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Author Topic: Adding Power Steering  (Read 2658 times)
Bryan
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« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2013, 09:50:54 PM »

Hey Bryan

Take a look at the bottom of this post for some pictures of the Sheppard power steering system I installed on my 4106. Um, you do not need to remove the axle to install. 

http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=7748.0



Checked out the pics! Wow! I noticed you talked about the play in your steering wheel. Mine has a LOT of play in it. Will that be fixed when installing PS?
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Bryan Edmonds
PD4107-756
Toccoa, GA
luvrbus
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« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2013, 04:18:57 AM »

Yep that is the bad point of the Sheppard gear there is no adjustment to take the slop out and they do get sloppy ,unlike the Ross that has a adjustment
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Hard Headed Ken
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1988 Prevost Angola Conversion Repowered With 14L Series 60 & Eaton Ultrashift


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« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2013, 04:54:35 AM »

The folks at Sheppard say a new Sheppard gear can have 2" of free play at the steering wheel and that is acceptable. Not to me. Ross made one 492 series axle mount gear that was used on the MCI 96A2, that's the best thing you could put on a GMC, but they are nearly impossible to find. I took an old Ross gear with a long sector shaft that mounted to the spring perch and a regular frame mount Ross gear and made an axle mount gear for my 4104. Most people are happy with their Sheppards, It's a very durable gear but the fact there is no free play adjustment can be a problem. Unfortunately the Sheppard is the only thing that's readily available. I have a Sheppard gear left over from a separate project that's one of the tighter ones I've seen, It's for sale.

Ken
« Last Edit: November 22, 2013, 05:03:58 AM by Hard Headed Ken » Logged

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« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2013, 05:07:33 AM »

I did like Kirby I took a Ross from a MCI 9 and made a bracket installed it on a 4104 and no problem the owner has been running it now for 10 years   
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Bryan
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« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2013, 08:14:43 AM »

Thanks guys! What are the best methods in searching for a Ross?
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Bryan Edmonds
PD4107-756
Toccoa, GA
Hard Headed Ken
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« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2013, 11:26:34 AM »

Probably a truck salvage yard. You might try Lewis Bus Lines in Augusta GA. Joey had a 96A2 gear several years ago but he wouldn't sell it to me. In a salvage yard the problem maybe a finding a gear with a long enough sector shaft that will get the pitman arm under the axle. Since you are changing things for the better try to find a 90 degree gear box from a later model transit bus. They have tapered roller bearings instead of brass bushings and you can flip the gears around if the steering gear you find is the wrong rotation.

Ken
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« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2013, 11:39:01 AM »

He should take the bus to you Ken or somebody that done the change before it is not for the faint of heart or cheap  Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: November 22, 2013, 11:42:49 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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chessie4905
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« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2013, 05:52:34 PM »

   We had the Sheppard installed in our 4104. It had virtually NO play in the steering wheel. You need to check for play in the steering shaft u-joints, slip joint, tie rod ends, king pins, drag link ends, and bevel gears at bottom of column where the drive shaft to steering gear connects. Oh, and change those bevel gears to 1 to 1 when changing over.
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GMC h8h 649#028
Pennsylvania-central
Hard Headed Ken
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« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2013, 07:58:21 PM »

Some of them are tight, Uncle Ned has a good one. Sometimes the owner has just become accustom to the free play and doesn't realize how badly the coach drives. That was my case. Two tests, go to a big empty parking lot, turn the wheel either to the left or right stop, accelerate with no hands on the wheel it should return to the straight ahead position. The more it doesn't the worse it's going to drive. The next test requires a dial indicator and maybe a helper, make a pointer from a wire hanger, tape it to the dash and point it to the steering wheel. Use a dial indicator to measure when the tire begins to move when turning the steering wheel one direction then the other. Using the pointer mark the steering wheel when tire movement begins in both directions, that distance is the free play.  1/8" or less is good, the greater the number, the worse it's going to drive. My advice is don't do these tests if you are happy with the way your bus drives.

Ken
« Last Edit: November 22, 2013, 08:11:01 PM by Hard Headed Ken » Logged

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« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2013, 06:14:58 AM »

I have been to 3 world fairs saw almost everything but never saw a Sheppard steering on GM bus that wasn't sloppy and loose

 Like Ken I guess if you don't know the difference and are happy it works I drove a 4905 for 300 miles it was a constant battle for me after years of owning and driving a Eagle with Ross steering I am not saying they are not out there I just haven't came across one yet
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 09:09:46 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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wildbob24
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« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2013, 02:48:42 PM »

Bryan

I have heard of this elusive Ross axle mounted steering gear, but have never actually seen one. If you want to add power steering to your bus, you'll most likely have to use the Sheppard system.

If you're bus has the optional power-assist steering, you'll be ahead of the game as you can use the existing pump with the Sheppard gear by changing out the pressure relief valve and most of the plumbing will be in place.

I see your email address in your profile. I'll send you a copy of a GM/Sheppard conversion manual that should prove helpful in your search. Let me know if you receive it.

Ive got .pdf versions of the 4107 maintenance and parts manuals, if you need them.

Bob
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P8M4905A-1308, 8V71 w/V730
Custom Coach Conversion
Duluth, GA
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« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2013, 03:26:31 PM »

Here is a upgraded Sheppard system that works on a GM and not hard to install

Model 492-AP-1-2 sector but you have to change the pump to a 4 gpm with operating psi of 1750 # you can find those on a 1992 Orion transit bus axle mounted fwiw Kirby 4104 has a Ross on his GM  

If he hasn't sold the bus for scrap I may know where a Sheppard steering system is at I have a friend that bought a Orion for the DDEC engine and electronic transmission for 2500 bucks at a Vegas sale I'll check that out for you
 
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 03:39:08 PM by luvrbus » Logged

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wildbob24
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« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2013, 03:47:32 PM »

Clifford,

Yes, the Vickers pump used with the booster cylinder on the 4107 is rated at 4 gallons per minute with the pressure restricted to 1000psi. You can boost the pressure to 1500psi, which is the pressure used on the 4905  with the 492-AP-1 gear. The part number for that relief valve is 11G-9-2, available from MCI for about $50.

I wonder if the increased pressure makes the gear work better.

Bob



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P8M4905A-1308, 8V71 w/V730
Custom Coach Conversion
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« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2013, 03:59:35 PM »

What is the difference between the AP-1 and the AP-1-2 sector Bob we replaced the AP-1 with the AP-1-2 and had to replace the pump
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chessie4905
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« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2013, 04:26:07 PM »

   Too many Sheppard setups on GM's have never had the caster reset to a few degrees of positive for better tracking. Negative caster makes it easier to steer, but has a greater tendency to wander. Also many never go through the effort to eliminate the play from loose or worn components. Also check Shepard for play with engine running.
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GMC h8h 649#028
Pennsylvania-central
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