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Author Topic: Biggest Fail  (Read 2986 times)
sledhead
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« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2013, 07:22:33 AM »

Not the biggest but ...I installed a 9000 btu mini split a/c heat unit in the coach and it has been working great for 3 years now . I chose the 9000 unit so I could use it with my 2000 watt inverter when on the road and it works good but I have learned that after 3 hrs the batteries get a really good work out and now if I know I need it on for a long time I start the gene . When it fails I will replace it with a bigger unit 12000 btu and just use the gene to power it when on the road .    dave 
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1990 mci 102c  6v92 ta ht740  kit,living room slide . home base huntsville ontario canada
luvrbus
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« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2013, 08:15:39 AM »

You are not the only that has had a problem Sean there is just not enough around in mobile installs to judge the units I don't think you personally hurt the mini/splits myself,Bob is passionate about the units all of us are about one thing or the other it can be engines or a cook top.

Me I would like to  know about the warranty if a problem arises I know Carrier is very plain about the warrant in a mobile use but that could be because they manufacture a package unit for office trailers who knows  

Then when I read the install directions on one I ask myself how do you keep one level and 1 ft away from any obstruction in a bus bay ?  

The first person I ever heard of using a mini/split in a bus was Ace that was over 10 years ago so it not new territory we are talking about here his H has roof tops fwiw  

 I have a new condensation pump like the Carrier uses if one of you mini/split installers need one it's new and free for only the shipping
« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 08:27:42 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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robertglines1
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« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2013, 11:08:10 AM »

Thanks Sean for the feed back. The  failure point.. I paid particular attention to that point as I found one of my units when shipped did not have that factory connection anchored within the unit. I also over tightened a nut and cracked a flare on the copper line myself causing a slow leak..  I  like the technology  It just needs to be made into a package unit like a roof top for general use.. Again thank you for the answer.   Bob
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Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
robertglines1
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« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2013, 11:17:55 AM »

Was assuming when changing transmission types that the rear end ratio would be OK since both were Overdrive... wrong!! when doing the final numbers it required a change.. that required a extensive  amount of research because of Prevost having their housings built to their spec ..  finally ended up with a gear set from a local gear head that said I recognize that set up...  Went from 4:56  to 3:07....(the abs was the problem)  I considered it a adjustment   or bump in road... as nothing has been a fail just the cost of education or learning what is on the other side of the hill...  We share can smooth the ride out a little----Bob
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Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
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« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2013, 12:04:36 PM »

Thanks Sean for the feed back. The  failure point.. I paid particular attention to that point as I found one of my units when shipped did not have that factory connection anchored within the unit. I also over tightened a nut and cracked a flare on the copper line myself causing a slow leak..  I  like the technology  It just needs to be made into a package unit like a roof top for general use.. Again thank you for the answer.   Bob

Is it the inverter technology that should be put in rooftop A/C units?  Could they do it for the same cost as a current rooftop unit?  Cost is the biggest driving factor for most rooftop A/C units as most are purchased by RV manufacturers and RV buyers rarely buy RVs based on which rooftop A/C is on the unit.  Those of us who are converting buses and actually carefully pick an A/C unit are the exception.

I would love a better rooftop A/C unit that is more powerful with lower amp draw, but it probably isn't happening.  It takes more power to run the three rooftop A/C units on my bus than it takes to run the central A/C in my 2,700 square foot house.  Now, my house is way better insulated, but the rooftops are just not that efficient.
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Brian Elfert - 1995 Dina Viaggio 1000 Series 60/B500 - 75% done but usable - Minneapolis, MN
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« Reply #20 on: December 14, 2013, 01:00:40 PM »

The Aislu roof top Monaco is using now is a inverter type fwiw comes from the same people in China that makes all brands mini/splits
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robertglines1
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« Reply #21 on: December 14, 2013, 07:53:17 PM »

Has a picture of a penguin all over the literature--- very interesting.. to late for me..  Bob
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Bob@Judy  98 XLE prevost with 3 slides --Home done---last one! SW INdiana
Scott Bennett
Scott & Heather MCI-9
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« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2013, 09:12:34 PM »

What needs to be done to convert a rooftop to a basement air type of unit? Can you flip the compressor and flip the unit upside down and push the air through floor ducts?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. Clumsy fingers may contribute to mistakes.
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Scott & Heather
1984 MCI9 6V92-turbo with 9 inch roof raise & conversion in progress.
http://www.scottmichaelbennett.com/p/our-bus.html
˙ǝɯoɔlǝʍ suoıʇɐuop ˙snq ʍǝu ɐ pǝǝu ʎlqɐqoɹd ll,ǝʍ 'sıɥʇ pɐǝɹ uɐɔ noʎ ɟı
Oonrahnjay
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« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2013, 05:35:37 AM »

  What needs to be done to convert a rooftop to a basement air type of unit? Can you flip the compressor and flip the unit upside down and push the air through floor ducts? 

     Scott - Tom has done a beautiful job on his install and certainly he should be the fount of all detailed answers, but -- as I understood his photos -- his setup is based upon ducting, not flipping the units over.   (And from my reading on the rooftops, they would not operate upside down or even at any angle greater than 15 degrees from horizontal.)  But what keeps droppin shop rags in my turbo is the fact that Penguin quotes a "normal run" amperage of 14.5 Amp for a 12.5 Btu unit and the mini-splits are quoted as 8.5 amps (both 120V - AC only/not "heat pump") for the 12.5 unit.   That is a very substantial difference.  I wouldn't mind running two mini-splits off a 30Amp shore power plug (if that was all that was available) but 30Amp wouldn't run two rooftops.

