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Author Topic: Feedback Requested on Electrical Concept  (Read 2603 times)
Midwilshire
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« Reply #45 on: May 07, 2012, 11:16:18 PM »

Basic answer...yes.

Thanks!

So, again with the hypothetical....  if I had four roof airs, then I could conceivably run two on the 50 amp, one on the 30 amp, one on the 20 amp, all at the same time, right?

Not that I would do this; I just want to understand the pedestal.
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Michael & Gigi
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« Reply #46 on: May 08, 2012, 04:16:27 AM »

yes in theory. But you would be ask to leave by most camp grounds as they set their rates by estimating your usage. Some : I have been seeing this more often now, have each site on a maximum size breaker. I don't know size but was at one I kept tripping main for my site(not at site) and was only plugged into 30 amp and it did not tripp at  site. (bad breaker at main) moved to differant site no problem.  So yes but campgrounds are aware of these practices and it gets into their profits. Some will charge more for 50 amp hookup. For long term stay expect to pay metered rate.    Bob
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« Reply #47 on: May 08, 2012, 05:54:07 AM »

Michael, you changed your question in the last couple of posts.  Your first question is could you run some auxiliary component on one of the other outlets on the post.  You used an air compressor as an example.  As was noted, the simple answer is yes.  A better response should be "maybe" as will be discussed later.

Now you are asking if you can run some of the ***installed*** devices on the second outlet.  That is a huge difference and I have to ask why?  With 50 amp service, you have 100 amps of 110V available and that will run maybe 5 AC units.  

In order to run ***installed*** equipment on more that one post plug, you would have to do some fancy wiring.  The basic approach would be to have a bank of outlets for each item wired into the bus.  You would then need to plug each piece of equipment into its dedicated outlet so that you can run on the basic bus system (post or generator) when you have sufficient power available.  Then if, for whatever reason, you needed to run one of those devices off a second outlet on the post, you would need to unplug that device from the bank of outlets and plug it into a cord that runs to the post.

I do this with one outlet in the bus so that I can run an electric heater on the second post outlet when I only have 20 amp available on the post.

Bob brings up the ethics of using more than one outlet on a post.  The campground bases their rates on the assumption that you will use a certain amount of power.  If you try to double that power consumption, that is "cheating" the campground owner.  Most campground are wise to the use of "dog bone" adapters that let you "attempt" to use more than one outlet and they will ask you to unplug one leg.

I use the word "attempt" in the previous paragraph because some of the older campgrounds have the outlets of that post on one leg of a 240V circuit (alternating legs on other posts).  Depending on the wiring and breakers you may only be able to get 15-20 amp total on the post no matter how many plugs you use.

Jim
« Last Edit: May 08, 2012, 08:38:13 AM by rv_safetyman » Logged

Jim Shepherd
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TedsBUSted
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« Reply #48 on: May 08, 2012, 08:10:49 AM »


... Is there a magic box into which I can plug the 240 service and have it spit out [100amp/120v] so I need not worry about load balancing?   Would this even be desirable?

Just such a "magic box" is commonly known as a transformer.

However, it's not all magic because transformers are heavy and their use also adds some efficiency losses.

Ted
« Last Edit: May 08, 2012, 08:20:23 AM by TedsBUSted » Logged

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Midwilshire
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« Reply #49 on: May 08, 2012, 08:57:36 AM »


Now you are asking if you can run some of the ***installed*** devices on the second outlet.  That is a huge difference and I have to ask why?


Because I cannot figure out how to wire it any other way.  See my posts above.  I ordered George Myers book last night, but this is the plan as of now.  



In order to run ***installed*** equipment on more that one post plug, you would have to do some fancy wiring.  



Observe said fancy wiring:




The basic approach would be to have a bank of outlets for each item wired into the bus.  You would then need to plug each piece of equipment into its dedicated outlet so that you can run on the basic bus system (post or generator) when you have sufficient power available.  



Funny you should mention that:




Bob brings up the ethics of using more than one outlet on a post.  The campground bases their rates on the assumption that you will use a certain amount of power.  If you try to double that power consumption, that is "cheating" the campground owner.  


I'm not into cheating anyone, so no problem.  One receptacle at a time is fine.  My questions were intended to inform my understanding of the pedestal wiring.

Yep, I know that this is atypical, but it works in my mind for any number of permissible power combinations, whereas I cannot make heads or tails of the fancy automatic transfer switches and neutral-ground unbonding, etc.  And since I'm not worried about resale, I see little downside to the simple-sailor approach.

Okay, feel free to point out the flaw in my approach, or simply say, "put down the diagonal cutters and back away from the bus slowly."  

Mike

« Last Edit: May 08, 2012, 09:26:18 AM by Midwilshire » Logged

Michael & Gigi
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« Reply #50 on: May 08, 2012, 01:34:27 PM »

Generally, the 50, 30, and 20 amp receptacles are all fed from the same 50 or 60 amp breaker at the distribution.  So no, you can't use all three outlets to their capacity.
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« Reply #51 on: May 08, 2012, 05:12:38 PM »

I think you're making things alot more complicated than need be.
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Sam 4106
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« Reply #52 on: May 08, 2012, 06:07:38 PM »

Hi Mike,

I suggest you Google "Magnum Energy Inc", click on Document Library, go to the installation manual for the MS series and find the page(s) that have wiring diagrams for installing the MS 4024 inverter. This is essential reading anyway.

Good luck, Sam
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Cary and Don
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« Reply #53 on: May 08, 2012, 06:52:08 PM »

Why not get an inverter that the generator, shore power, and house batteries connect to.  The two legs out are one inverted and one not inverted.  Split your air conditioners between the two legs.  Use the Vanner for the 12 volt loads,  a charge controller for the solar, and a battery isolator for the bus to charge the house batteries.  You can have an on/off switch to a relay for it if your want.  Wouldn't that work and be a lot easier? The plans just seem like over kill.  Maybe,  I just don't get it.

Don and Cary
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1973 05 Eagle
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