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Author Topic: Fuel Pro Leave it on or take it all off  (Read 4216 times)
rayshound
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« on: November 22, 2006, 11:56:31 AM »

I have purchased a fuel pro to put on my series 60 ddec4. I was going to remove the primary & secondary filters off of the engine. One filter has a test point & a ddec fuel pressure switch on it. I could put a block or tee in the line near the fuel pump and install the switch or leave both filters on the engine. My question is would there be a restriction in the fuel flow by having the two original fuel filters and the fuel pro?  Thanks Ray
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gumpy
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« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2006, 12:17:15 PM »

Ray,

When I installed my FuelPro about 3 or 4 years ago, I just put it inline, ahead of the primary filter and left both the primary and secondary filters in place, since I didn't have time to replumb them. I ran it that way up until last month, when I finally removed them and replumbed the fittings to/from the pump. This included the pressure switch on the starter circuit and splitting the pump output for each side of the engine. I also installed a gauge. I had to make up a manifold, which I did out of a 3-way air brass air manifold I found at Northern Tool, and a brass nipple, which I brazed to a piece of steel to make a bracket to bolt it to the engine using one of the holes where the secondary filter bracket had been mounted to the water pump. I had to put a couple fittings on the inlet side of the pump, but was able to reuse all my hoses.

Anyway, it did not present a problem with fuel restriction that I noticed. I had new filters on the primary and secondary when I installed the fuelpro. I changed the fuelpro filter maybe 3 or 4 times since installation, and had not changed the primary or secondary filters at all. I didn't notice any difference in power after removing them. The fuelpro filters out a finer particle than the primary or secondary filters do.

Do it whichever way works for you. It shouldn't be a problem leaving them on.

If you'd like photos of my installation and replumbing, let me know.

craig
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Craig Shepard
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http://bus.gumpydog.com - "Some Assembly Required"
rayshound
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« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2006, 06:01:39 PM »

Thanks Craig, I appreciate the info.  Ray
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rv_safetyman
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« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2006, 06:33:30 AM »

First of all, the Fuel Pro is one of the best additions a person can make to a bus.  In addition to having a great filter, it makes re-priming an engine a piece of cake.  It also gives you a graphic tool for trouble shooting your fuel system.

Now, to the plumbing.  I removed both engine filters and use only the Fuel Pro.  Someone pointed out that plumbing the system that way, gives you zero protection if the fuel pump would spit up.  I have never heard of that happening, but it is something to think about.
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
’85 Eagle 10/Series 60/Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission
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gumpy
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« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2006, 08:04:52 AM »

Jim,

What do you mean "spit up"?  Disintegrate internally and send pieces downstream?

Somehow, I suspect if the fuel pump breaks, it's not going to matter much since there's not going to be any fuel flowing then, anyway (the pump's broke Roll Eyes unless it's possible the pump could wear itself and send shavings or something downstream.

I wonder if a simple small inline filter would be appropriate between the pump and the injectors? Wouldn't need to be very big.

craig
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Craig Shepard
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« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2006, 05:46:08 PM »

Craig, not sure what could happen to a fuel pump, but the fact remains that there is no filter between the pump and the injectors when you plumb it like we did.

The pump is a gear drive, and with the great filter ahead of it, there should not be any foreign material that would cause the gear surfaces to wear. 

I am not too concerned about any problems, but it might not be a bad idea to leave the secondary filter in the circuit just to be on the safe side.  I doubt that you would ever need to change it.
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Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
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Stan
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« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2006, 06:25:03 PM »

DD fuel pumps frequently wear out so there must be metal wearing off. Any ones I have taken apart the obvious wear was on the end plates.
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JackConrad
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« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2006, 03:55:52 AM »

When we added the FuelPro to our MC-8 8V71N we installed the FuelPro on the engine compartment bulkhead before the OEM primary filter.  We installed new filter elements in the OEM cartridges when we installed the FuelPro. Approx. 22,000 miles since doing this. We have changed the FuelPro element once and have never touched the OEM elements. Just our way,  YMMV, Jack
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« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2006, 08:24:24 PM »

OK guys, I give up - what is a  FuelPro?
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PD4107-152
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DrivingMissLazy
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« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2006, 05:21:30 AM »

http://www.davcotec.com/filterswork.html

Every Davco Fuel Processor is a combination of important features to provide processed fuel to your engine. More than a simple filter, a Processor makes the filter work better and last longer while it also strips water from the fuel.

