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Author Topic: Adding King Cruise to Air Throttle  (Read 2031 times)
TomC
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« on: August 19, 2011, 10:23:03 PM »

Even though my air throttle on my bus is very easy to push, I still wanted a cruise control.  I chose the King Cruise since it is used by many truckers in the past.  King suggests mounting the control box right near the engine and having it control the governor directly.  Problem is with an air throttle, just pulling the governor bypasses the air operated Allison automatic throttle modulator.  My solution is I mounted the King Cruise control box on the passenger side under the windshield with the control cable going down through the floor, then looping back up through the floor just under the gas pedal.  I made a metal extension on the pedal at the top with a larger hole then the cable so the cable could slide when I'm gassing with my foot.  Then with the cruise control, it pulls down on the gas pedal directly to control the speed.  Works well, and I can also use the cruise control for fast idle. Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
Gary '79 5C
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« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2011, 04:41:56 AM »

TomC,

Great Job to adapt the unit to your needs !! Many items on my bus I have worked on, and others I have gone thru understanding the operation, while it works, for that on the side of the road, when it does not....

Now if only I can get the cruise operational on my '83 MB.....
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« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2011, 06:57:39 AM »

FWIW the King comes with instructions now to mount to pedal also they finally gave up and said it was ok lol
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TomC
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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2011, 07:33:35 AM »

Gary-I understand your frustrations with the MB cruise control.  I have an '84 300 turbodiesel (with only 388,000mi-no overhaul yet) and the cruise can be expensive.  The speedo cable has to be lubed properly.  I can't use mine when it is under 65 degrees since it surges when cold.  But-since I live in L.A.-how often can you use the cruise anyway?  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2011, 08:19:34 AM »

That is what I had to do with my L10 --- much simpler really because you don't need to run the wires all the way to the back of the bus for the control unit.

Melbo
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« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2011, 02:29:11 PM »

TomC

That's the way I did mine on my 4104 many years ago, last time I spoke with the current owner it was still working fine.

Ken
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gus
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« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2011, 12:51:52 PM »

Tom,

Tell me more about the air modulator on the Allison.

I don't think my V730 has one, this may be the reason it has some strange operation characteristics?
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gus
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« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2011, 02:48:36 PM »

Tom,

It is beginning to appear that I don't have a V730, it sounds more and more like a VS2-8?
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TomC
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« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2011, 08:28:56 AM »

Gus-here's a picture of a V730.  The VS2-8 will have a smaller housing with many bolts holding it together.  The VS2-8 will shift 1st converter, 2nd lockup, 3rd lockup with no control of gears.  The V730 will shift 1st conveter, 2nd converter, 2nd lockup, 3rd lockup with a shifter that is R-N-3-2-1.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
hargreaves
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« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2011, 09:34:51 AM »

Hi Tom , how long did it take for you to install the King Cruise?  Just traveled across the country and my Knee definitely needs a break.
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now as of Feb 2012 series 50 B400  . Sunshine Coast British Columbia
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« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2011, 10:58:03 AM »



Tom  Is the charge air cooler in front of your radiator.

If so how did you get your fan so close to the engine.

I am trying to place one on my 04. Right now I was looking to place it on the passenger side.
But i have my trans. cooler there.

Not much room in a 04.

uncle ned
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TomC
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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2011, 11:46:48 AM »

Hargreaves-I had to add a speedometer generator.  King cruise makes a through drive model-so you take off the original speedometer generator from the transmission, mount the King cruise generator, then the original speedometer generator mounts on top of the King Cruise generator.  You have to run two wires from the engine compartment up to the driver's compartment.  I also had to put a 100ohm resistor in line of the brake light switch since I have LED lights that don't pull enough amps for the King Cruise to sense.  Other then that it was pretty straight forward.  Pretty much took two days to install with the bus up on blocks in the front to run the cable.

Uncle Ned- My AMGeneral transit was made in both 96" and 102" wide versions.  With the 102" version, they basically kept the engine in the same place but moved over to the right.  So I have about 6" in front of the radiator for the air to air.  AMGeneral also with the B model mounted the A/C condenser in front of the radiator (which didn't work well-overheated the engine), so the bolts holes for the condenser were there that I used to mount the air to air.  Was relatively easy-just had to have the intercooler custom made (which was about $750.00).  Good Luck, TomC
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hargreaves
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« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2011, 12:19:42 PM »

i have a front wheel sensor for my speedo, will it work if I tap into that line?
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« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2011, 12:39:45 PM »

Yep they have unit just for that

good luck
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hargreaves
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« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2011, 12:59:33 PM »

Thanks guys, I ordered it and will install in Kalamazoo and test it out on the way Home.
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now as of Feb 2012 series 50 B400  . Sunshine Coast British Columbia
gus
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« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2011, 07:59:00 PM »

TomC,

It has been determined by two posters that I have a V730 but it shifts exactly like a VS2-8,  starts in 1st (converter?), shifts to 2nd (lockup?) at 25 mph and, 3rd lockup at 50mph with no control of gears.  

The  shift control is a Stone-Bennett R-N-3-2-1 electric toggle.

« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 08:00:51 PM by gus » Logged

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TomC
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« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2011, 07:06:46 AM »

Gus-to me it sounds like your torque converter is not locking up. Try this-course in first it should be in converter mode so the engine will rev up and down at any speed.  But when it shifts to second-try accelerating and releasing the pedal-does the engine stay at the same rpm, or does it come down to nearly idle?  Try in third too.  If the engine goes up and down in 2nd and 3rd gear when you release the accelerator, your torque converter clutch is not activating or is just plainly worn out.
If your torque converter does lockup in 2nd, the shift from 1st to 2nd will be a bit of a jolting shift.  If you determine that the torque converter is locking up in second and third and also the fact you don't have shift control, most likely you have a shift problem in the control valves in the transmission.  You usually have to drop the pan to get to the shift control valves-and that's a relatively easy job for a transmission shop.  Or you could do it, but if you goof it up somehow, then you'd have to tow the bus to the transmission shop anyway.  One way or another-I would have a qualified transmission shop that is very familiar with the V730 look at it.  They are very reliable transmissions normally.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2011, 12:55:20 PM »

I hope you guys have better luck with King cruise than I have.  I have had mine for 5-6 years and it never has worked.  Two shops and the factory guy named Steve have been unable to get it to work. The box is mounted on top of my 8V92.
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« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2011, 06:40:47 PM »

King Cruise has been very responsive to any issues and questions I have had.  I even got them to give me information on how to hook up an LED so I can tell when it is engaged.

When I first started I had problems making in do what I thought it should so I sent the unit back they checked it out and returned it to me.

The problem was that my air throttle also had air assist or something like that at the engine and I had to do what Tom did and mount it up front to actuate the pedal instead of the throttle linkage.

HTH

YMMV

Melbo
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luvrbus
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« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2011, 06:45:07 PM »

If a King gets the right signal they work alway have for me

good luck
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gus
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« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2011, 12:35:30 PM »

Tom, I've never noticed the engine going to idle, it always seems to correspond to the speed of the bus. I'll have to check it out though because I wasn't looking closely for this.

It shifts smoothly at 25 then very hard at 50, the only two I can feel.

It is giving good service even though it doesn't appear to be shifting right. I agree that it is time to visit an Allison dealer!

Could uneven length air throttle and trans modulator lines cause these problems?

For a while I thought my panel shifter might be the problem but after reading chris4109's post from last year it appears to me that my plain MO-OFF-MO  toggle switch works fine and that the special panel is not necessary.
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