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Author Topic: Opinions on a Cummins M11  (Read 2947 times)
BusCrazyinFL
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« on: March 21, 2012, 02:43:52 PM »

My church is looking to buy a 1994 MCI 102DL3. It has a Cummins M11 and they asked my opinion on that engine but I don't really know too much about Cummims. Is that a pretty good engine?  It also has an Allison transmission  HT 746. Our church needs something good and reliable so I really need to hear your feedback. They are looking to me for some answers. Thanks, Manny
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wg4t50
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« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2012, 02:49:49 PM »

The M11 has been a good engine from Cummins, one small detail it is the smallest engine Cummins rates as HD, I have the 2001 ISM series, it has been a great engine.  The M11 is the replacement for the L10 which also has a good rep.
From my esperience with both DD engines and Cummins M11/ISM engines, the difference required for maintaining the Cummins is near zero vs the DD which takes a lot more TLC and I am a DD lover, but at my age I now prefer the ISM.
I would feel comfy with it in the MCI, I assume it is a 400 HP at that age @1450 ft lb.
Cheers
Dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
Foretravel w/ISM500
WG4T CW for over 50 wpm for ever.
Central Virginia
luvrbus
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2012, 03:35:18 PM »

The M-11 is going to be better than the 746 Allison have that part checked close the 741 and 746 are not much tons of trouble  and 1994 was the 1st year for the M-11 I have my doubts about the rating mention in a MCI bus all I have been around are 350 hp + or -
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gus
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« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2012, 12:56:12 PM »

If it is the same as the L10 I drove an 18 wheeler for a few years with a Cummins L10 and it was a bullet proof engine, never required any serious work.

Over the years Cummins engines are probably the best 4-stroke diesels made, the Cat people may argue that.
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PD4107-152
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Carbone
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« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2012, 02:39:43 PM »

Excellent engines, very affordable to work on but they rarely need it. The local municipalities used them for years and you know they were babied. Grin
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1975 MCI-8
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wg4t50
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« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2012, 04:35:33 PM »

Our experience with the L10 is simply at 500K miles, roll in new rod & main bearings, button up, then at 1 Mil miles, do an inframe, head, clyinder kits, bearings etc and good to go again.  And having worked for Cat for a few years, I would never purchase a Cat engine, go for the Cummins, My opinion with experience.
Dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
Foretravel w/ISM500
WG4T CW for over 50 wpm for ever.
Central Virginia
Brian Diehl
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« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2012, 06:08:48 PM »

I have really enjoyed the year 2000 ISM I put in my 96A3.  It has been a GREAT addition to my vehicle!  I would never go back.  Mine is rated at 400HP and 1450 lb/ft torque.  It makes hills small.  :-)  I have put 34,000 miles on mine since I put it in.  It had a bad injector when I got it from the junk yard.  The replacement injector failed after 6000 miles.  The free replacement of that injector has worked without issue.  I've had no other issues.  Jake brakes are good too!
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Mex-Busnut
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« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2012, 07:47:39 PM »

When we redid our (6V92TA) engine, our diesel mechanic told me our engine will be good for many years, but if we ever wanted to change it, go to a Cummins L10 or better M11. He says they require less maintenance (Same as somebody else said above.) and get better fuel economy.
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Dr. Steve, San Juan del Río, Querétaro, Mexico, North America, Planet Earth, Milky Way.
1981 Dina Olímpico (Flxible Flxliner clone), 6V92TA Detroit Diesel
Rockwell model RM135A 9-speed manual tranny.
Jake brakes
100 miles North West of Mexico City, Mexico. 6,800 feet altitude.
luvrbus
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« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2012, 08:11:49 PM »

Manny plug a Pro/Link in the engine it won't lie to you the M-11 and ISM neither are bullet proof all you need to do is go by ABC Bus Co and see the junk ones from the Vanhools they get about 300,000 from a engine one outfit pulled all their ISM and M-11 and of all things replaced those with Cat's.