 
SEEING IS BELIEVING®

 Clicking on the image to the left will bring up a pop-up window containing a user-controlled slide show of our "Seeing Is Believing®" technology. It explains the technology step-by-step and even includes information on how to perform a maintenance check.

Fuel is filtered in a special way in a Fuel Processor. On a new filter, fuel only climbs a short way up the filter before it goes through the filter media. As dirt plugs the small holes in the filter, the fuel is forced to climb even higher to find clean filter media. When all the filter media has been clogged with dirt, the fuel will rise to the very top of the filter. It is easy to see when the filter needs replacement in a Fuel Processor. It's a matter of "Seeing Is Believing®".

 
WATER SEPARATION

Fuel enters the Fuel Processor below the filter where most of the trapped water is easily removed.
The fuel then rises into the filter chamber where any remaining water is repelled by the filter. The water, heavier than the fuel, falls into the bottom collection chamber of the Fuel Processor.

When fuel enters the Fuel Processor, heavy dirt (as well as water) falls to the bottom of the collection chamber. This makes for longer filter life and for easy removal of the collected dirt and water.

Each time the engine is shut off, loose dirt on the filter surface falls away to drop to the collection chamber. Naturally, this extends the life of the filter even more.


 




 
FUEL HEATING OPTIONS

A fuel heater is an option in any Fuel Processor. For those operating in cold climates, preventing fuel waxing from clogging filters is the only way to keep an engine running. Davco's optional fuel heaters stop wax from forming before it can clog filters. A thermostat valve controls heated engine coolant, or warm return fuel, to heat the cold incoming fuel. The heater, buried in fuel, wastes no heat to cold outside air. Wax free fuel flows directly to the filter to keep engines running. In hot weather the thermostat valve shuts off to keep fuel at its optimum temperature in the Processor.

 




 
FUEL PRE-HEATING OPTIONS

Cold weather start up, for any diesel engine, is a "hope it will" proposition. Davco Fuel Processor Filter Pre-heaters make it a "sure will" situation. By warming a vital pool of fuel right below the filter before starting the engine, wax and fuel gel are gone and engines start easily. Davco Pre-heaters are available in 12 and 24 volt DC types and in an "overnight" 120 volt AC model. Naturally these heaters are intended as aids to starting and NOT as full-time fuel heating devices.
Biodiesel Note: The use of tank heaters and fuel line heaters may also be required when using more than 20% biodiesel blend.



 
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JackConrad
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« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2006, 05:48:46 AM »

The clear plastic bowl on the top of the FuelPro is also a great diagnostic tool.
 No fuel visible=Fuel starvation issue
 Air bubbles present when engine is running=air leak between filter and tank
 Black stuff on filter element=Algae problem
 Fuel level at top of filter when engine running=plugged filter.
Jack
« Last Edit: November 26, 2006, 05:51:01 AM by JackConrad » Logged

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JimC
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« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2006, 08:31:54 PM »

Hi Guys,
What model fuel pro did you buy, I see several different models on the Eplace all the time, not sure what one to pick up.
Thanks
JimCallaghan 4106
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gumpy
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« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2006, 05:39:02 AM »

Model 382.

Here's a photo of my installation.



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Craig Shepard
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rayshound
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« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2006, 05:52:48 PM »

Craig,

       Good picture, it is the same one I bought from e place, I do have a question, what is that device along the top of the clear bowl with a hose on each end?  Thanks Ray
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Dreamscape
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« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2006, 06:19:53 PM »

How was it listed on ebay? I have not been able to find anything past couple of days.

This sounds like something to install in the future on my green monster.

Paul

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rayshound
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« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2006, 06:59:56 PM »

Paul;
       Like everything else I have purchased on ebay I tried different combinations, fuel processor, Davco , fuel filters etc. I usually just look under commerical veh, and look for something I have to have and sometimes out of nowhere something I can't do with out pops up. 2 weeks ago under Kent-Moore I found a brand new simulator that you can plug a ddec 3 or ddec4  into and start and run with out the truck!. I had to have it. Now I have been looking for a DD sensor stimulator that shows up in my S-60 manuel under tools.     Ray
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NJT5047
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« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2006, 07:04:02 PM »


How many GPH is a "382" rated for?   All I've seen on Eplace (recently) are Racor filters...they are nice items, but seem way to large for a bus.   Probably why they are on there...the smallish ones sell well.  These must be out of a boat.

