely.  I still think knowing the history is as important as knowing the date code.

i wouldn't arbitrarily trade out tires until and unless i felt they were unsafe based on my drive habits and my visual inspection.  Maybe at 10 years.

Ace, i looked at them, but wrong size.  i could've used the wheels since goodyear scratched mine up.
Logged

Tom
1991 Eagle 15 and proud of it.
8V92T, 740, Fulltime working on the road.

Fran was called to a higher duty 12/16/13. I lost my life navigator.
Geoff
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 531





Ignore
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2011, 04:55:34 PM »

Im running 10 year old Firestone HP-300 315-80R-22.5 and there is no sign of weathering or cracking.  I've got about 65,000 miles on them, and just got back from a 300 mile run with them.  I'm keeping a close eye on them, and don't plan on buying new ones anytime soon.
Logged

Geoff
'82 RTS AZ
Ace
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1217





Ignore
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2011, 05:42:13 PM »

I can see changing them out if there are obvious cracks but if there are none, my advice is to run them.

Also I never heard of tires dry rotting from the inside out. Anyone else?
Logged

Ace Rossi
Lakeland, Fl. 33810
Prevost H3-40
Seayfam
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 453





Ignore
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2011, 06:29:20 PM »

I've changed out tires that were 10 to 20 years old with dry rot on the outside and looked new inside.
FWIW
Logged

Gary Seay (location Alaska)
1969 MCI MC-6 unit# 20006
8V92 turbo 740 auto
more pics and information here     "  www.my69mci-6.blogspot.com  "
Barn Owl
Roanoke, VA
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2049


PD4106-1063 "Wheezy Bus"




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2011, 09:31:22 PM »

Quote
Michelin told me 10 years is no issue as long as you ran them enough to keep the rubber additives moving around within the tire by driving regularly.

Yes, absolutely correct!

I will have to call to get the technical term for rubber failure from non-use, I forgot the term after being told only a few months ago. I have had personal experience with this on several levels, and only recently found out about it. A little over a year ago I found my favorite work boot on sale with free shipping. The price was good enough that I bought two pairs and put one away. First pair far exceeded my expectations and I decided to break out the unused pair. After wearing them several times the Vibram soles split cross-ways across the sole. I thought I had a defective pair of shoes. I called the manufacture and was told that not wearing the shoes was the cause of the problem. Exercising and bending the rubber on a regular basis is good for it (That's why the first pair is doing so well). Letting them sit will cause the rubber to harden and split as soon as they bend. Tires are no different. That explains why I have had to throw away some "good tires" after storing them for a few years unmounted and unused. They looked to be a hundred years old when the sister set on the vehicle had many years/miles left on them. I have talked to the Michelin regional rep many times about tires and this is what I am doing. When my tires turned 10yrs old they go to the back only, and I bought good used 6yr tires for the front. Even having to do this every four years is less expensive than doing new every ten. If you can afford better do it. This goes back to my Good, Better, Best theory that I discussed in another tread.
Logged

L. Christley - W3EYE Amateur Extra
Blue Ridge Mountains, S.W. Virginia
Itís the education gained, and the ability to apply, and share, what we learn.
Have fun, be great, that way you have Great Fun!
luvrbus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 12772




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2011, 10:49:40 AM »

Fwiw tires can be sold as new tire up to 6 years after that if you ever bought a blimpshed tire more than likely they were tires over 6 years old. If no checking on the tire run those puppies.
I bought recaps for my trailers that were on 15 year on casing before and they never were a problem for me,you guys ever wonder why the tire co's put this info out I don't think it is about your safety lol



good luck
Logged

Life is short drink the good wine first
kyle4501
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3145


PD4501 South Carolina




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2011, 11:59:57 AM »

I know it ain't a bus, but I had a tire blow out on my Suburban. The tire was the spare that was put on due to road debris killing the new pirelli. I put on the old firestone spare & aired it up to proper spec. no checks or cracks- it looked almost new. The firestone was the correct tire & matched the others in size & weight capacity. I checked all tires at every stop. Less than 15 minutes after a rest stop, it blew out at 60+ mph. (not fun in heavy traffic pulling a 32' camper!)

I used to believe that you could judge a tire by it's looks. I too scoffed at those who insisted they had good looking tires fail at 6 years old.
NOT ANY MORE! That blowout convinced me that it ain't worth the risk.

If my max speeds are low (55 mph max), I might reconsider if the tires are only lightly loaded (less than 50% of rated capacity) & dualled out, but I'm definitely not taking chances on the steers. . . .

Be safe in your travels!

edit to add:
Rubber is not water proof, which means moisture can migrate thru the sidewall to the steel belts & once they begin to rust, a tire failure is on the way. Sad
« Last Edit: January 24, 2011, 12:03:16 PM by kyle4501 » Logged

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (R.M. Nixon)
jjrbus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2313

MCI5C/N Ft Myers FL




Ignore
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2011, 04:24:40 PM »



edit to add:
Rubber is not water proof, which means moisture can migrate thru the sidewall to the steel belts & once they begin to rust, a tire failure is on the way. Sad

 I learn something new everyday! Cheesy
Logged

Remember, even at a Mensa convention someone is the dumbest person in the room!

http://photobucket.com/buspictures

http://photobucket.com/buspictures
kyle4501
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3145


PD4501 South Carolina




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2011, 04:55:26 PM »

It would probably be more correct to say that moisture can work it's way thru rubber easier when the plasticisers have leached out.
When a tire sits, the plasticisers make their way to the surface - ever motice that white waxy film on a tire? That's the plasticizers that have leached out.
Using the tire causes the sidewalls to flex & that flexing action works to redistribute those plasticisers back into the rubber.

At least, that's the way I remember it. . . . .
Logged

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (R.M. Nixon)
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!