All the engines are good now days some just require more maintenance I don't even like a series 60 however they are the premier engine but even they won't last a 1,000,000 miles in a bus either   
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kwidd
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« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2012, 09:55:37 PM »

I am satisfied with my M11. It's been in the bus for 4  years now. No problems. Excellent fuel mileage and good power. It's set at 400 HP and 1450 ft. lbs. of torque. I'd make the switch again. I also have an L10 in my other bus like it also.
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wg4t50
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« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2012, 03:50:12 AM »

This is a funny one, if the ISM is only going 300 K miles before it is junk, why not tell us how long the DD make it before they are scrap too.  I am guessing 150 K at best.
Do tell what Cat is the magic answer ?
Dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
Foretravel w/ISM500
WG4T CW for over 50 wpm for ever.
Central Virginia
Busted Knuckle
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« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2012, 05:26:57 AM »

Dave,
What Clifford says is correct that these engines do not last as long in a bus still in revenue service, as they do in a truck (mileage wise) due to the amount of "fast idle" hrs they rack up while ditting around waiting on customers.
If the miles/hrs were the same they'd last as long or longer.
Grin  BK  Grin
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Busted Knuckle aka Bryce Gaston
KY Lakeside Travel's Busted Knuckle Garage
Huntingdon, TN 12 minutes N of I-40 @ exit 108
www.kylakesidetravel.net

Grin Keep SMILING it makes people wonder what yer up to! Grin (at least thats what momma always told me! Grin)
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« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2012, 06:50:45 AM »

Dave all I know is that the VanHools I see after for Don Laughlin 4 with ISM and 1 C-13 the ISM engine last around 300,000 miles the Cat seems to last longer it has 385,000 miles now but it has it share of other problems nothing major yet.

Don's 2 Eagle S-10 with the 6v92 ran about the same mileage 300,000 before engine rebuild as Dragnet said just the facts
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wg4t50
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« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2012, 08:21:21 AM »

Love  the info, I am never surprised at amazing info and no doubt there is an issue with the ISM, but I know there are many strange setups in Bus configurations, leaves much room for various outcomes.
My Cat Factory go to guy will love this story as he needs some good news for once.
Many thanks
Dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
Foretravel w/ISM500
WG4T CW for over 50 wpm for ever.
Central Virginia
Ed Brenner
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« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2012, 09:48:23 AM »


"Don's 2 Eagle S-10 with the 6v92 ran about the same mileage 300,000 before engine rebuild as Dragnet said just the facts "

Clifford, your telling on yourself!  I'll bet there are some young puppies here  that don't know that quote !!

ED
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Ed Brenner
77 Eagle 05  Murrells inlet, SC
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mikelutestanski
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« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2012, 03:31:49 PM »

Hello: The 94 is probably a computer engine. You can have a Cummins man check the engine with a pro link and find out how many miles are on the engine. Same with the transmission. What kind of mileage who knows unless it was in revenue service then maintenance records should be available..
     I think you should figure out what the church requires . How many miles each week or month. How will the bus be serviced and driven? How will it be stored and   where?  Will a maintenance schedule be followed especially if the bus is  not used very often?.
        As far as the M11 that is a very robust plant and efficient.  I believe it will work for your needs as long as the bus is properly taken care of.  Another consideration is the air conditioning system.  That system does impact the comfort of the passengers.
    Regards and happy bussing   mike 
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Mike Lutestanski   Dunnellon Florida
  1972 MCI 7
  L10 Cummins  B400R  4.625R
TomC
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« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2012, 08:26:40 AM »

Yes you can get a million miles out of a M11/ISM, but in a truck.  In a bus, that is usually lacking in maintenance because of the position of the engine, 300,000 miles on an overhaul doesn't surprise me.  Course a busnut would probably be more careful about maintenance then a bus company.  In my opinion, because of the size of the engine, the Cummins M11/ISM is the perfect sized motorhome engine.  The Caterpillar C12 is also in this league.  Keep on top of maintenance, especially replacing bearings if a slight oil pressure drop is detected, and you'll be happy with most any engine.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
belfert
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« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2012, 10:11:01 AM »

If a bus company invests $500,000+ into a new bus wouldn't they be inclined to maintain the bus including engine properly?  Now, as a bus ages and it gets passed onto new owners it may not get maintained as well.

My bus was horribly maintained by the last charter operator that owned it, but it also appears likely the bus was repossessed so the operator probably had no money.  The bus would have been taken out of service had it ever been inspected by a commercial inspector.  The bus garage that checked out the bus when I got it home said the brakes alone were worn beyond DOT standards.  Between myself and the local bus garage I have spent around $15,000 on bringing everything up to par on my bus.
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Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
TomC
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« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2012, 09:05:23 AM »

We work both on trucks and buses (and RV's) in our shop.  I've seen far more "lack of maintenance" issues with buses then with trucks.  The rear engine is just not conducive to the regular maintenance as it is on a flip up hood truck.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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