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Author Topic: Broken down on ny turnpike  (Read 3954 times)
desi arnaz
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« on: October 07, 2011, 06:43:57 PM »

Seems we hit a pothole and the right rear. Bumper fell seven inches and needs to be welded back into place as it sheared off from the top in front of the air filter, also at the same time I blew the top radiator hose that connects the ridgid tube to the engine. Engine should be ok as the water was flowing up into it from the radiator and we only got to 190 degrees. Anyone right close to the irioqui rest stop? If so please let me know if you can help.... Thanks.  Tom
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
desi arnaz
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« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2011, 06:52:11 PM »

Tried to post photo but it will not let me do it with an iPad
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
desi arnaz
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« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2011, 07:01:12 PM »

They are a little dark but can be seen at.   Flocks.shutterfly.com
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2011, 09:54:10 PM »

Tom, according to your description the support that sheared is one of the "hangers" for the engine cradle. The bumper is bolted to the engine cradle. If that is the case I would be very leary about moving the bus until it is fixed. I just went outside and looked at my bus (PD4106) and that appears to be what you are describing.

Regards

Fred Mc.
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RoyJ
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« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2011, 10:23:01 PM »

I know this won't be much help but, whoa! How big was the "pothole"? Was there any structural issues with the bus before?

I've hit a hard bump of two as well (bottoming out I think), and this makes me worried. Mind you my bus is different and the roof is none-structural.

Perhaps call a mobile welder?
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fe2_o3
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« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2011, 10:43:31 PM »

  From what I can see from the pix, Fred is right. The cradle support is broken.
  I'm also curious about the tow truck in photo 3502. I'm wondering if that might have had something to do with the problem.
  Must have been a big hole. Could have lost a car in it...Cable
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Sofar Sogood
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Rick59-4104
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« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2011, 10:56:37 PM »

 I too am wondering about the July photo of the wrecker hooking to the rear of the coach Huh Huh Huh Hope all works out for you, I am far far away, would help if I could..


Rick
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2011, 03:42:44 AM »

That was at the Albany turnpike toll booth, we waited five. Hours for a tow and then I had to rent a car to take wife and baby home,came back and was able to fix her in five min.
Bad brass fitting on the fuel line.  Do you think a mobil welder could fix this?  When this happend it also ripped the top hose of the coolant tube.....
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 04:57:48 AM »

ripped the top tube of the radiator off???  sounds like some part of the engine dropped a little along with what the ohters said.  Can a mobile welder fix it.  Probably with the right equipment and some jacks to get it back in place.

but i'd be real concerned about a broken weld on a bumper? that caused a radiator hose to pull loose.  sounds like more than a bumper.
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Tom
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2011, 05:23:43 AM »

Everything on the right dropped down seven inches. The tow guy will not accept. All state and wants two hundred seventy five an hour.we are trying to find a welder as we speak.   Only the six inch hose was torn off not the top of the radiator
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2011, 05:28:06 AM »

Probably can be fixed if the tail gate opening is still intact and square but if it pulled the upright loose the hanger attaches too he has major problems.

The GM engine mount system has always amazed me how they could even hold the engine up in place I'm guessing his didn't

good luck
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« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2011, 07:22:48 AM »

I think you have some very significant problems to deal with, and not something the average welder guy is going to be able to handle.  If, as we suspect, you have lost the right support of the cradle, then the whole engine/transmission/ radiator, etc. is hanging by one bole on the left hanger.

It is going to take a big jack or two and someone who understands the very unique engine support system used on these buses.  The front engine supports are just hooks.  It would take very little right now to end up with the entire rig on the ground.
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« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2011, 07:49:04 AM »

The front cradle mounts are hooked AND BOLTED.>>>Dan
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Rick59-4104
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« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2011, 08:09:29 AM »

 Tom,
  Did a bolt shear, the tube seperate or did a bracket give way? Unless this was caused by corrosion to the cradle that might result in the replacement of the entire cradle from looking at my 4104 I really don't see anything that any farm welding shop should not be able to repair probably better than new. I have a small metal fab shop and this looks like something I would not hesitate to tackle but I am in Arkansas. Wink

  I would check the cradle channels (big channel pieces front and rear of the cradle ) and the braces and supports that connect the channels to see if anything twisted when the right rear of the cradle dropped. If the right side dropped and the left stayed up there is probably going to be some twisting of the supports connecting the channels. Looking at my 4104 I would bet if the right rear dropped the right hand inner brace would probably twist.  Check the bolts or rivets that attach the braces and channels.

