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Author Topic: HELP - Need help with hung brake in Kansas City, Kansas  (Read 4624 times)
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« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2011, 06:21:15 AM »

  Helps coming Brian, hang in there.

  I was reading the other thread about your brakes. This is exactly why you need to know how to play with them yourself. Good luck.
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« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2011, 06:24:29 AM »

It is hung if the push rod is moving back but the shoes are not. Take a large hammer and hit at the housing that encloses the shaft for the s-cam. Little by little it should begin to release. Then close off the line by any number of ways.

This is the kind of thing that can be prevented by backing the brakes all the way off and manually exercising the s-cams by pulling the slacks numerous times while backed off and greasing the camper.

I eluded to this somewhere in a prior thread.

A properly adjusted manual slack and properly working autoslack barley moves and over long periods of time form a dam or ridge of grease and grit. Backing the s-cam all the way out before greasing rotates the shaft almost 180 degree and puts grease on the backside of it and keeps things much better much longer. It keeps the face of the s-cam where the rollers for the shoes ride cleaner and smoother less apt to hang as they begin to approach their outer limits.

If you get a big enough hammer and get a good enough hit on it it will free up guaranteed
« Last Edit: September 01, 2011, 06:31:49 AM by Joe Camper » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2011, 06:29:44 AM »

Jack it up and be sure you didn't have a wheel bearing go out

good luck
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« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2011, 06:33:32 AM »

You can't chain up the axle on an Eagle, but you pull the wheel off.
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« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2011, 06:35:57 AM »

  The more I read, the happier I am I dont have tags. Just more crap to put you on the side of the road and empty your wallet, lol.

  Do I understand correctly that you could chain the wheel up off the road, tire and all and drive a ways??
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John316
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« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2011, 06:38:36 AM »

I just left you another message, Brian. Give me a call.

John
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« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2011, 06:44:59 AM »

What Clifford said.  I was 100% convinced I had a tag axle brake problem right up to the moment I realized the inner bearing was no longer with us.
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« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2011, 06:50:34 AM »

What Clifford said.  I was 100% convinced I had a tag axle brake problem right up to the moment I realized the inner bearing was no longer with us.

I agree with Clifford and Bob. I was going to mention that when we chatted again. That is also something that I would like to check.

However, he said that he doesn't see it working, like the other brakes. We didn't get into a lot of specifics. I have no idea what kind of tools they have, or anything like that (I don't even know if he knows what parts we are talking about, or if he knows where the cam housing is, hopefully I will find out).

They smelled burned brakes, that is why they stopped. They are on a off ramp, just south of downtown Kansas city. BK gave them some ideas, then told them to chat with Arrow. Arrow told them to tighten the slack all the way up, then step on the brakes as hard as possible. One of the guys, who was standing out next to the bus, said that he heard a pop (or something). But Brian said that it still wasn't "working like the other brakes."

I should know more when they call back.

FWIW

John
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« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2011, 06:53:48 AM »

  Lets pray its not a bearing, he dont need that kind of grief.
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« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2011, 06:59:01 AM »

For future referance. On any hub, when the rollers for the shoes begin to rest at the outer ends of the s-cams when adusted up two things are occuring. Either the linings on the shoes are not as thick as you think they are but rather are worn AND/OR the drum is getting worn.

Back when I was trucking I would put 2 or 3 sets of shoes before replacing the drum. When you do this the 2nd and 3rd time around you can "cam-over" without even hanging. The drums get so far out it all happens with still 1/2 or even more than 1/2 the linings still left. So when you look up there and see tons of lining left then look further, to where the rollers are sitting on the cams. They should be sitting in them real "tight", if not the drums are worn.

 The drums on these buses are way way bigger and heavier than truck stuff at least our XL components are.

If I had to guess it is either worn shoes or my first choice, the bus does not get used enough. Probably u got good stuff and is taken care of well the thing sets too much like most of them ours included.
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« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2011, 06:59:47 AM »

On a bus with air suspension there are a number of things you could do, including chaining it up high before you air it up.  The eagle, as I understand it, has torsion spring suspension so you can't get it very high at all with chains.  Taking the wheel off, jacking the brake drum up to a normal, non-droop position and chaining that would work, if there is a way to chain it at all and it you happen to have a chain...

I think tags just go hand in hand with a 40' bus, and most every bus you can get these days that was built after 1980.  Yeah, more to go wrong, more to maintain, but the extra 5 feet and the newer bus seems to be worth it to most.

I wonder if the return springs on the shoes have broken, been replaced wrong, or similar.  My first thing would have been to disconnect the push rod from the slack and see what the heck was jamming, I think.  This is a tough one, I would hate to have to deal with this in a parking lot or worse, the side of the road.
 

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« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2011, 07:05:53 AM »

His bus is Torsion suspension only the tag is air I just cannot believe it doesn't have release valve ,I feel for this guy what can go wrong does with him

good luck
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« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2011, 07:28:41 AM »

He is rolling, guys.

He talked with Arrow again, and they said since he heard the pop, the brake should be released. When I first talked with him, he said that they hadn't tried moving it since they tried releasing it.

The brake is now released, and they are moving now. They first pulled of at the 18th st expressway exit (that area) on I-35. Now they are rolling, and I think he said they just pulled of at highway 7. I mentioned that Crossroads was in that area, but it sounded like they are heading towards another shop down there.

Bottom line is, he should be set. I was ready to go down to get them rolling towards the shop, but they were set before I left.

Thanks for the help and advice, gents. I know they are grateful.
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« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2011, 07:30:47 AM »

  Awesome news.
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« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2011, 08:24:41 AM »

Ill tell you whats hanging Brian and It also was the POP they heard. It was the roller for the shoe hung way out close to but not completly at the end of the "s" in the s-cam.

So the trick here is to NOW go around to the other brakes and hubs, all of them. Even if you have automatic adjusters. Adjust up all the other slack adjusters tighter by about almost half or so of their current travel. That will reduce the application pressure on the one thats hanging and probably keep it from happening again till you get in.

Thats what Id do.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2011, 08:28:23 AM by Joe Camper » Logged

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