Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
September 02, 2014, 05:22:00 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If your computer is lost, damaged, or stolen, we will replace all of your E-Mags for free.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: 4106 shore power quit working  (Read 1110 times)
RottenBob
Chapel Hill Bob - 4106
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 14


PD4196-968


WWW

Ignore
« on: August 28, 2013, 01:31:09 PM »

Hey all,

I bought my 4106 three years ago and thus far have not had to ask any questions on this forum. But that all changed yesterday when I went into the bus and saw red lights on my Xantrex panel (see attached pic). The bus has not been driven at all this summer so I was a bit surprised.

I checked the shore power coming into the bus and a meter showed that I was getting 125V into and through my main cutoff switch and into my ATS, but nothing was coming through the switch (see attached pics). Inside the switch box are what appear to be two relays and I am pretty sure that until this week, when I plugged in the shore power I heard one of those relays activate. Today, the relays do not activate even though power is coming to them and even manually pushing them in does nothing, so no power is going on downstream.

Between my trifocals and my neck that doesn't bend too well any more, it is really difficult for me to look down into the relays to see if there are any burn marks, but I don't see any and don't smell any burn smell. So before I ante up the price for a new switch (that will be unreturnable) I wanted to check with y'all and see what you thought.

The switch is a Magnetek ATS 100 and I read that they are no longer around, so if this switch has to be replaced, it will be difficult for me to figure out which wire goes where since a replacement will undoubtedly have a different configuration. According to the PO, this thing is wired through a toggle switch on the dash which enables charging of house batteries by the bus alternator, but I don't have a clue where that loop ties in or how that works and I got no schematics of the home grown wiring with the bus, so I am on my own.

To make matters worse, when I opened the bay door to get to the wiring, the rubber hinge broke and the door fell off. I knew this day would come and had previously bought the rubber hinge material, which I am ready to replace. I managed to get the little screws out and am ready to slide the rubber pieces out of the channel. The question I have though is how do you slide the old piece out or the new piece in when there is no gap at either end of the body side channel to slide the rubber into the channel? I am sure I am the only one on this forum who does not know the answer to this, but it has me stumped (see attached pic) - there is no gap forward or aft.

I am leaving town for a month (without the bus thankfully) in a couple of days and can wait to fix the electrical problem, but I sure do want to get the bay doors back on before I leave, so any guidance would surely be appreciated.

thanks,
Bob Davidson AKA Rottenbob
Chapel Hill, NC
919-428-0010
 
Logged

Bob and Flora
1962 PD4106-968
Chapel Hill, NC

http://www.bobs4106.blogspot.com/
Utahclaimjumper
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 837




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2013, 02:13:45 PM »

 Most 06s had the gap at each end of the strip, both in the door and the coach. Some I have seen have the gap in the center of the groove on the coach and at each end of the door, obviously you have to position the rubber into the coach strip first. Use liquid dish soap as a lubricant, NEVER ANYTHING PETROLEUM .  Another tip, If you are unfortunate enough to loose a hinge strip while out on the road, no problem, the closing mechanism is designed to lock the door solidly into the hole, just center the door into the hole and latch it, it cannot fall out without being unlatched..>>>Dan
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 02:29:49 PM by Utahclaimjumper » Logged

Utahclaimjumper 
 EX 4106 (presently SOB)
Cedar City, Ut.
 72 VW Baja towed
wg4t50
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 770





Ignore
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2013, 02:24:44 PM »

With low battery voltage & no charging, I would make sure you have the. 120 volts getting to the Xantrax box.
Logged

MCI7 20+ Yrs
Foretravel w/ISM500
WG4T CW for over 50 wpm for ever.
Central Virginia
Red Rider
God put me here to accomplish certain things--- I'm so far behind I'll never die.
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 236





Ignore
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2013, 02:46:40 PM »

I can't offer any help with the "shore power" but I have changed all my bay hinges over the years. Utahclaimjumper has got it right. I might add, that you remove the old strips from the door and coach. Clean both tracks and install the replacement material on the coach track including the set screws. As said before "juice" the rubber up and slide the door onto the remaining hinge then install those screws and you're done. I found this information in my owners manual.The biggest problem I had was cleaning the track so the rubber could slide. Maybe a gun cleaning kit would help. 
Logged

Mike AKA; Red Rider 4106-1885
luvrbus
Hero Member
*****
Online Online

Posts: 12330




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2013, 02:58:23 PM »

Once you remove the hinge rubber take a 3 ft 3/16 or 1/4 inch wooded dowel((cheap at Ace,HD or Lowes) slit the end slide a piece of emery cloth into the slit the use a low speed drill it will clean the channels like new then use a tire mounting lube from NAPA like Murphy s, dish soap tends to dry to fast when working alone
 
With installed hinge rubber in channels take Vise Grips on each end and stretch as hard as possible any wrinkles will shorten the life of the hinge and miss align the door BTDT
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 03:55:26 PM by luvrbus » Logged

Life is short drink the good wine first
usbusin
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 501


'60 PD4104-4355(sold) Now Freightliner Conversion




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2013, 03:24:29 PM »

Bob, I had the same problem recently.  My batteries were "dead", therefore the shore power was not going through the inverter.  Bought new "house" batteries and everything is fine.  I see your inverter is showing very low voltage on your batteries.

