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Author Topic: New Brake Information  (Read 2025 times)
buswarrior
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'75 MC8 8V71 HT740




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« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2011, 09:36:52 PM »

An MCI EL3 Renaissance with 6 wheel disc brakes, ABS equipped, is supposed to stop, from 60 mph, under panic stop conditions, in somewhere just beyond 200 ft on dry roads.

Pick-ups likely will rear end it. Lots of cars won't stop in much less.

However, there is a chance the passengers will exit the coach via the windshield...

Nobody on here would put up with drum brakes on their personal transport, so why wouldn't we look forward to disc brakes on our bus conversions?

As the disc brake engineering came online here in North America, manufacturers did some interesting things that history will not treat lightly.

Mixing disc and drum will be one of them. Not good.

Graphing the gripping power during a stopping event, discs have a steady line, drums have a degrading one. The drums start loafing as the heat builds, the discs don't, and then end up doing more of the work, and the brake wear is the evidence.

The Orion VII transit, completely lowfloor, engine offset to the driver side, rear door aft of the drive axle, was a case in point: Front disc, rear drums, the brake wear on the front axle was epic compared to the drives.

Some disc brakes are still better than no disc brakes.

Be absolutely sure your drums are in good condition and well adjusted, the good discs can mask poor drums in routine stopping, but trouble comes in high demand braking scenarios.

happy coaching!
buswarrior
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TomC
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« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2011, 10:08:33 PM »

Transit and other buses have always had the largest brakes.  My transit has 15"x7" in front and 15"x10" in the rear. Why-because most transit buses only have 2 axles.  And still to this day, most transit buses still have drum brakes.  The linings have really improved over the years to compensate.  The reason trucks have smaller brakes is that they have 10 brakes instead of 4 to stop-of course we're also talking about a 80,000lb truck compared to maybe a maximum of a 36,000lb transit bus. 

When I bought my first truck in 1980, three things I wanted that weren't offered-Automatic transmission (only the Allison HT754CR was offered and didn't feel it had enough flexibility-as contrasted now by the 4000 series World 6spd), disc brakes, and air suspension in front.  Those options are all offered now (took long enough).  Now if only the independent front air suspension was offered on big rigs like on buses.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
prevosman
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« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2011, 05:22:12 AM »

Almost every car on the road will stop in under 130 feet at 60 MPH, and there are quite a few that can stop in under 110 feet.

Our stopping distances are usually weight related and even if I could stop in 200 feet from 60 which I doubt because when towing I am about 54,000# any driver that pulls in too close and decides to hit the brakes hard is likely going to have me on top of him. One reason I have a dash cam because without proof a driver took away my safe stopping distance I will likely be blamed for the accident.
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Jon Wehrenberg
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« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2011, 10:27:17 AM »

  What would it cost in parts to upgade an older two axle Bus to air discs, ie; all the parts, rotors, calipers, and any other brake components needed? And what would the labor costs be, for those who would just have it done? Can we have a breakdown?

 

 

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belfert
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« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2011, 06:11:36 PM »

I don't think there is a stock answer to how much it would cost to convert to disk brakes on an MC-5.  Who knows if anybody has even done it before?  I'm no expert on brakes, but I would suspect some custom engineering would be required to make everything fit and work properly.  The benefit probably wouldn't be worth the cost and time involved.

MCI makes disk brake conversion kits, but only for D and J series buses.
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Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
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« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2011, 06:58:22 PM »

Prevosman, I like the idea of a dash cam.  What is the storage media?  Do you kick it on only at the moment you think it is needed?
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Paul, High Desert CA
1981 Gillig Tandem
1983 Crown Tandem
buswarrior
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« Reply #21 on: November 02, 2011, 08:07:44 PM »

There are a number of commercially available camera and recording systems aimed at the truck and transit markets, but a cheap way for a busnut would be to use an inexpensive home system from one of the electronics superstores for a couple hundred and run it off the inverter or generator. ie: Tiger Direct has at least two in every flyer up here.

A camera to the left front, a camera to the right front, a camera to the rear on both sides...

Also good for seeing what that bump in the night was/is via a monitor in the bedroom?



happy coaching!
buswarrior
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« Reply #22 on: November 03, 2011, 06:09:25 PM »

I don't think there is a stock answer to how much it would cost to convert to disk brakes on an MC-5.  Who knows if anybody has even done it before?  I'm no expert on brakes, but I would suspect some custom engineering would be required to make everything fit and work properly.  The benefit probably wouldn't be worth the cost and time involved.

  Im guessing  north of $10K just in parts. And boy, add in some custom fabricating, we know attorney's all love to see that.

 
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