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Author Topic: possible 4104 floorplan... comments?  (Read 3804 times)
LesBerg
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« on: April 10, 2011, 07:36:22 PM »

I've been playing with a possible floorplan for a 4104 based on a few constraints:

  • maximize floorspace and size of living areas
  • make it as 'livable' as possible; e.g. spacious bath, avoid cramped spaces
  • need desk space for the kids for homework, art, etc

The master bead outline is a double, but adding 6 inches (one square) in length and width turns it into a queen size. The two outlines show either a) two possible 'permanent' locations, or b) a 'normal' position (light blue) and where it could be moved to for engine maintenance.

I had to pull measurements by 'educated guess' estimating measurements from pictures of the coach based on other 'known' measurements.
based on known measurements:
  • coach is 10 feet tall
  • 261 inch wheelbase
I educated guesses on:
  • side windows are 2 feet tall
  • the driver's space at about three feet or so from the windshield to midway through the rear triangle driver's window.
  • walls are about 2 inches thick
  • floor is just over three feet from the bottom of the coach, almost four feet from the ground
  • there are other guesstimated measurements... Tongue
  • interior 'thick' walls are 2" thick - pending learning better..  Tongue
oh - the square with the hacked-off corner in the bathroom is the 34 x 34 shower. It's that way because I'd rather have an 18" shower door on a 34" shower, than a 34" door on a 24" shower.

[edit] Plasma cutter application successful - we now have a 96" wide coach


oh - features:

* the tables fold in half and can be stored under the couches.
* the closets between the master bedroom and the bunks are basically identical. The top (driver's side) shows the bottom half, the other one shows the top half.
* every effort is being made in the master bedroom to keep the engine accessible and the emergency exit clear.
* Since I've never owned an RV, I haven't attempted to find locations for things like water heaters, ceiling vents, etc.

it's attached as an .xls file so you can actually read it
« Last Edit: April 10, 2011, 09:29:43 PM by LesBerg » Logged
DMoedave
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« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2011, 07:51:44 PM »

will the couch be in the way? looks tight to the stairs. Do you have a shell now or redoing one? I think one of the last BC mags the guy used cardboard to really mock up the interior. Its tough making multi purpose interiors, but if you can get out and see some coaches at rallys you can always get ideas. I used to take a camera to RV and boat shows for ideas. good luck
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we love our buses!!! NE Pa or LI NY, or somewhere in between!
LesBerg
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« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2011, 07:56:26 PM »

I'm going to be masochistic and model it in SolidWorks. I can either 'hack' it together quickly or I can take considerable time and do it right.

Either way, I'll be able to make a walk-through video and play with different material and fabric patterns. It would be a lot easier if I had a blueprint of the thing or at least a very detailed drawing with good dimensions.

We don't have one, but I started the plan too see what we would 'need' if we had to do heavy modifications.

I also figured to put together an approximate price list for the major components.

The stairs. The idea there was to fabricate a plywood insert for the stairwell and reroute the stairs to the very left right side of the bus. This would be accomplished by adding a retractable stair under the bottom (if there's room), making the first stair one step taller and diagonally joining the top stair. I'll see about posting a drawing of what I mean.

remember, one square is 6 inches, and I have no real idea how deep the drivers area is (windshield to back of driver's seat).
« Last Edit: April 10, 2011, 08:13:32 PM by LesBerg » Logged
zubzub
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« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2011, 08:34:04 PM »

well the first problem is it is going to be hard to find a 4104 (or any bus) that is 9' wide.Wink
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Highway Yacht
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« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2011, 08:38:01 PM »

I'm not very familiar with the 4104's but it does look good on paper.. Does a 4101 have enough headroom for side aisles like you have planned??

Jimmy
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LesBerg
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« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2011, 09:00:10 PM »

well the first problem is it is going to be hard to find a 4104 (or any bus) that is 9' wide.Wink

DOH!
Thats the second time I've done that.  Last time I made it a foot too short. I'll get it fixed. Where'd that plasma cutter get off too....
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Len Silva
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« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2011, 05:00:32 AM »

I think you are attempting to build a blivet, which we all did when laying out the first floor plan.

Starting in the bedroom, your template for the bed is off a bit.  In my 4104, I had a double bed with nothing along the side wall and it was pretty tight.  I have a queen now in my 102 MH, and there is only about a foot on either side, you still have to walk sideways in that little aisle and making the bed is a chore.

The available width in the 4104 is probably around 91-92".  You are showing 24" aisles throughout, which for me, would mean walking sideways.  I would allow at least 28"

You don't seem to be allowing enough for wall thickness, at least 3".

Unless you are very short, a side aisle in a 4104 is difficult because of the roof curve.  I like a side aisle and we are short enough to get by, but it would be tight.