 My advice would be to park the bus, get in a car and drive away from the interstate and from the vultures that hang out there into farm country and start looking for a welding shop with a mobile welder that can help you. (not that every shop along the interstates are blood suckers but I'll wager most are Wink)

 Maybe stop at the local coffee shop in town and ask if anyone knows a farmer with a farm shop that can weld. In my country these guys are VERY experienced with fab work and welding and know how it is to be in a tough spot and need help.
 
This is all based on if part of the the cradle itself failed, if any part of the bus the cradle attaches to failed this will probably be bad news.

 Does the bus have a tow hitch attached to the cradle?

 Maybe someone will know of a shop.


Best of luck wish I was closer.
Rick
« Last Edit: October 08, 2011, 08:36:17 AM by Rick59-4104 » Logged

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« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2011, 08:34:59 AM »

With the engine dropping 7 inches I think he twisted the hanger bracket that ties into the bulkhead on the left he will more that likely have to remove the engine and redo that side also to do it right or he will just have a patch job there is a lot of work to repair one right,Thomas needs to stay off the turnpike 

good luck
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2011, 09:46:36 AM »

I have it jacked in place now the welder is on his way....it sheared one inch from the air intake box.
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2011, 09:52:00 AM »

This same thing happened to my friend Don Clark .   He has an easy fix.    You can call him.   I just emailed you his phone number

Ed Roelle
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Fred Mc
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« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2011, 11:28:30 AM »

Tom, hope your repair is swift and successful.
In the interest of those that also have similar constructed busses(I also have a 4106 like you) when your repairs are complete would you post some pics of the repairs and perhaps a clearer explanation of exactly what broke. When I look at my bus I notice that the strut that broke on yours appears to be connected to a fabricated connector that somehow ties into the roof on the bus. Did the strut itself break or did it separate from its connection?

Thanks

Fred Mc.
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2011, 07:19:37 PM »

back on the road $787 poorer.....the tow guy would not honor allstate and the welder charged
$390 for one weld... the piece of iron was only held on  by two spots the size of a pencil eraser or smaller. it broke 1 inch  from the air box but this guy made a very nice weld. he did brake the ground to my transmitter for the toad taillights and the tow guy fixed it with a bad  connector so no tail lights....also the wife had the dvd and other equipment on so on our first run around break for the baby we had a dead battery as the bus generator will not charge unless it has proper voltage  so no real headlights, we are at a flying j next to a t&a 30 miles from buffalo.we had to stop as we couldnt see 100 feet in front of us...
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2011, 07:30:31 PM »

  This isn't a trip, it's an adventure..Glad your rear end is supported again. Hope the electrical problems can be resolved in the daylight... Cable
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Sofar Sogood
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« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2011, 10:25:01 AM »

Is your generator big enough to run a buzz box type arc welder? A guy could buy one for about 250.00 at Home Depot and leave it in the bay. I have a 50a welder plug in one of my bay's and have thought about carrying a welder just for this reason. It sure would have saved some time and money, not to mention the worrying.  Roll Eyes
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Gary Seay (location Alaska)
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2011, 01:12:10 PM »

now i find my battery charger is dead..... i will have to go to the states in the morning to get a new one.
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2011, 02:18:53 PM »

sounds like you were not ready for the road yet. Before you go out check all your systems and make sure they work. Something about a fine tooth comb eh.
You might want to check your brake next and your steering.Justt saying FWIW
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2011, 08:35:52 AM »

we were ready  but the things that have happend would not of been found easily.first time shifter broke off in my hand. second time brass nipple on fuel line broke 3rd time the engine cradle breaks. finding or knowing to look for that would of been near imposable. today i went to the states for a battery charger. went into k mart and found a nice one for $32 when i got to the register it came up as $64 so i quoted them law and made them sell it to me for price posted on the  shelf a 2/10/50start unit!!
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2011, 10:50:51 AM »

went into k mart and found a nice one for $32 when i got to the register it came up as $64 so i quoted them law and made them sell it to me for price posted on the  shelf a 2/10/50start unit!!

  Called a Farm Equipment Company where we bought parts for the Tractor, asking about tire chains. Said they had a set the right size for $100, so drove the 40 miles to buy them only to have the parts manager step in and say they were not going to sell for $100, as they were heavy double ring chains and he wanted $400. Needless to say I drove home pretty angry and called the owner. The manager even tried to argue it wasnt 40 miles from our house. No, it was 38, sorry...

