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Author Topic: Tires with Nitrogen  (Read 3402 times)
luvrbus
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« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2011, 05:07:06 AM »

Ah the internet Brian there is just as many supporting nitrogen use I was reading one about million mile truck tires on a truck site then the report from a Canadian testing lab made good reading in support of Nitrogen a 2007 study

Back to the old ice cream theory what ever flavor you like.

I do know all the truck lines run Nitrogen in the super singles at a 1000 bucks a pop for the tire they squeeze every mile they can from those lol but for a bus type rv I cannot see the benefit,I think you do get ripped off from some if you have your own bottle the stuff is cheap from a welding supply,fwiw I use it our Lexus and the wife's Spitfire have for 10 years but I pay Cosco 20 bucks for all four tires noway would I pay 30 bucks a tire.Toyo,Bridgestone and Peterbuilt are big supporters of Nitgroen in truck tires 

good luck    
« Last Edit: December 22, 2011, 05:44:28 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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prevosman
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« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2011, 05:29:37 AM »

In a discussion such as this it would be great if people would only state that which they can prove or know for certain.

In 35 years of plane ownership nobody has ever put nitrogen in my tires despite the last 25 years flying a plane that required 90 PSI. The only time I saw the use of nitrogen was in gear struts and then because the required pressures were greater than the output of the conventional shop compressor.

Nitrogen may be the best thing to use to inflate tires, but supporters of the practice often make such exagerated claims they overshadow what benefits the use of notrogen provides and makes everything they say seem like manure.
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Jon Wehrenberg
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« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2011, 05:48:52 AM »

That;s exactly what I did, I posted MY results and My opinion.  I agree sometimes a real post gets lost in the science of disagreement, I am not up to date on all the tech stuff, As a lot of us its the Nitty Gritty we have to work with.And apparently some of your are  Scientist, that's great also, we need all of the opinions. just don't forget us lowly bus folk that only understand the real results..
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« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2011, 07:35:34 AM »

I'm not saying nitrogen is bad, I think nitrogen is indeed better than air from a random compressor in virtually all cases.  I just think the claims are overstated, the benefits are weak compared to costs, and I don't bother.  Probably the biggest benefit is a more inert gas mix, less oxygen would probably result in less corrosion inside the tire, which would be good.  I was really quite surprised that moist air expands less with temperature rise than nitrogen does - I had taken it as fact that nitrogen gave a lot less pressure rise that compressor air, and 99% of the racers you would ask would say the same thing.  I do think that the reason it gets used in racing is convenience - every team gets nitrogen delivered at every track, and they use it for everything - shocks, tires, air guns, blowing dust off the car.

Interesting to have learned something new today, anyway!

Brian
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« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2011, 12:30:57 PM »

  In the more than two years I hung out as an airport bum wrenching on planes, every aircraft we worked on got pure nitrogen from a high pressure bottle (not a machine). We inflated tires with it, purged new tubes with it, and filled all struts with it. And it was FREE to the customer. And most of the maintenance shops Ive been around had a tank of it on a cart. Thats not saying Ive been in a lot of aviation shops, just the many I have been in had a tank of Nitrogen for those purposes.

  It isn't magic, the benefits are very marginal, but they are real. For free its a no brainer. Much more than that and its a total rip off. $30 a tire and the states AG should get involved, that is outright robbery.
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bevans6
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« Reply #20 on: December 22, 2011, 12:52:11 PM »

I popped on over to a pro racing forum I hang out on, and asked them.  They confirmed that the rise in pressure from temperature is roughly the same for nitrogen as compressor air, but that the nitrogen is consistent so they can test and predict exactly the rise they will get every time.  that's why they purge and fill the tires, if they do.  They use it for their air tools in the pits, for the air jacks to lift the cars, for convenience and fire safety.  An aviation engineer (all types go car racing!) said FAA wants it in tires for fire safety as well.

Bottom line - it won't hurt and it might help, so why not, if it's free?  As for paying extra, do what makes you happy!   Grin

Brian
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1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
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« Reply #21 on: December 22, 2011, 12:58:53 PM »

An aviation engineer (all types go car racing!) said FAA wants it in tires for fire safety as well.

Brian

  I been out of the aviation loop a while but I didnt know it was federally mandated. If it is it must be a somewhat recent decision.
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TomC
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« Reply #22 on: December 22, 2011, 01:15:44 PM »

The ONLY reason your tires run smoother and quieter is because you originally had the tire pressure to high, and the Nitrogen guy put in a lower tire pressure to give a better ride.  Try weighing both the front and back when full so you can look up the proper tire pressure for the weight in your tire manufactures tire pressure tables.

Nitrogen in tires is good-just have to carry nitrogen with to refill.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #23 on: December 22, 2011, 06:49:21 PM »

OK, here's another aspect of nitrogen in tires  -  how would it affect pyrolysis?   Specifically, I'm thinking about the risk of tire fires caused by over-heated brakes, maybe from a dragging brake.   I know that tires can explode if you're stupid enough to weld on rims with tires mounted on them, but if a tire were inflated with nitrogen would it have the same potential for pyrolysis compared with being inflated with air?   Yes, obviously brakes should be maintained so they don't drag and cause wheel fires, but it still does happen  -  last year I saw a new-looking Van Hool being brought in to ABC Bus with evidence of a serious fire from one of its rear wheels.

John    
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« Reply #24 on: December 23, 2011, 02:38:07 AM »

  I personally think the fire risk with a tire would be the same whether filled with air or Nitrogen. At least in the normal world. Most tires catch on fire externally and whats inside them would have zero effect until the casing ruptured and by then it wont matter On aircraft the wheels and struts are more commonly made of Magnesium, so anything that reduces oxidation or minimizes fire risk is beneficial.
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junkman42
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« Reply #25 on: December 23, 2011, 07:31:32 AM »

Consider this!  As o2 molecules pass through the tire from inside to the outside the o2 cause oxidation to the tire structure.  The biggest benefit is tire longevity.  And yes I have it in the super car tires on My z06 vette.  I am a sucker for science.  John L
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jbnewman
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« Reply #26 on: December 28, 2011, 08:47:35 AM »

A quick Google indicates that in 1990, the FAA started requiring an inert gas, such as nitrogen, be used in lieu of air, for inflation of tires on certain transport category airplanes.

Disclaimer: This message is not intended to suggest that this is still in force, in force for more than the planes mentioned, or that any previous poster is right, wrong, or indifferent. It is only intended to provide an additional data point for the conversation.
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« Reply #27 on: December 28, 2011, 09:09:06 AM »

does this mean i need to remove the accetlene from mine? Grin
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« Reply #28 on: December 28, 2011, 03:09:50 PM »

The internet seems to present ample research to say nitrogen is superior to straight compressed air.  I would use it if available.  However, for convenience I use my own compressors to fill my tires.  Since we live in a desert and the compressor has a water separator, I do not think that condensation is a real issue.  I do not expect to start carrying a nitrogen bottle for the road either.  So it looks like I will be settling for 2nd best for the time being.  I know that that sounds really strange coming from a 5a owner.
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Ed Hackenbruch
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« Reply #29 on: December 28, 2011, 03:36:48 PM »

Boy Lin, you are right!,   that really is strange to hear from a 5A owner!!! Grin
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