Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
October 01, 2014, 01:31:19 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you had an E-Mag Subscription:  It will not get lost in the mail.
   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Homebuilt Vs Factory built??  (Read 1986 times)
robertglines1
steam nut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4014





Ignore
« on: November 19, 2013, 04:26:15 AM »

Over the past year I've take a few jabs at the 89 prevost I passed on. Won't say they were not deserved!!  Will offer up the new owner did not have time to come himself for pick up and explanation but sent his custom makeover car team to pick it up.  The only things they would let me explain was how the buttons worked for the slides and how the gen started.The books and drawings I sent with the coach for some reason did not stay there after they left my house at this point I really don't know what all was destroyed..  There is much more to structure on slides than how they go in and out.  My fault I had been lazy and left some bad wiring in from a failure the previous year(ground fault failure) was easy for me because I new what it was(junk to me) also I use twist locks.. rite or wrong that's what I did.  Another debate please(topic) The new owners guys were more interested in where to eat and how to hook up their music device to the surround system.  My present coach was a FACTORY CONVERSION I will leave converter blank  (not a major)  and in all truth I would be disappointed in it's construction. I bought it as a salvage shell and tore it all the way down..The PREVOST side is great the the converter was way sloppy to be a so called PROFESSIONAL.  My point I'm not a professional take what I say as school of hard knocks and opinions only..  My best thought to the old 89 and his owner I do understand your frustration with any type of project gone wrong in ones dreams.         Now to hit post or delete?
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 05:31:59 AM by robertglines1 » Logged

Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
Jon
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 232




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2013, 04:42:23 AM »

Regardless of whether a coach is store bought or home built, one of the most disappointing things I have learned is how few new owners fret over petty details and fail to take the time to learn the important stuff.

Usually with a store bought coach a new owner has some backup from the converter. If they get in trouble they can call the company that built the coach. That may be the case with a home built but if I sold a coach and all the buyer wanted to learn was where the key was I would be very reluctant to answer the phone calls after a while because the buyer did not give a damn when I was willing to offer all the training required.

Read the posts on all the forums and see how many new owners ever spent the days (yes days) necessary to learn their new coach.
Logged

Jon

Current coach 2006 Prevost, Liberty conversion
Knoxville, TN
Jeremy
Hero Member
*****
Online Online

Posts: 1889


1987 Bedford Plaxton


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2013, 04:47:04 AM »

It's an interesting topic. I learnt (about boats) a long time ago that a home built (and I deliberately won't say 'amateur built') boat can be a far better craft than one built by a professional, simply because the home-builder doesn't have to count how many hours he puts into the project. But there's plenty of home-built shockers out there too.

The difficulty comes when a home-builder passes his pride-and-joy onto someone else, especially if the new owner is a 'consumer' rather than a 'creator'. I've built my own slide-outs in my bus, and am 100% confident in them because I know them intimately. But they might flummox someone else entirely, who would then blame the engineering itself, rather than their understanding of their engineering.

So I'm extremely sympathetic Bob. (But then I don't know the bus, and it might be one of those shockers!  Cheesy)

Jeremy
Logged

A shameless plug for my business - visit www.magazineexchange.co.uk for back issue magazines - thousands of titles covering cars, motorbikes, aircraft, railways, boats, modelling etc. You'll find lots of interest, although not much covering American buses sadly.
robertglines1
steam nut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4014





Ignore
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2013, 05:06:04 AM »

No excuses here guys! It is what one can live with.  Some like magneto power some computer.  I have sellers remorse!  The point to prospective new bus buyers is what can you live with?Huh??    Liberty Coach MFG have 100's of thousands of hrs of R&d the average home converter maybe 2000  ..OK more  because it is never finished.  I have decided this one will prob stay in the family because the boys know why things are like they are built and what can be changed without effecting everything else. If not It will have been a great ride!
Logged

Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
oldmansax
Tom & Phyllis
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 995


'82 Bluebird Wanderlodge PT40




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2013, 05:20:26 AM »

The simple fact is motor homes are complicated. A bus converted into a motor home is even more complicated. A 30 or 40 year old bus adds another layer. I think a lot of folks get caught up in the glamor (and I use the word loosely) of a conversion and gloss over the number of systems it takes to make things work, AND the amount of learning it will take to work them PROPERLY.

