Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
September 20, 2014, 06:56:31 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an E-Mag Subscription:  It will not get lost in the mail.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Cant shift into 1 or 2  (Read 3567 times)
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« on: July 29, 2013, 11:58:31 AM »

Getting off the expressway the other day I couldnt downshift into 2nd gear.  brought the bus to a stop and tried puttting it into first..the travel of the shifter is shorter than normal.  It just stops instead of sliding into gear.  Thank god the streets were empty all the way to walmart.  It is now parked.

I shut it down, slept the night and tried again in the morning still not budging.

I reviewed the boards and am in the process of disconnecting the 1/2 linkage from the arm on the top of the 4 speed spicer.

Will update - praying I dont have to tow this thing hout of here.

Dave
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
bevans6
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4639


1980 MCI MC-5C




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2013, 12:22:22 PM »

The 1/2 shift lever on top of the box is moved by the reverse solenoid to allow it to also act as the reverse shift lever.  Make sure that it isn't hung up half-way between the two.  Make sure that 3/4 shift lever is truly in the neutral position, or the interlocks won't allow you to move the 1/2 lever.  Disconnect the shift mechanism from both shift levers on top of the box and you should be able to shift them by hand to make sure it's not the linkage forward, and move the 1/2 rail into the reverse position with a screwdriver for leverage.  That's all I have off the top of my head...   Huh   Do you have the manual pages on the shifter section of the gearbox?

Brian
« Last Edit: July 29, 2013, 12:27:10 PM by bevans6 » Logged

1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Spicer 8844 4 speed Zen meditation device
Vintage race cars -
1978 Lola T440 Formula Ford
1972 NTM MK-4 B/SR
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2013, 12:44:30 PM »

I worked the reverse solenoid switch and verified it was moving the lever (it was).  Ill look to see if it is pushed all the way in when disengadged.  I will also look to see if the 3/4 shifter arm is truley in the neutral position (straight up).
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
bevans6
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4639


1980 MCI MC-5C




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2013, 03:43:08 PM »

If you need the manual pages let me know, I can photograph them and post them tomorrow.

Brian
Logged

1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Spicer 8844 4 speed Zen meditation device
Vintage race cars -
1978 Lola T440 Formula Ford
1972 NTM MK-4 B/SR
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2013, 04:48:20 PM »

Well no luck on an easy fix
Reverse solenoid definitely fully disengaged
3/4 definitely clucked into neutral
Disconnected the linkage and the linkage is free and moving smooth
So...do I call around to transmission shops?  I habe a call in to a guy about 60 miles that has worked on the bus.
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
Geoff
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 521





Ignore
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2013, 05:02:33 PM »

Did you check the oil level in the transmission?  If it is low the tranny doesn't work right.

--Geoff
Logged

Geoff
'82 RTS AZ
Dick Knutsen
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1


My 67 MC5A, on the lot in Yuma




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2013, 08:09:03 PM »

I had this problem a while back with my MC-5. Check the bolts on the transmission shift levers at the transmission top. I'll bet you find the 1-2 shift lever has a loose clamp bolt and is slipping on the shaft.
Logged

Dick K.
gus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3510





Ignore
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2013, 10:01:58 AM »

I had that problem with my 4104 a few times.

First I had my wife hold down the clutch, then I pulled the shift lever that connects to the rod running across from the firewall back even with the other lever. This solves the problem. It cannot be done with the clutch engaged.

I think these lockups are caused by not pushing the clutch all the way in when down shifting, I always knew when I had done it but then it was too late!
Logged

PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2013, 03:33:53 PM »

That would make sense Gus.  My clutch died a few thousand miles back in the desert over the winter.  I learned to start it in 1st and always park flat and carefully time the shifting.

The good news is I found a shop in town that seemed to recognize the Spicer 4 speed.  The bus is going up on the tow truck any minute.

At least I can get the clutch fixed while it is in there.
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
ol713
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 154



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2013, 02:37:09 PM »


   Hi;
     I also have a MC-7. Last time I had trouble with the spicer, I had to
     change out the transmision. Think I broke the input shaft.
     Please keep us posted and we can learn from your expierence.

