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Author Topic: Pics of Muldoonmans gen  (Read 2245 times)
wal1809
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« on: September 11, 2011, 07:04:35 PM »

Muldoon sent these to me and so I am going to post them for him.  He needs help with an overheating genset. 




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wal1809
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« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2011, 07:11:06 PM »

Muldoon I will start with the first question.  Has it always overheated and if not what changed other than Texas has been a miserable burning inferno for months.  Also we are close enough where we should meet one day for supper or coffee.  Schoebel's is a block north of I-10 on hwy71 in Columbus, Texas.  They have a buffet that will send you into a diabetic coma.  The last person I met there was a fella named Doc, an animal vet.  I met him on the internet as he was buying a rifle from me.  We decided to sit down for a meal and the next thing you know we spawned a business relationship and definately a lifelong friendship.  You just never know.
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Lin
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« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2011, 07:32:19 PM »

It looks great in the picture, but what's needed is the details of the cooling system.
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« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2011, 07:41:56 PM »

I don't know much about these...yet, however my first question was this, "How does it breathe!"
Jack
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muldoonman
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« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2011, 08:19:24 AM »

Wayne, I just bought the bus a couple months ago. I've only tried to use genset a couple times and it shut down both times after running a couple of hours, maybe less. Genset only had 38 hours when i bought the bus. Now about 50 or so.The prevost bus 56,000 miles. Stored forever. I just picked it up from Texas Custom Coaches a week or 2 ago after a total check out and revamp. They had it on shore power and didn't run gen long enough to experience shutdown. The air intake is that hose in middle picture that goes out the side. There are no holes in compartment other than slide for electric cable out bottom. Doesn't seem like enough air intake for me. I'll hollar toward the end of week and see if we can meet up so you can take a look.Thanks for all the help, guys.

glen
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eddiepotts
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« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2011, 08:50:20 AM »

One thing you might want to look for is an exhaust leak and it shutting down on lack of clean air and not heat. this may be why it will run for a few hours and not run strait up to high temp. I had a waverunner do this to me. Once I pulled the seat it would start right back up. The leak was so small I was not seeing it at first. when I fixed it ran all day no problems. Use a 1x2 going across the top of the bay door holding it open to see if it lets more fresh air in. Also try installing a thermometer in the bay by the intake and make sure your not sucking in hot air raising the cylinder temp. Cooler intake air cooler it will run.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2011, 08:53:07 AM by eddiepotts » Logged
Lin
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« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2011, 10:26:32 AM »

Somehow, I can't see the air intake clearly.  Is it that thing that looks like it might a a screen going to the next compartment where the cable is?  Where is the radiator, and what condition is that in? 
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wal1809
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« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2011, 10:40:03 AM »

I am thinkin in the same lines as Lin.  We need to know how much air it has coming in and out.  We also need to know what kind of fan is on there.  They might have replaced the fan recently.  If it does not ram air through the radiator your shooting yourself in the foot.  It could be somehting as simple as the rubber seal on the outside of the radiator has been removed ect.  My guess is the fan is not strong enough for this Texas heat wave.  Luvrbus set me straight on the fans.  Mine took a 9 amp squirrel cage blower and ended that BS right off the bat.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2011, 10:42:57 AM by wal1809 » Logged

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« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2011, 02:06:16 PM »

It is really hard to tell from the pics but it appears the air intake hose is to the engine air intake so it won't provide any cooling to the compartment. 

For cooling there has to be a cool air intake, preferably at the bottom, and a hot air outlet, preferably at the top.

My cooling air outlet is at the bottom (I really don't have much choice) but since I'm installing a 326 CFM. 0.95 amp squirrel cage blower that takes in bottom cooling air ahead of the exhaust it should work fine.

The sizes of a couple of blowers posted here amaze me, they are truly large enough to lift the bus!!
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wal1809
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« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2011, 02:08:07 PM »

It is really hard to tell from the pics but it appears the air intake hose is to the engine air intake so it won't provide any cooling to the compartment. 

For cooling there has to be a cool air intake, preferably at the bottom, and a hot air outlet, preferably at the top.

My cooling air outlet is at the bottom (I really don't have much choice) but since I'm installing a 326 CFM. 0.95 amp squirrel cage blower that takes in bottom cooling air ahead of the exhaust it should work fine.

The sizes of a couple of blowers posted here amaze me, they are truly large enough to lift the bus!!


Oh you mean like this one
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muldoonman
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« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2011, 04:32:17 AM »

I'll try to get other pics on backside of gen set. It's in a totally inclosed insulated box with radiator to the right inclosed behind power cord. I will pull wall out as soon as I have time and take a look at radiator and blower. Will keep you posted.

Schobels, ah yes, I've eaten there many times over the years.

Thanks,
glen s.
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« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2011, 06:10:55 AM »

  Not only does the engine need cooling (radiator), but so does the generator head itself. Most are rated at 40C. Dont know if that would shut it down though. Agree elsewhere, you need to put some thermometers in there so you have some baseline to work from. Just saying its shutting down isnt going to tell anything. 
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muldoonman
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« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2011, 06:46:15 AM »

Gotcha.Yeah, That puppy doesn't have any fresh air coming in to generator, not even a vent.