Here is an actual 4104 plan that might help.  It's a very nice coach but I don't like the walk through bath.

http://www.precisioncoach.com/Tour/virtour.htm
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« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2011, 05:41:21 AM »

One thing to keep in mind is that if you have overhead cabinets running down both sides of the bus all of the ways to the front, you will have lots of storage but the bus will feel "cramped".  Its like a boat, everything is a compromise and you have to decide what you need versus what you want. As stated by others, the best thing that you can do is to go to a rally or two and look to see what others have done, especially in the model of bus that you want to get. Smiley
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1968 MCI 5A with 8V71 and Allison MT644 transmission.  Western USA
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« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2011, 05:51:02 AM »

Don't forget to add space behind the shower (one side or another) for your plumbing run.  You will also find that if you use a full height propane RV fridge, you have to build in space for a vent.  If you are average height or more, your shower will need to be farther from the wall so you don't hit your head.  GMC's really have a significant curve to their bodies that makes it difficult for side asiles and in general, they push tall construction into the middle.  I'm 5'0 and had to watch my head on the side walls!  You're off to a great start!  Do you have your 4104 already, or is this just the coach you have to have?

Good Luck!
Glenn
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Glenn Williams
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TomC
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« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2011, 07:09:21 AM »

The big sofa in the front making for a side entrance will not work because of the wheel well (if I remember right).  Even though the wheel well isn't that big, it is still in the way.
I would highly recommend you try for a center isle since the headroom in a 4104 is limited and side isle will cause you to duck down to not hit your head. You'll be able to get the same space usage by mounting things on the wall instead of in the middle.  Angles look nice, but take space.  Inline and squared off is most space efficient.
I don't know why you're using 2" walls-that consumes space.  In my bus I used all 3/4" plywood with reinforcements and works well.  On my shower (34x34) I mounted it 8" out from the wall to get more headroom and have space for the plumbing behind.  The remainder space between the wall and shower is a linen closet.
I think you're being a bit optimistic about the overall length space.  The rear bedroom is going to be closer to 2ft in from the rear because of the rear engine.  The front driver's compartment is closer to 4.5ft then 3ft (I say this since thee smallest cabover non sleeper cab made was a 54").  Good Luck, TomC
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robertglines1
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« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2011, 07:32:37 AM »

Don't think you will be happy with combo units washer dryer. separate units on sale for about same $ Stove could be replaced by smooth cook top and toaster oven. you would have to custom build shower stall.Height restrictions] next to toilet 6 inches is not enough(try sitting on a 5 gal bucket and doing required movements. Shower size wall thickness to accommodate plumbing.? available floor width around 90 inches usable. cardboard mock up is great idea. take a area and put tape on it the size of the inside of bus then tape out floor plan and see if it works. In the end do it your way! suggestions only after 4 builds myself.
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« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2011, 07:42:57 AM »

At least you have a general idea of what you want! That is important! Something I have read and intend on doing as it gets time to build is to use cardboard mock-ups in place of the stuff you want, that way you will be sure and it wont be back breaking to change things around.
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« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2011, 11:34:50 AM »

  My tentative plans are to (walking forward) have a rear bedroom w/centered matress, walk through bath with full size tub, kitchen/galley area, then lounge area. Kitchen dinette fold down to bed. Sofa makes a bed, making it sleep four to five. MC5's are pretty curved along the sides too, and side isles seem to waste space to me. For one thing, if you wall off the isle you have to keep it more or less clear to walk through. In a wide open room people can have their feet out and spread out a bit. You also cant hang cabinets on that side, limiting storage space. Just my own observation.

  Whoever started on my Bus put a wall behind the driver so tight I dont have enough room to slide the seat back where I want it. Thats going to change. The driving position has to one of the biggest priorities IMHO.

  As useful as it is to draw things out, until you are standing inside your own Bus I dont think youll fully realise what your dealing with. That everything is a compromise is an understatement, and youll run out of room faster than you think if you dont plan carefully. One thing about the RV industry that stands out, is the endless ideas they come up with to utilise space. A good source of ideas for us roundy roof Bus owners would be to take some good hard observations of current Airstream trailers. On the other extreme is our Bounder with its 2 foot deep dash and having the seating position 5 feet back from the windshield. Total waste of space, but all done to make it look more spacious and bold. I thought it was neat to be able to scootch forward and look almost straight down at the highway rolling underneath in the MC5. That would be impossible in the Bounder. But having that seating position moved forward in the MC5, gives me almost 2 feet more floor space, making the overall increase almost 5 feet while the Bus is only 3 feet longer overall. Kind ofa win win situation.

  Good luck.
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RnMAdventures
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« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2011, 05:26:57 PM »

I like your overall layout. What program are you using to design it? Because of the headroom on the sides of the 4104, I think you may consider using the center isle, especially if you plan to fulltime. Having a co-pilot seat that close up front would be nice, but you will probably have to drop it back and to the side a little. Some folks put a board over the stairway after they are loaded up so the copilot can put thier feet one it. There should be a way to custom build a seat stand that will slide forward once you are seated, if you prefer that particular position.

Good luck
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Mike & Rosemarie
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« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2011, 06:05:14 PM »

Is there some special reasoning for you in not looking at a 40 ft bus you are so limited on what you can do to a 35 ft 4104

good luck
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