Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
September 16, 2014, 04:35:06 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an E-Mag Subscription: You can zoom in to make the text larger and easier to read.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: GAS instant hot water heater (again) :)  (Read 3501 times)
Chaz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1508


4108, 8V71 w/auto .


WWW

Ignore
« on: August 01, 2011, 10:48:27 AM »

I'm glad Will brought up the electric instantaneous water heater thread. I am "kinda" considering one of those but I think I would rather have a gas one. I just don't know which gas one.  Embarrassed   
I have a regular 6 gallon typical gas water heater now, and it does OK but, it's "Owner" is the weak link. (blond. Roll Eyes) I like the idea of not wasting gas when I forget to turn it off and having hot water without having to remember to turn it on.  Roll Eyes Grin 
I don't think my hot water needs are too great but I will check my shower to see how much it flows. (I have the little chrome shower head with the on/off button. It's almost a mister!)

I thought all I needed was the fridge to get my kitchen renovation going but, I kinda forgot about the water heater. Altho it's going to go down in a bay, I still want to know what I am doing for the heater before I start in on the kitchen. (the current gas 6 gallon one is in there)

Sooooo, any suggestions?? I think the fridge that you guys recommended will work out great, now I need some ideas on a water heater.

Thanx,
Chaz
Logged

Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein
Utahclaimjumper
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 838




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2011, 02:41:49 PM »

Check out the price of one of those first Chaz.>>>Dan
Logged

Utahclaimjumper 
 EX 4106 (presently SOB)
Cedar City, Ut.
 72 VW Baja towed
PP
Will & Wife
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1049



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2011, 03:35:48 PM »

Chaz, I have only found 1 gas unit that is supposed to be a direct replacement for the standard 6 or 10 gal RV water heater. It's designed specifically for RV use, but unless you have an exterior vent like most RV's (I don't) you have to purchase the remote venting system also. The unit runs about $1000. to 1500. depending on where you source it, and another $250. for the remote vent kit. If you want to know more about it, just ask, and when I get home tonight I'll look up the literature on it.
Will

It just came to me-Precision temp RV-500. And I believe Girard manufactures one that's avail through AdventureRV for less $.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2011, 03:42:13 PM by PP » Logged

Chaz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1508


4108, 8V71 w/auto .


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2011, 04:23:34 PM »

Whooooaaaaa....... Dang. That be a bit o' cabbage! I was actually looking at something like this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Instant-on-Demand-Tankless-Hot-water-heater-GAS-12L-/130554242669?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e65a3a66d

I have not gone into depth on checking them out yet since I thought maybe I could get a good start here. I will do some more reading I guess. If they are going to be much over this price............ I gotta bail on the idea.

As far as venting, no problemo. I was figuring out a bay door. Thoughts??
Logged

Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein
Mex-Busnut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1135





Ignore
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2011, 04:47:47 PM »

Hey Chaz:

I have been considering this dilema as well. I was thinking of putting my propane water heater in the now-empty former OTR A/C bay. There is a stainless steel vent above this bay, just below the window, that was the squirrel-cage-blower's air intake. (You can see it in the picture.) Maybe I can adapt that to vent the exhaust of my gas water heater.

I would probably have a problem with an electric heater. as the vast majority of RV parks down here don't provide 50-amp hookups.
  
« Last Edit: August 01, 2011, 04:52:18 PM by Mex-Busnut » Logged

Dr. Steve, San Juan del Río, Querétaro, Mexico, North America, Planet Earth, Milky Way.
1981 Dina Olímpico (Flxible Flxliner clone), 6V92TA Detroit Diesel
Rockwell model RM135A 9-speed manual tranny.
Jake brakes
100 miles North West of Mexico City, Mexico. 6,800 feet altitude.
Scott Bennett
Scott & Heather MCI-9
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1284


Scott & Heather


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2011, 05:41:50 PM »

FWIW, we just bought and installed a Sears/Kenmore 30 gallon electric (single 1650 watt element) shorty (stubby) unit in our water bay. Works great, and haven't run out of hot water yet...even with two long, hot showers, back-to-back. Unit was $300, and rated very highly by the reviews I read. We're on 30 amp service right now and haven't had an issue yet. 
Logged

Scott & Heather
1984 MCI9 6V92-turbo with 9 inch roof raise & conversion in progress.
http://www.scottmichaelbennett.com/p/our-bus.html
˙ǝɯoɔlǝʍ suoıʇɐuop ˙snq ʍǝu ɐ pǝǝu ʎlqɐqoɹd ll,ǝʍ 'sıɥʇ pɐǝɹ uɐɔ noʎ ɟı
pabusnut
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 312


P8M4905A-333 former MK&O lines #731




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2011, 05:57:57 PM »

Chaz,

I am trying out a tankless gas unit that is designed for a cabin or outdoor shower use.