HTH,

GaryD
Logged

Gary D

USBUSIN was our 1960 PD4104 for 16 years Ustruckin' is our 2001 Freightliner truck conversion
RottenBob
Chapel Hill Bob - 4106
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 14


PD4196-968


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2013, 03:51:48 PM »

Hi all - thanks for the responses. I am also glad to hear that a door that falls off can be locked in place on the road; that is one thing that has always bugged me since I knew these hinges would eventually fail.

luvrbus - thanks for the tops on cleaning the grooves - I will go to NAPA tomorrow and get some tire mounting lube

Dan - the picture I attached that shows no gap is representative of the whole bus; there are no gaps anyway to slide the rubber in to, either at the ends of the channel or anywhere in the middle. I guess I could cut a gap if I had to....

Dave - I plan also tomorrow to reroute the wiring around the ATS to the inverter since it might be a while before this all gets fixed.

Gary - I assumed the low voltage shown on the panel was because the the batteries had been discharging for a while now with no juice going into the bus to recharge them.  I sure didn't think though that 'dead' batteries would keep house current from getting to the inverter. The house batteries are old though and I had been planning to replace them before my next trip; I guess I will go ahead and bite the bullet sooner rather than later and pop for new ones.
Logged

Bob and Flora
1962 PD4106-968
Chapel Hill, NC

http://www.bobs4106.blogspot.com/
Utahclaimjumper
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 837




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2013, 04:20:32 PM »

 Obviously the present rubber got installed somehow, its not too difficult to cut off one end an inch if need be..>>>Dan
Logged

Utahclaimjumper 
 EX 4106 (presently SOB)
Cedar City, Ut.
 72 VW Baja towed
chessie4905
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 627





Ignore
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2013, 04:42:01 PM »

   That tire mounting lubricant is called Ruglide; been around for years. Good to keep around for other uses too, like installing windows or lubing rubber parts.
Logged

GMC h8h 649#028
Pennsylvania-central
Sam 4106
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 645





Ignore
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2013, 07:35:59 PM »

There is a gap in the center of the hinge on the inside of the portion attached to the body. Insert one end of the rubber into the center gap and then the other end. The door has to be slid on from one end after the rubber is installed into the body.

The automatic transfer switch is for 50 amp shore power, but since the bus is wired for 30 amp shore power, only 2 terminals on each relay are used. The right side of the relays are the output from both shore and generator, since there are jumpers between the 2 relays on the right side. The top relay is for shore power. the bottom relay is for generator, since there are wires on the input (left) that go to the time delay, allowing the generator to get up to speed before the relay engages. If the transfer switch is working on shore power there should be power on both sides of the top relay.

 The switch on the dash and the relay to allow charging of the house batteries has nothing to do with the transfer switch. That is strictly for the 12 volt DC system.

I notice that the remote panel for the inverter indicates "inverting" why do you have the inverter inverting when you are hooked to shore power? That just facilitates killing the batteries if you lose shore power.

Good luck, Sam 
Logged

1976 MCI-8TA with 8V92 DDEC II and Allison HT740
OneLapper
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 516



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2013, 08:51:51 AM »

The gap is in the center of the channel, visible from the bay if looking up at the channel.  It's approx 1.5" long.  Insert one end of the rubber, pull it to the end, then insert the end of the rubber and pull that to the opposite end. That's it.  It's there, just hard to see, especially when you don't know exactly what you're looking for. 
Logged

OneLapper
1964 PD4106-2853
www.markdavia.com
RottenBob
Chapel Hill Bob - 4106
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 14


PD4196-968


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2013, 12:22:52 PM »

Yep, you are right - I expected the gap to be visible above the bay doors, not to have to crawl under and look up. Now I can finish the job - thanks!

Also, I talked to Sam4106 and I think I know how to proceed as far as figuring out the ATS problem - we both agreed that it is probably a faulty relay coil, which might be an easy fix.

Thanks for everyone for their input!

Bob Davidson
Chapel Hill, NC
Logged

Bob and Flora
1962 PD4106-968
Chapel Hill, NC

http://www.bobs4106.blogspot.com/
Don4107
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 407





Ignore
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2013, 01:15:17 PM »

Luke passed on a hint for replacing hinges.  I have not tried it yet but he should know.  His suggestion was to cut a couple inch piece of the new hinge since they are over length and use it with plenty of water to clean and insure that the new hinge will slide all the way in.  Use nothing petroleum based to clean or install.

I bought a whole rack full of stuff at an auction that had an unopened gallon of Ruglide.  It will get used for sure.

Good luck
Don
Logged

Don 4107 Eastern Washington
1975 MCI 5B
1966 GM PD 4107 for sale
1968 GMC Carpenter
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!