When I picked up the Wanderlodge, I stayed at the POs house for 2 weeks learning and repairing systems for the trip back. After 3 years I am still learning. Of course, Bluebird over-engineered the conversion in my opinion. It came with four 4" binders of instructions and over fifty 3'x4' blueprints.

You could spend a lifetime working on this thing....... Oh wait! lots of us have!!     Grin Grin

TOM
Logged

'82 BlueBird WanderLodge PT40 being rebuilt
Delaware

DON'T STEAL! The government hates competition!
luvrbus
Hero Member
*****
Online Online

Posts: 12591




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2013, 05:23:41 AM »

Just my 2 cents worth after buying a owner converted MCI 5 with no idea or drawing on how the conversion was done after a few years I scraped the bus lost a lot of money on the bus so I can see both sides

When we sold our Eagle I made sure Matt had all the drawing and schematics along with photos from the beginning owner conversions can be a nightmare or a pleasure same as the pro conversions  

Now the slides they can be a lot of problems no matter who does those Prevost had a lot of problems with their factory slides it took several years for Prevost to get it 1/2 right B&B,HB Industries and others had trouble with the add on slides  

Me personally I would not buy a owner conversion without documentation on every aspect of the conversion that was a costly education for me with the MCI 5

 People with the factory bus conversion like the Beaver,Vogue and others having the same problem with the converters long gone with very little info on the conversion JMO  
Logged

Life is short drink the good wine first
bobofthenorth
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2086



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2013, 05:42:20 AM »

I haven't paid real close attention to this saga so no doubt I'm missing some important details (as usual).  However, if I buy a used piece of equipment everything that happens after I sign the cheque is on me.  If the previous owner is helpful that's great but if I choose to ignore the PO that's on me. 
Logged

R.J.(Bob) Evans
1981 Prevost 8-92, 10 spd
My website
Our weblog
Simply growing older is not the same as living.
Rick 74 MC-8
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 213





Ignore
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2013, 05:50:57 AM »

it's very easy to criticize someone else's work. it's also very easy to criticize your own work after the project is done.why did I do it that way I could have done this. life is a learning project if we all did it right the first time it could be pretty boring


Rick 74MC-8
Logged

About 20 Miles West Of Chicago
robertglines1
steam nut
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4014





Ignore
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2013, 05:54:42 AM »

I have this feeling that the first time this new to me 2015  XXXX prevost Ultral linner conversion spaceship  started talking and blinking at me and saying no BOB YOUR WRONG you can't do that!!  there would be a. --- accidental---  FIRE!!!!!      Just though I would add a Joke there...  Maybe my mind just needed a burp...  Thanks..will continue to share screw ups.
Logged

Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
luvrbus
Hero Member
*****
Online Online

Posts: 12591




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2013, 06:12:23 AM »

I don't know the details of sell that is between Bob and buyer I never saw the bus come up for sale but I tend to agree with Evans he bought the bus he should have inspected the bus or it could be he bought the bus because of Bobs reputation here and wasn't worried about it who knows

 One thing you never post is my slides do not leak they all leak lol except ForeTravel and Newell  
« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 06:15:49 AM by luvrbus » Logged

Life is short drink the good wine first
chessie4905
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 693





Ignore
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2013, 06:45:59 AM »

   From some of the things I've read about being done by different owners to their conversions over the years..examples: zip cord for wiring, exhaust up through the roof, wood stoves, oil drums for holding tanks, keeping baggage racks, spending 20 grand to change engine to save 2 mpg, using used telephone company batteries, etc.. It's interesting to say the least. Factory conversions can be nice if the company is still around when YOU own it. Many times, some of the components especially electrical or electronic used are no longer available/obsolete. Some of the interior work can be poorly done as far as durability goes. Remember that they built them with profit in mind, and some of these same companies also build the s&s with much of the same materials. Home done conversions can be a fantastic deal also, IF closely researched before buying, but 99% of them have some kind or more shortcomings. Fantastic interior workmanship with crude wiring and or plumbing, or fantastic job with major rust or mechanical/structural issues or some other problem. You just need to inspect carefully and know what you can competently or financially deal with after the sale.
   Younger generation individuals can have significant different desires on a purchase, such as sound systems, solar, whatever.
   Unfortunately, too many new buyers here don't listen to good advice here and purchase hastily.
   Eventually, all of us here will need to sell or trade up at some time in the future. It can be an  exasperating experience to find that buyer, especially with unrealistic expectations on return on your financial investment.  Be patient,get what you can, and move on. Fortunately, the interest in conversions appears to have increased in the past several months, from the indication of new posters, especially with fuel prices. I remember this happening back when Carter was in office, and fuel prices shot up to 65 cents per gallon. My Brill only got 5 miles to the gallon, and money was tight.
Logged

