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Author Topic: pictures of remains of crown being towed away  (Read 3107 times)
crown
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« on: November 15, 2012, 05:45:51 PM »

 after sitting in the yard a few years its been sold to a happy new owner john
ps it may not look like much but it has a zero miles dd 671 turbo a allison ht740 rockwell 54.000 lb rear
all rebuilt and more that the new owner is going to use
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john
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« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2012, 06:04:33 PM »

 being 45 ft it was a little tight but they got it out with two tow trucks john
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john
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« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2012, 06:40:44 PM »

Must abe some new fangled rear, 54,000 lb ? wonder how that could be, the heaviest single rear I have played was the 23,000 in the MCI7, tag was about 8k I think.
Hope someone could splaine this 54,000 rear.
Thanks
dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
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crown
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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2012, 07:07:05 PM »

 the rear and tag are all on a henderson suspension and the tag says 54.000 lb its from 1957 and its huge
 the man that bought it will use it, in his 60.000 lb crane and its bigger then what he now has that all i known
 also when i had it rebuilt all the seals and bearings were special order   john
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john
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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2012, 07:10:57 PM »

John, That is truely amazing, have you ever seen a 46,000 tandem setup? That is large compared to a single axle and a single wheel tag axle, why I was just wondering,
Thanks
Dave
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MCI7 20+ Yrs
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« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2012, 07:25:57 PM »

 dave wish i had taken a picture of it everyone that saw it over the years said wow thats huge when the rear went to the shop. the other bus/ truck rears to pull the pumkin two guys would pull them out this one they neaded a fork lift. crown allways  overbuilt things john
ps will ask the new owner to send me a picture
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john
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Iceni John
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« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2012, 08:50:22 PM »

I'm curious about two things:

Crown never made a 45-foot bus  -  their longest tandem school and tour buses, even the legendary high-floor Atomics built for the AEC and the Highway Post Offices, were only 40 feet long.   The third photo shows what appears to be a lengthened frame just ahead of the rear axles.   (Mid-engine Crowns have very short driveshafts behind their transmission;  this one needs a much longer driveshaft than I've ever seen on any Crown.)   Why was this done, and what body would then fit on it?   The first photo also shows what looks like a normal-length Crown body, i.e. 35 feet long.   It would have been a hugely difficult job to separate a Crown frame from its body, because they were welded together as one integral unit in the factory to make them the strongest buses on the road, far stronger than even present-day school buses (I recently looked at a brand-new Amtran pusher at Alliance Bus Lines in Ontario CA, and its body is attached to the frame rails by U-bolts!).

Crown certainly used hefty running gear, but not that hefty!   This scan of a brochure from the 1980s shows a 40-foot Crown tandem with a 6-71T, but its rear axles were 23,000 and 22,500 lbs:  http://www.flickr.com/photos/23546986@N08/5958960467/#in/photostream/   On my friend's similar Crown tandem with dual-drive axles, they are about the same rating as this brochure's single-drive axles.   Late-model Crown tandem school buses had GVWRs in the high-40s, certainly not well over 50,000 lbs!   I think earlier Crown tandems had lower GVWRs than the later ones.   Is the rear end even from a Crown?   You mention it's a Henderson  -  Crown used Timken axles before using Rockwells, but did they use Henderson before that?

Tell us more  -  I am very intrigued.

John
« Last Edit: November 15, 2012, 09:04:55 PM by Iceni John » Logged

1990 Crown 2R-40N-552:  6V92TAC, DDEC II, HT740, Jake.      Hecho en Chino.     
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« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2012, 10:23:54 PM »

Looks like a 23,000lb drive axle with probably a 22,500lb tag axle behind. That adds up to 45,000lbs-but whichever way you slice it, you're still only allowed 34,000lbs on a tandem setup.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2012, 11:03:38 AM »

My former 1974 Crown 10-wheeler (VIN 37317) had a tandem rated at 34,000, but that was probably determined by the springs, which were several leaves light from what one sees on a big dump truck.  The GVWR was about 47,000, with a front 16K axle.  HB of CJ (old coot)
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crown
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« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2012, 12:33:00 PM »

  hi john my crown is a 1957 the rear is factory it was 40 ft i streched it to 45 ft the body is welded to plates
  coming off the frame you can remove body [ not easy ] the 671 turbo motor was built using a 1990 turbo
  block and turbo setup .

  as for the crown you see in first picture its my 1957 crown body now sitting on a modern 1995 frame its
  also a pusher now with a cummins allision world trans full air ride ect . i had to cut down the 102 "" wide
  to a 92 " ?
  will post a few pics. with the roof raised and all the mods. it looks factory stock

  john
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john
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Iceni John
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« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2012, 12:58:44 PM »

Wow!   That's adventurous to do all that work.   My hat's off to you!   I've never heard of anyone turning a pancake into a pusher, or stretching a Crown frame.   What frame is the 1957 body now on?

One of the CCJ forum members has ideas of doing major bus surgery to get what he's dreaming about  -  he's hankering for a hotrod 30-foot shortie Crown with a 400 HP Big-Cam Cummins , so maybe he and you should talk?!