                                     Good luck,   Merle.
Logged
ol713
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 154



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2013, 02:41:27 PM »


   Hi;
      Forgot to ask which Wal Mart are you in?
                          Merle.
Logged
Cheryl
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2013, 08:33:19 AM »

Bought a 57' GMC bus conversion.  When moving it the first time we broke the bell crank for 1st, 2nd, and reverse 1/2.  We are still looking for a bell crank.  The bus is a 4104 and the access is under the bed.  If anybody knows where to get it please let me know.  We live in the middle of nowhere and don't always have good internet access.  I would appreciate any help.
Thank you,
Cheryl
Logged
Ednj
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 997


Ed & Sue Skiba




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2013, 11:29:22 AM »

Cheryl,
Give Luke a call at 1-888-262-2434 or at 856-794-3104.
He is in New Jersey.U.S. Coach
Logged

MCI-9
Sussex county, Delaware.
See my picture's at= http://groups.yahoo.com/group/busshellconverters/
That's Not Oil Dripping under my Bus, It's Sweat from all that Horsepower.
----- This space for rent. -----
gus
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3510





Ignore
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2013, 03:09:08 PM »

Cheryl,

Very hard to find those Al arms which I assume is what you broke. There are about four of them in a stack on the firewall.

I was able to find only one new one, I had to epoxy bushings into the old worn ones but they work fine now.

If one is actually broken take it to a good welder for repair. this is easier than trying to find one.

Make sure all the bushings are good before you install them or one will probably break again.

Be sure to lube each one of them well before installing because the long greasing tube from the bottom does not work well, the grease hardens in the tube.
Logged

PD4107-152
PD4104-1274
Ash Flat, AR
eddieboy
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 62





Ignore
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2013, 06:46:27 PM »

Dave, I had a similar problem on my way home for the first time with my PD4106.  My fix was pretty easy in that I found that one of the linkage pins had fallen out.  It was located right above the Spicer transmission on the curb side. A bolt fixed her right up. Ed
Logged

Ed Spohr/1962 PD4106/8V71/4Speed/Zion,Ill/Far North East Corner of Illinois
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2013, 09:12:16 AM »

News! Update
So the transmission is "locked up" and the clutch needs a fork and new clutch.

Monday I am going there to speak with someone who actually looked at it.  I am calling the local bus guy to see if he has time.

I can't help but feel like I am going to be replacing the transmission.  What fits in this thing?

It is an MCI 7 with 8v71 Detroit.
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
Lin
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4555

1965 MC-5a




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2013, 09:58:55 AM »

Allison 740 if you are a 49 ft.  You will not regret going auto.
Logged

You don't have to believe everything you think.
Stormcloud
FMCA#407220
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 459




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2013, 03:42:56 PM »

Last year, I replaced my Spicer 4 speed with an Allison MT654 auto in my MC7. I was getting tired of shifting, and it was getting more and more difficult to shift 3-4. As it turns out, it was the shift rods were binding under the floor somewhere.  After the usual modifications (oil cooler, shift cable and tower, driveshaft shortening, different alternator, rebuilt starter) it works as well as can be expected.




Logged

Mark Morgan    near Brandon, Manitoba, Canada
1972 MCI-7     'PapaBus'  8v-71N MT654 Automatic
Ed Hackenbruch
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2402




Ignore
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2013, 03:45:27 PM »

Probably easier to sell a bus with an auto later on too.
Logged

1968 MCI 5A with 8V71 and Allison MT644 transmission.  Western USA
bevans6
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4639


1980 MCI MC-5C




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: August 14, 2013, 04:13:46 PM »

With an MC-7 I would put an Allison 740 in it, no question.

Brian
Logged

1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
Spicer 8844 4 speed Zen meditation device
Vintage race cars -
1978 Lola T440 Formula Ford
1972 NTM MK-4 B/SR
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #20 on: August 14, 2013, 08:24:52 PM »

Anyone want to chime in on the rough price range for putting an Allison 740 in there.  Prices on transmission alone seem to be $1500-$3000.  I am sure there are a lot of misc parts and whatnot as well.  So what am I looking at?