GMC h8h 649#028
Pennsylvania-central
lvmci
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 673





Ignore
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2013, 08:08:52 AM »

Hi All, when I was lurking for such a long time, and before that when working besides a fellow cameraman who also wanted a conversion,( we spent the whole rehearsals talking about converting,) I felt as if you guys were addressing your knowledge and experiences directly at  me, like a student in a class. I looked at 12 conversions and drove 9. Of course I wanted tobuythe first one and become a busnut. But it was your steady mantra of keep looking, that I took to heart, as it turns out I did buy the first one, after a considerable time with barganing, also part of your mantra, and the knowledge I gained during that time was invaluable, not only in knowing what to look for but also the expectation as to what I was getting and hense a lower frustration level after the purchase. No buyers remorse, which I attributed to you guys, lvmci...
Logged

MCI5A 8V71 Allison MT643
lostagain
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1531


MC5C




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2013, 08:34:03 AM »

In 2004, not looking for a bus, I saw that Courier 96 for sale, realized it was one I used to drive way back then, went to look at it, had to have it, and bought it. Brought it home, fixed what needed fixing and renovated/modified to our taste, and never regretted it. Lots of miles with great memories in it.

Then saw the current MC5 and same thing: loved it at first sight, bought it and drove it home. Fixed what needed fixing, no regrets, still love it, enjoy maintaining and fixing and building new things for it every winter. Great trips and adventures every summer, and soon winters down South.

Various systems either work or they don't and need fixing. Or need tearing off and rebuilding. Then maintained regularly. You can't blame the previous owner once it is yours.

Have fun.

JC
Logged

JC
Invermere, BC
1977 MC5C, 6V92/HT740
muddog16
Example is more powerful than reproach. ~Aesop
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 506



WWW

Ignore
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2013, 09:40:28 AM »

After 7 years of watching and reading posts on home conversions this probably won't be popular or well received.........there are mayber 6 or 7 people I would actually buy a self done conversion from.   From extension cord electrical installations (which was a absolute no no for me, why?, because I spent 35 years in the trade I know the difference) to some of the most hair brain ideas I've ever seen.........LOL.........I know, I know...........(do it your way) < which means I have no idea what I'm doing or and have no knowledge of what worksmanship is).  That said, I have met many really nice people on here who have great intensions and there are some who would send you on a wild goose chase out of oneryness!  If you have to ask how a turn signal works...........don't buy a bus!  There are no easy answers in converting a bus.........some of these store bought buses........are not much better...........thousands of feet of wire and electronics in one of the worse environments isn't a great idea.......unless you like a support vehicle following you around.......some of these fancy buses in 10 years are going to be a total nitemare for the average person.  I've seen some really awesome ideas and craftsmanship on these boards.........and others........well........I'm not exactly how to describe it!  Love of a hobby doesn't mean you are capable of doing it.......20,000 lbs flying down the highway for some is a out of control missle looking for a place to destruct! It's a tough hobby and expensive and not for the faint of heart.   Bob this was a great topic thanks!
Logged

Pat

1982 Prevost LeMirage
8V92TA/HT754

http://prevostlemirage.blogspot.com/
Don Fairchild
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 759




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2013, 10:51:04 AM »

When I bought my country coach I drove to Kentucky to pick it up and made sure I got the book's with it and I don't leave home without them. I looked it over and knew it had a bad engine and some things did not work so that's on me. I drove it to new Orleans then to Texas then up to BK's for his first rally before I got it home. See muldoonman for the engine work I did. This bus has systems to run systems and at time it to much to look at. I don't like the way it is wired and am changing it as I go. I would like to sell it but every time I fix something else I take a trip in it then want to keep it a while longer. Country Coach is out of business and I have to find out who the original supplier was and go the them if I can and get what I need. Now I am having problems with the thetford toilet and can't get the parts I need because they sold to a new co. so I don't know if I will buy a new one or what.  Stuff happens and It 's what we do about it that counts. bottom line is I would do it all over again

Don
Logged
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!