I'm always fascinated to know how people raise Crown roofs, because the bodysides are far from parallel.   Did you cut at the roofline, or lower down near the floor level?   I thought at first about doing that with my bus, but two seconds later I realized that was not going to happen.   To gain extra headroom in the shower I'm thinking of lowering the floor level there by a few inches, not easy but still doable compared to raising the roof.

Thanks, John   
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1990 Crown 2R-40N-552:  6V92TAC, DDEC II, HT740, Jake.      Hecho en Chino.     
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« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2012, 02:27:27 PM »

John from Costa Rica; where is the link where you shipped the donor RV to Costa Rica?  That was really interesting and tells the story.
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Gary D

USBUSIN was our 1960 PD4104 for 16 years Ustruckin' is our 2001 Freightliner truck conversion
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« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2012, 04:05:29 PM »

  gary thats a good ? i wish i new where the link was 
  going to try and post a few pictures  john
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john
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« Reply #13 on: November 16, 2012, 04:13:44 PM »

 first pic is a little dark but the crown body is on its way to its new frame
 john the new frame is a roadmaster frame from a salvage monaco 40 ft
 second pic is crown and monico side by side
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john
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« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2012, 04:25:25 PM »

 monico off boat on way to my house
 monico at home
 crown dash 8 '' wider
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john
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« Reply #15 on: November 16, 2012, 05:30:03 PM »

If memory serves, (always suspect!) it was about a 1957 model that was about 30-32 feet long.  Factory.  It had a 335hp 743T Cummins and a 5 speed tranny.  Probably a Spicer.  Used all 5. The driveshaft was very very very short and they had to change out the U-joints quite frequently.  Angularity problems?

The Crown had a Jake (in 1970) and ran on a rural/remote route including tight, dusty and muddy dirt roads.  Top speed was only about 65.  I only drove it a couple of times...very very quick.  Sometimes one had to pressure spray off all the brown clay from the engine, tranny and pumpkin bottoms.

Only 400 hp?  With factory factory parts, the right turbo, changed power and torque springs in the pump and a big air cleaner and intercooler,  one can turn a BC2 Cummins into at least 500hp.  Pittsburg Fuel Injection Dot Net will make a 750++ if you want one.  All it takes is $money$.  HB of CJ (old coot)
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« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2012, 03:19:10 AM »

I'm always fascinated to know how people raise Crown roofs, because the bodysides are far from parallel.   Did you cut at the roofline, or lower down near the floor level?   I thought at first about doing that with my bus, but two seconds later I realized that was not going to happen.   To gain extra headroom in the shower I'm thinking of lowering the floor level there by a few inches, not easy but still doable compared to raising the roof.

My bus also has curved sides so I had the same problem deciding how to raise the roof. I also considered lowering the floor, but it would have been a huge amount of work and in some places it couldn't have been done at all.

I put the roof raise within the roof itself (rather than the sides) and then made up panels that continued the curve of the sides up to the new roof level. I'm sure that only by comparing my bus with one from the factory would you realise that mine wasn't standard. I was conscious that dealing with the curved sides would be progressively more difficult the higher the raise was, so I only raised the roof by 7". In retrospect a couple of inches higher would have been better, and wouldn't have made any real difference to the job - but I think Crowns have a greater amount of curve than my bus has, which would exaggerate the problem.

Jeremy
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« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2012, 09:10:33 AM »

Raising the roof on a Crown is easy, and the curves are easy to deal with if you make the cuts in the right places.- here's mine which went up  full foot...

http://www.heartmagic.com/zzRoofRaiser/

Here's the finished job-

http://www.heartmagic.com/zzjunebus/Busrear.JPG
http://www.heartmagic.com/zzjunebus/DSC00006.JPG
http://www.heartmagic.com/zzjunebus/busfront.JPG
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« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2012, 09:20:50 AM »

 what i did was build all new side wall ribs then droped the roof with front and rear parts of bus on to its
 frame then i cut above the windshild and droped it about 5'' then needed to split the dash and widen about
 8'' to clear all the modern elec. dash a/c ect in the rear i cut below the rear windows and droped the rear
 trunk doors [ now engine doors ] to where then needed to go and filled in that area every thing i did
 was keeping with the factory lines / looks of the bus i am sure if i did not tell you all this you would
 think it was factory and thats what i was aming for thanks john
 
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john
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« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2012, 01:26:27 PM »

John, are we going to see some pictures of all this work?  What you describe is unbelievable!!  You have certainly taken on a project that most of us would not tackle!  How about some pictures, even if it is not finished. 
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Gary D

USBUSIN was our 1960 PD4104 for 16 years Ustruckin' is our 2001 Freightliner truck conversion
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« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2012, 01:53:42 PM »

 gary there are lots of pictures about my project hear just dont known where the links are i have been asked
 to start a thread in bus projects but have not had the time to go throgh all my pictures john
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john
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« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2012, 07:15:58 PM »

Crown and Boogie...thank you.  HB of CJ (old coot) Smiley
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