It says "not designed for indoor use", but I think that is because it uses indoor air for combustion.  I am mounting it near the roof above the toilet and am using a double wall exhaust pipe.  Most of our RV use will be during the summer, I can keep the bathroom vent open, so I think I will have enough air for combustion.  If I need air for combustion, I can build a power vent later.   I didn't want to put any heater in a bay or the side of the bus, because I am not a fan of cutting holes in the structure. 

I also left space in my "utilities bay" for a 10 gallon 110V AC unit, for when I am plugged into campground electric.  If I pipe it in series with the tankless unit, I can choose either when I am plugged in at a campsite.

Until it is finished and tested I won't really know, but my three potential problems as I see them are: 1) not enough temperature rise to get good hot water, 2) hard to regulate output temperature(it has controls for flow of water in, temperature, and gas flow) , and 3) I am the only adult male who will use it--and since the hot water will be endless-the tank will run dry before it is my turn unless I go first!!!! Grin

Steve Toomey
pabusnut

Logged

Steve Toomey
PAbusnut
Fred Mc
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 367




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2011, 06:18:01 PM »

I think
I have mentioned before that I have a Paloma gas fired unit. It is about 25 years old but somewhat resembles the unit you linked to. Mine has a gas pilot lite while the linked one has a piezo lighter which I like.
I have mine mounted on a bay wall and have a short 4 inch exhaust pipe that vents through the bay door. The vent hole is covered by a round louvered cover.

The unit works great. As long as you have gas and water you have hot water. If hooked to city water you can shower for an hour if you want.

Only one thing to watch out for which took me years to figure out. The flow of hot water is governed by the back pressure pressure in the system.. So if you have a shower head that is a water saver type it will create back pressure which MAY shut off the gas and the HOT water. Not an insurmountable problem if you realize what is going on.
I was showing mine off to a fellow bus nut many years ago. He said that he had the same unit but got rid of it because he had the same problem I had with the heater shutting off due to back pressure. He never did figure it out and simply got rid of it.

Make sure that if you install one you make it easy to drain for winterizing.

Go for it.

Fred Mc

GM PD4106
Logged
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6775





Ignore
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2011, 09:26:46 PM »

Chaz-as stated before, I use two 10gal water heaters-one plumbed into the next with the final one wired through the inverter for hot water while driving.  They've been in use since I started my conversion in 1994 (showering at the bus after working on it-like today) and I haven't had any maintenance issues with them.  Just drain them when I remember to.  If the element goes-Wal Mart, Kmart, Home Depot, etc carries the screw in element for about $20.00.  And with 1500 watt elements, I can heat one water heater at a time on even a 20 amp plug.  Can't do that with an electric instant water heater.  Do you think that propane instant water heater will give you over 17 years of trouble free service like my two electric water heaters has?  Good Luck, TomC
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
RoyJ
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 177





Ignore
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2011, 11:39:03 PM »

I have a $140 propane fire instant hot water heater that I bought off ebay couple years ago. Works great for me.

The thing is, if you need a little bit of hot water here and there, then it's not as convenient as a tank unit, as the water takes a little while to heat up. For showers, it works great because you have virtually unlimited hot water. But for boondocking, it's not as water efficient as a tank heater.
Logged
Chaz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1508


4108, 8V71 w/auto .