      Also, I have a "dead space" right at the front of my bus that would be perfect for the location of the evaporator units to mini-splits.  One could be placed in the top of the space and (with minimal ducting) would be in a perfect position to blow cold air into the living room upstairs.  It would also be easy to add a second duct with a low-amp fan to direct cold air to the bedroom area.  The second evap unit would direct cold air directly downwards along the ("downstairs") windshield into the driver/passenger area.   With an efficient packaging of the compressor units (remember, I don't have bays under my bus) I'd have 25K Btu of cooling at less than 20 Amp of current draw.*

      On the other hand, the rooftops are dead reliable (even in the hands of an electrical idiot -- "Guilty as charged, your Honor") and the mini-splits have been plagued with quality and installation issues. 

      So, it looks like there are good solutions out there but there's no perfect solution.  And I want it perfect!   BH   

(* Regarding installation, however, Tom's setup for the rooftops "indoors" could be arranged so that they're upstairs right over the driver's compartment.  With easy, compact ducting, they could be setup to blow cold air from both units into the driver's area for comfort for the driver and The Management on those summer afternoon drives heading west when all the sun in the world is coming right into the windshield.  When parked, flip a baffle on each unit and direct the output upstairs for the living room/bedroom.   Or set the baffles "half and half" if that works best.  So, the mini-split installation isn't a slam-dunk certainty.)

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Bruce H; Wallace (near Wilmington) NC
1976 Daimler (British) Double-Decker Bus; 34' long
6-cyl, 4-stroke, Leyland O-680 engine

(New Email -- brucebearnc@ (theGoogle gmail place) .com)
luvrbus
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« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2013, 05:50:46 AM »

Just buy the Cruisair packaged unit Scott people here over look the Cruisair they are good units I installed 3 in the Eagle and never looked back they are a popular unit with the Prevost converters a little pricey but they do the job

 One has to design a HVAC for their use I forgot where I read it but most RV's are designed more for cooling,like you need heat and heat rises so ducts in the floor should work good

 When trying to move cold air up it will take more cfm,power and btu's to accomplish the task kinda a catch 22 anyway you go at it

good luck
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RJ
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« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2013, 11:34:17 AM »

When trying to move cold air up it will take more cfm, power and btu's to accomplish the task. Kinda a catch 22 anyway you go at it.

Ideally A/C vents in the ceiling, heating vents in the floor.

Easy, right?

 Cheesy
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RJ Long
PD4106-2784 No More
Fresno CA
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« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2013, 01:55:03 PM »

Getting back to the original subject. My biggest fail was my entire conversion ! I spent so much time and money converting a bus that is essentially obsolete  ?!
I have no one to blame but myself ! I started the conversion long before I discovered this forum Sad
If I could turn back time. When I got my bus I thought the MC9 was the work horse of the industry and that parts and mechanics would be no problem.
Wrong !!!! Turns out and any shop I call or visit, once I tell them I have an 1984 MC9, they pretty much laugh in my face and tell me I have a relic and that I should scrap it !!!

If I could do it all over, I would start with a modern bus with a modern drive train. A series 60 Detroit and a B500 Allison.
Oh well. What can I do ? I've developed a thick skin for when guys laugh at me for building a conversion on an "old relic "
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New York City
1984 MC9 6v92T
chessie4905
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« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2013, 02:21:35 PM »

   If I did it all over, I'd have a 4905....oh wait; never mind.
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GMC h8h 649#028
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Scott Bennett
Scott & Heather MCI-9
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« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2013, 05:34:27 AM »

Interesting. Thanks for humoring me during my slight thread hack diversion. Checking cruise air out. In response to the above post, heather and I have had rare moments during our build that we considered buying and converting our bus a "fail" of sorts. But now that we have been full timing in it for two and a half years, and are nearing completion, we have found that we are daily falling in love with our coach. Literally several times a week you can hear us musing "sigh, I just love our bus" in a dreamy voice. Seriously. When you're giving 12 or 13 concert events in a month and some of your days are 22 hour days and you've been on the road and are just tired...you walk into your coach...and just feel "home". I just told heather yesterday that I honesty wonder how we could live any other way. She feels the same. So, though we experience some major fails during the process, converting and living in a bus has been absolutely one of the best decisions we've ever made...and can fully
Be summed up as a huge "success" more than a "fail".


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Scott & Heather
1984 MCI9 6V92-turbo with 9 inch roof raise & conversion in progress.
http://www.scottmichaelbennett.com/p/our-bus.html
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« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2013, 07:02:10 AM »

I would say my biggest fail so far is insulation.  When I had an empty shell I colud not "afford" to have it spray foamed.  I actually could have afforded it but i was ready to move on the conversion and chose to spend my money elsewhere.  I did insulate with the rigid foam board and it works OK but the spray foam would have been better. Less air leaks, tighter install etc.  It really makes a difference going down the road, the small air leaks here and there add up. I have gone back and resolved most of the issues but I would be more satisfied had I gone with the spray foam.

I also run two minisplits, installed one in 2008 and another in 2010.  Both have worked flawlessly so far.

My bus is a 40' GMC Fishbowl and there have been a few times that I wish I had gone with a different bus but overall I am pleased.  The project has turned out better than I ever expected and I really love the style of the GMC Transits and the nearly 7' of headroom that they have. 
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Brandon Stewart - Martinez, GA
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