Thanks, JR

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JR Lynch , Charlotte, NC
87 MC9, 6V92TA DDEC, HT748R ATEC

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gumpy
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« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2006, 07:10:20 PM »

... what is that device along the top of the clear bowl with a hose on each end?  Thanks Ray

That's my electric priming pump. It's plumbed into the inlet side with a check valve.

Here's a photo from a different angle.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2006, 07:15:28 PM by gumpy » Logged

Craig Shepard
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gus
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« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2006, 07:20:00 PM »

So, if I understand this right, this huge thing is used in addition to the two fuel filters already on the bus?

What does it do that two others won't (Other than what the factory sales pitch says)?

With three filters in place I don't see how you could ever tell which filter is doing what?

What does one of these things cost?
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PD4107-152
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rayshound
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« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2006, 07:33:20 PM »

Thanks Craig; Like the rest of your work First Class!  Ray
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gumpy
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« Reply #20 on: November 27, 2006, 07:39:14 PM »

I removed the other two (recently, after 3 years). So now that's the only one on the bus.  Prior to that, it was doing all the filtering anyway, since it was first in line.

It filters finer particles than the other two filters. Sorry, I can't quote the numbers off my head and I'm too tired to go look them up.

You can find them for around $200.

They also can be used to heat the fuel. I don't have my electric hooked up yet.

The biggest advantage aside from the finer filtering is the glass bowl lets you know exactly when it time to change the filter. No more guessing about whether one or both filters is clogged. When the fuel level reaches the top of the filter cartridge, it's time to change it. It's about a 5 minute procedure to change, and the electric pump is used to fill it after the new cartridge is installed and flush any air through the mechanical pump. No filling and spilling of spin on filters. No messing with canister filters. It's cleaner and easier.


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Craig Shepard
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gus
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« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2006, 07:59:30 PM »

Craig,

Thanks, now it is beginning to make sense. I like the visual part and getting rid of the other two filters.

I have no electric pump on my 4104, how would I refill the bowl after changing the filter?

What is the price of the filter element?

Is there a water drain on the bottom?
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PD4107-152
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gumpy
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« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2006, 04:59:37 AM »

I have no electric pump on my 4104, how would I refill the bowl after changing the filter?

There's a cap at the top of the bowl that is used to refill the filter. You just need to make sure your installation leaves room to get a bottle of fuel above the filter to pour into the hole. There's also a special wrench made for removing the rings and top cap. You can buy it direct from Davco for about $25.

Quote
What is the price of the filter element?

If I recall, the last ones I bought were only about $7. But that's coming off my head. I think I'm using a Baldwin filter element in mine. It's what the C&J Bus Repair are using in them. I haven't tried getting them at NAPA yet, but will probably do so soon, as I think I'm down to 1 left.

[qoute]
Is there a water drain on the bottom?
Quote

Yes. There's a drain fitting that can be plumbed with a hose to drain off water and drain down the fuel in the system before opening it up to change elements. I typically put a gallon oil jug under it to catch the fuel. I haven't had any water in the fuel, so I usually just recycle this fuel into my tractor. I've also been known to use some of it to start my camp fire quickly Wink

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Craig Shepard
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« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2006, 10:15:00 PM »

Craig,

Thanks, I need to look into this.
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PD4107-152
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« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2006, 08:00:10 AM »

The Davco 382 is my choice of fuel filters.  When I spec a new truck (I'm a Freightliner new truck salesman) that is more than just a cheapy, I always include the Davco.  The factory takes off the engine mounted filter (unless it is the Mercedes-Benz that is built into the engine) and just uses the Davco.  The trucks come from the factory with only 20gal, so periodically a new truck will run dry.  With the screw top on top of the bowl, 2 or 3 fills of the bowl and the engine is running again (of course after putting in more fuel in the tank).  Personally think it is the best filter made.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2006, 06:00:08 PM »

Who is Davco made by, could no find a web site.

Are they similar to the Fuel Pro?

Thanks,

Paul
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JimC
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« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2006, 06:23:25 PM »

Dreamscape
Fuel Pro is made by DAVCO

JImCallaghan 41-6
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Dreamscape
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« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2006, 06:38:33 PM »

Geeeez. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes DAH....

I guess I just learned something today........

Thanks Jim
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