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2011, 11:41:23 AM »

I really like your idea, Steve!! But I'm trying to save space. But I'm going to keep it in mind.
Thanx for the info, Fred. Not sure what you have to do to rectify the problem tho, get a larger flow head?Huh That's kind of a bummer when you're trying to save water. OH!!! Hey, what about a bypass back to the tank??? I was wanting to do that anyway for the initial cold water so I wouldn't waste it. I could leave it run just enough to hold the pressure I need, if necessary. Hmmmmmm........ Roll Eyes  Roll Eyes  Roll Eyes
I'm with ya Tom. I'm just not wanting to use electricity. Especially for as little as I use it. If I start doing months in it, maybe then. Thanx.
Thanx Roy. I reeeeally appreciate the insight. The return run to the tank may be the hot ticket if water will be an issue at some time. That's easy with a shower but maybe overkill for the sinks. It will be really close to them. What is your brand?? And how big is it?? (8L or 12L or 20L??) I wouldn't mind buying a cheaper one if I think it will work.

Thanx again guys!!!!!!!!!
   Chaz
Logged

Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein
Chaz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1508


4108, 8V71 w/auto .


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2011, 09:47:28 AM »

Hey Steve! (pabusnut)
How did your "experiment" work out?? I was just curious as I need to pull the trigger on my heater, and I'm still up in the air on which one I should purchase.  Huh
The pressure thing, that Fred talked about, also worries me a bit . Presently, my pump(s) come on and off intermittently while taking a shower. (turns my radio on and off as well which is frustrating!  Angry) So I am wondering if the back pressure issue would give me the warm-cold-warm-cold scenario?? That would NOT be acceptable!!!  Shocked But as mentioned earlier, if I needed to, I guess I could put a diverter valve on the shower to send some water back to the tank so I could keep the pump running. (??) Do you guys think that would rectify the problem?? And, if I bought it, even tho it could be an "issue" to return the heater if that was the only problem, I am someone who hates/does not do it unless it really is a bad deal.
Thanx again for all the help!
Chaz
Logged

Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein
wal1809
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1330




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2011, 10:48:39 AM »

When I put mine in my house it called for a special vent pipe made for the unit.  The book and county code called for any wood within 12 inches of the pipe to be covered with sheet metal.  I know understand why.  Get near that vent pipe and it will urn you.  So venting this thing in a bus is going to be tricky.
Logged

1984 Silver Eagle Model 10 6V92 Allison auto tranny
www.snakebreaker.com
pabusnut
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 312


P8M4905A-333 former MK&O lines #731




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2011, 11:39:46 AM »

Chaz,

My bus is at exactly the same point it was two months ago.  When it failed a safety inspection, I realized that I couldn’t fix everything AND finish converting prior to the scheduled start of my vacation.  Soooooo… we went in the Jeep Liberty CRD on the “Great Western Tour” sans Bus and “camped” in hotels and motels—safely and comfortably.  Only saw two “real” converted bus, and lots of Entertainer coaches.
Upon our arrival back in PA, we were greeted with a Hurricane, and less than a week later a flood.  We had over 15 inches of rain in about a day, and even though my house is on a slab with no basement, we had water seep through the floor!  The roof also leaked from the hurricane damage not yet fixed.  So the bus has been at the bottom of the priority list. Embarrassed

My gas unit has manual knobs to regulate both the heat level and the water flow, so I think after some tinkering, I may be able to get a “Goldilocks” situation.   I did find a double wall pipe to use to go through the ceiling, which I will be insulating aound the pipe with some type of “fake asbestos” when I find it.   I will be back on the plumbing system as soon as I get the speedometer working again, and pull the throttle cable, lube and reinstall it.  I also need some brake work and a tie rod installed, but I am paying the shop to do that since they have the equipment to do it safely whereas I don’t.

I will let you know as soon as I test it.

Steve
PAbusnut
Logged

Steve Toomey
PAbusnut
Chaz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1508


4108, 8V71 w/auto .


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2011, 02:11:42 PM »

Thanx Steve. Sorry about all the "issues" out your way. I hope the vacation was good at least!  Smiley

I was thinking on double or even triple wall pipe as I will 90* it and take it out of a bay door. I think I will be fine as far as the heat goes. But if I fire it up and it shows signs of too much heat on something, I have plenty of metal to take care of it.

Thanx again!
  Chaz
Logged

Pix of my bus here: http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g279/Skulptor/Motor%20Coach/
What I create here:   www.amstudio.us
 
"Imagination is more important than knowledge". Albert Einstein
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!