Also does anyone know how / if I can have it towed long range?  Like tow it from WI to AZ?
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
jmblake
Jason & Martha Blake
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 322



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2013, 04:33:17 AM »

If you go that way I have a 740 with very little miles on it for sale in the parts section and it includes the flex plate. Jason
Logged

Ed Hackenbruch
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2402




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2013, 07:32:44 AM »

How far you can tow it depends on how big your wallet is. Wink  Something to consider, one way or the other you will be putting money into the bus.  How much will it cost to fix it back to what you now have?  How much would it cost to change it over to an auto?  How much for a tow?  It doesn't seem to make much sense to me to spend a lot/any money on towing it when you could use that money to fix it one way or the other.  The difference in cost between changing over to an auto or fixing the existing tranny may not be that much more, and in the long run would probably even out. 
Logged

1968 MCI 5A with 8V71 and Allison MT644 transmission.  Western USA
Dlsnow
dave
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 170


dave




Ignore
« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2013, 07:44:10 AM »

Ed - Aint that the truth Wink - like anything else they require maintenance.

I am looking at picking up that transmission Jason mentioned in the post above (i have some questions).  It sure would be nice to have an auto.
I have a place in AZ that can do the work...but the bus is in Central (Wausau) Wisconsin right now.  I suppose if I act quick I may be able to get it all lined up.  Toughest part is finding a place to swap the transmissions that knows what they are doing.

Any suggestions?
Logged

1972 MCI7 8v71 converted - 1kw solar on roof
Sam 4106
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 645





Ignore
« Reply #24 on: August 15, 2013, 09:43:39 AM »

Hi Disnow,

Lamers Bus Lines has a terminal near Wausau (Rothschild) 715-241-7799. I don't know if they do outside work, but it would be worth a call. Even if they don't do outside work, they may know of someone in the area to refer you to. Networking often produces results.

Good luck, Sam
Logged

1976 MCI-8TA with 8V92 DDEC II and Allison HT740
B_K
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 431




Ignore
« Reply #25 on: August 15, 2013, 03:59:58 PM »

Hi Disnow,

Lamers Bus Lines has a terminal near Wausau (Rothschild) 715-241-7799. I don't know if they do outside work, but it would be worth a call. Even if they don't do outside work, they may know of someone in the area to refer you to. Networking often produces results.

Good luck, Sam

C & J should be able to do it and a lot closer tow than AZ.

Also Stan Holter who posts on BNO's page on face book might have suggestions too!
Grin  BK  Grin
Logged
Stormcloud
FMCA#407220
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 459




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2013, 06:07:25 PM »

When I changed to the automatic, I had to change the accessory drive cover on the engine. The factory cover that the standard transmission bolted to would not accept the MT654 bellhousing.

I found and used a 6V92 accessory drive cover instead, but the new rear main seal for the 8V71 was waaaay too small to fit the hole in this cover. I had an aluminum reducer machined to fit the seal and the 6V92 housing.

The big belt driven DN alternator wouldn't bolt up either, necessitating a new smaller alternator off the'front' of the engine.

Ring gear, hub, shift cable and shift tower all came as a package deal with my transmission.

I also installed a separate stand-alone Hayden transmission cooler that cools the transmission just fine. No extra heat pumped into the cooling system on the MC7.

Logged

Mark Morgan    near Brandon, Manitoba, Canada
1972 MCI-7     'PapaBus'  8v-71N MT654 Automatic
Ralph7
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 160




Ignore
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2013, 06:53:33 PM »

        The MT644/654/etc. was designed for lighter loads/smaller engines, thus MT (medium duty), smaller bell housing, etc.
         The HD 700/740/745, heavy duty. The housing should be the same as the stick.
         While it is out I would replace the rear main seal!!!
         Also while it is out, IF you have a belt driven alt, check the bearings on the engine pulley!!!
         I have a Hayden trans cooler with a thermostat controlled fan, comes on around 180 , thermostat  is adjustable 160-250 ($35.00 Summit racing)
Logged
Brian Diehl
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 984




Ignore
« Reply #28 on: August 16, 2013, 07:28:18 AM »

The guys @ C & J bus will do a good job for you.  If you don't have it, their number is 952 881 0034.  Ask for J.D.  He'll treat you right.
Logged
Cheryl
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2




Ignore
« Reply #29 on: August 29, 2013, 03:45:20 PM »

Thanks for the help.  We found out the bell crank is definitely broke and have it out.  That was a chore in itself.  Welding wont work as somehow the broken piece is gone.  We haven't been able to find it.  I'll call the company in Jersey and pray for the best. 
Logged
B_K
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 431




Ignore
« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2013, 04:32:19 PM »

If Luke doesn't have it you might also try Sam Caylor of Caylor Supply near Kansas City. He's been a source of MCI parts for years! http://www.caylorsupply.com/
Grin  BK  Grin
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!