  Owner had a guy drive them out to the house for the $100, and probably the parts manager was either torn a new one or shown to the door.
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desi arnaz
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« Reply #25 on: October 10, 2011, 01:09:23 PM »

another part of the adventure ,,,, my generator which has never worked properly caused a rather smokey incident when the fuse on the fan blew and all my reflextex insulation melted.....
and also i was parked at the flying a-hole in buffalo and running said generator at 7 am trying to charge my batteries and i get a knock on my door from management telling me to shut it off as it wAs keeping the truckers awake, i get no respect.......
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thomas f  Bethlehem n.h
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« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2011, 01:19:40 PM »

  I always try to park well away from everyone, with exhaust aimed in the most desolate direction when running genny. Is it just me, or are Flying J's turning nasty? Seems just over the last year, six trips back and forth to Minnesota since June last year, they seem increasingly less friendly, dirtier, just not the same places they seemed just last year. Last one I stopped at, needed propane, told me everyone had to be outside or he wouldnt fill it. Had to wake up our daughter at 11PM to stand outside in the cold wind. If I hadnt been out of gas and just trying to get where I was going I wouldnt have passed. In over 30 years that was a first.
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luvrbus
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« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2011, 01:29:33 PM »

Not just F/J here in AZ it is the law everyone has to unload before filling propane on a motor home I am sure other states are the same

good luck
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« Reply #28 on: October 10, 2011, 05:11:51 PM »

  Im pretty sure the founding Fathers didnt intend for those who followed to endlessly make laws just to make laws, but that seems to be what happened. Take a look at most states volumes on State Code, then take a look at the volumes concerning US Code. The combined volume of books would fill a GMC 4107/4905 Bus Cargo bay, and probably some more. Its not a Bus load of Lawyers we need on the bottom of lake Michigan, its just about every one of them. 
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gus
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« Reply #29 on: October 10, 2011, 07:04:39 PM »

This string is beginning to wander also!!

My congratulations to anyone who is fully prepared for a first time bus trip with no problems. Never had such good luck with either of my buses even though I tried. It is pretty hard to figure out ahead of time all the potential problems is a 30-50 year old machine.

Every trip we ever made in either bus has been an adventure, expect that and you won't be disappointed. The good news is that none of them has cost me a bunch, I've managed to repair most things myself. If I couldn't I wouldn't be able to afford a bus!!
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PD4107-152
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« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2011, 07:11:02 PM »

How is a running generator going to bother a trucker?  I'll turn off my generator as soon as they all turn off their idling engines.

I'm glad to hear you got back up and running.  I had to have repairs done to our trailer on my recent trip and the place jumped on it as soon as they opened.  They also charged a reasonable $50 an hour to boot and didn't pad the hours.
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Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
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« Reply #31 on: October 10, 2011, 07:12:21 PM »

Yeah Gus,

Just keep a good supply of bailing wire, duct tape, and gum, and you will be unstoppable.
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« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2011, 07:30:51 PM »

Being a 50 year old long haired that rode a 1950 panhead across the US. Lawyers and big  business never was a good thing. Yes the times are a changing. That is why we all have a bus is to be independent from the rat race off the map so to say. MY old pan was the best motorcycle I owned and broke down the most. Low tech and easy to fix afther you learned the way it worked. Same as these old buses. they are going to break but can be fixed with out a computer. I still do not know my bus yet, only had it 2 months and most of that time has been getting the motor rebuilt. It well take some time to learn how it likes to run. The two weeks of trying to get it home was the best time the wife and I have had in a lone time. Working to gather. we haven't felt that alive in a long time. So take it and make it fun it's only money and you can't take it with you and the kids will only spend it on the next best 3d TV. OK I said my 2 cents now put this thered back on course
Kevin
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« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2011, 08:19:03 PM »

  (snip)  My congratulations to anyone who is fully prepared for a first time bus trip with no problems.   

    Amen.  I'm going to be ready to do some short trips in a few weeks.  My plan is to leave at 11AM, drive 25 miles north and then come back to the shop for dinner and then drive 25 miles south and hope to get back for supper time.  Then check oil, radiator, power steering, air lines, etc.  If that works, I'll repeat it a couple of times.  Then a full "periodic maintenance" as the Book describes.  But I know that won't be "fully prepared".  Adventure here we come.
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Bruce H; Wallace (near Wilmington) NC
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« Reply #34 on: October 10, 2011, 08:43:28 PM »

The bus runs great now til the next excitement. Does losing a driveshaft count as being ready -- how about dropping the toad on the road -- One of the more simple things that happened was a broken accelerator spring --- would not let the trans engage --- toasted brain box for the trans ( had to shift by disconnecting and reconnecting wires --- drove over 1000 miles like that ;-)  )  --- overheating the old 8V71 til it shuts down -- losing the belt on the genset when I REALLY needed it.  Yes I am ready for the road and whatever else happens.

Melbo

These are just the highlights there are also all the sub chapters to and minor inconveniences that we have encountered
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« Reply #35 on: October 11, 2011, 06:54:48 PM »

Lin,

I have all that plus a pile of tools and spare parts.

Once in a while I actually have the right spare part, once even an alternator!
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PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
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