 Wayne, I'll hollar and maybe the wife and I can meet you all at Schobels on a weekend and you can see the bus and the problem first hand.
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« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2011, 06:46:51 AM »

Does it shut down like you turned the switch off or does it choke down like you are running out of fuel?
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« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2011, 06:52:16 AM »

You need to look else where for the problem venting is not the problem at a 195 degrees you are ok it is venting,those units do fine in a box.
I notice it has a new shutdown on the engine those need to have the right adjustment you don't install one and call it good,check the sensors and the control board


good luck
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muldoonman
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« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2011, 06:56:09 AM »

Just quits. I can let it cool down a few minutes and it will start until it reaches temp and dies again. I will get some thermometers and check temp inside box. I know it's hotter than a pistol in there. I'll try to take it to somebody that knows what going on.

Thanks,
glen s.
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muldoonman
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« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2011, 07:00:00 AM »

Cliff, the shutdown, whatever that thing is, is original. This thing only had 38 hours on it when I bought the prevost. Installed in 1991.
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luvrbus
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« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2011, 07:02:16 AM »

The shutdown is not painted looking at the photos and I have never saw that shutdown on that model of Kubota engine before kinda looks like a after market to me 

good luck
« Last Edit: September 13, 2011, 07:30:45 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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wal1809
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« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2011, 07:08:49 AM »

Muldoon where is the bus from.  Is it possible it was in a climate that didn't need as much ventilation as you need in Texas?  It has been nothing short of brutal this summer.
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« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2011, 07:11:47 AM »

I have to go pickin this Saturday morning as it is a planned family event.  It involves a strtegic plan during breakfast and then racing to find the hidden treasures.  At 3:00 I have to be in Bay City for a training session.  So if your good sunday I will set the time to look at it if your good that day as well.
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muldoonman
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« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2011, 07:20:37 AM »

 Sounds good, Wayne. I'll send a e/mail and if the creek don't rise the wife and I can drive on down.

 The bus was a Cole Conversion out of Wyoming. Built in 1991 on a 1991 prevost. I figure those boys didn't see heat like we have in Texas. This bus had been sitting in a climate controlled bus barn for 10 years after owner passed away.
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« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2011, 07:21:30 AM »

You need to buy a good infra red laser like the Extech 42511 model that has a 12:1 spot and adjustable emissivity feature for accurate readings 2 different colors or different metals the cheaper ones are not accurate spend the 129 bucks and buy a good gun JMO

good luck
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wal1809
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« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2011, 07:41:28 AM »

Sounds good, Wayne. I'll send a e/mail and if the creek don't rise the wife and I can drive on down.

 The bus was a Cole Conversion out of Wyoming. Built in 1991 on a 1991 prevost. I figure those boys didn't see heat like we have in Texas. This bus had been sitting in a climate controlled bus barn for 10 years after owner passed away.
I think we are on to something with climate and region of the country.  I am beginning to think it was not designed for Texas flaming heat waves.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2011, 07:48:13 AM by wal1809 » Logged

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muldoonman
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« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2011, 07:50:49 AM »

thanks cliff, I'm heading into Austin and will try to pick one up.

glen
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luvrbus
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« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2011, 08:13:31 AM »

Leave the front cover off and run it see if shuts downs at 195 without the front cover

good luck
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muldoonman
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« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2011, 08:22:10 AM »

I slid it out of bay last week and it ran for several hours then shut down. It was about 105 that day and I was running all 3 cruiseairs. I will get laser gun and see what it's shutting down on temp.
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« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2011, 08:58:32 AM »

I slowed down a little and looked at the photo again.  The box encapsulating the gen is insulated, no doubt for noise and qwuite possibly Wyoming temperatures.  In other words keeping the engine warm enough to run properly.  So as the engine is in Texas now the heat will rise in the box.  The only way for the heat to get out is to tranfer to a cooloer object (the engine block water) get carried out (to radiator) then out the bus.  I think it is being overcome by heat that has no place to go.
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« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2011, 09:00:25 AM »

Now you know shutting down when slid out of the box it is not a venting problem you don't get much better venting than the wide open space

good luck
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wal1809
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« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2011, 11:10:07 AM »

Now you know shutting down when slid out of the box it is not a venting problem you don't get much better venting than the wide open space

good luck

I wasn't clear if it shut down on its own or if he shut it down.  If it shut down on its own then we must go elsewhere.
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« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2011, 11:33:17 AM »

I had one years ago that would run for several hours then shut down. Other times it would run maybe 20-30 minutes and shut down. Turned out to be a bad over temp sensor. Replaced the sensor and all was well.
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« Reply #30 on: September 13, 2011, 02:54:28 PM »

I had the same climate problem. My Westerbeke was installed in Seattle in Aug this year, a cool 75* normal high there.

When I got to hot ID and even hotter midwest it overheated and shut down. I opened things up a bit so it was ok when moving, and that helped, but now I'm in the process of installing a blower.
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