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Author Topic: NTSB Highway accident Brief, Retarders  (Read 2013 times)
NJT 5573
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« on: January 19, 2007, 08:30:58 PM »

New to me, but I guess retarders must be turned off on slick roads. www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2002/HAB0219.htm  Bus fishtails etc. does 180, rolls 1.5 times, fatalities
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"Ammo Warrior" Keepers Of The Peace, Creators Of Destruction.
Gold is the money of Kings, Silver is the money of Gentlemen, Barter is the money of Peasants, Debt is the money of Slaves.

$1M in $1000 bills = 8 inches high.
$1B in $1000 bills = 800 feet high.
$1T in $1000 bills = 142 miles high
JerryH
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2007, 04:44:12 AM »

Good read.  Thanks.

Jerry H.
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centrix29
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« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2007, 05:06:37 AM »

It's the same with Jake brakes.  As nice as they are on solid and dry roads, they are dangerous on slippery roads.  They act on their own and take away your control.  Retarders and Jakes can slow the vehicle down as fast as brakes if they are in good working order.  An icy or slippery road calls for retarders or Jakes to be turned off.  Remember for every mile of road, there are 2 miles of ditches.  Happy traveline!

Pat
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CS
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« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2007, 09:25:31 AM »

It's the same with Jake brakes.  As nice as they are on solid and dry roads, they are dangerous on slippery roads.  They act on their own and take away your control.
Same rules apply to cruise control.
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prevost82
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« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2007, 02:53:02 PM »

I drive on snow roads for 3 to 4 month a year (5000 plus miles) with my bus in the mountains of BC. I use my Jakes all the time ..... I find it alot more scary making a brake app at low temp on snow covered roads, than using the Jake. I have never had slippage with the Jakes but have had some scary monents making a brake app. Unless your drums are warmed up, the brakes tend to grab the shoes and at low temps it's hard to keep any warmth in the drums.

This bus was traveling too fast for the road conditions and the result would have been the same (on ice) if he would have made a brake app or used a Retarder.

Most logging truck drivers would laugh at this comment about not using jakes.... it's all Jakes and gears and not too many brake apps

Ron
« Last Edit: January 20, 2007, 02:59:00 PM by prevost82 » Logged
Moof
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« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2007, 07:25:16 PM »

Most of our fire engines are 4wd.  Once the roads get slick the jakes get turned off!!!  Not only do you slide, you lose your steering.  You can turn that wheel all day and you'll keep going straight.  Or sideways, what ever the case may be.  Only takes one time to make a believer out of you.

Dave T.
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Busted Knuckle
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« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2007, 10:55:57 AM »

Back when I was trucking I learned the importance of manually controling the jakes in slick weather as I always just left them on until one day I was coming down a hill and hit a slick spot and the drives locked causing me to start into a jack knife slide. I quickly clutched it, turned the jake off and released the clutch whille gassing on it bringing it back under control and then carefully braking it down to a safe speed. The driver behind me told me over the CB he "needed to stop and change his shorts because he thought I was gonna loose it, and he couldn't stop or slow down either as we were on BLACK ICE" then he complimented me on my "save" and said he was glad I had the experience and common since to drive it out and that I wasn't a "newbie or driving school 15 day wonder" as we'd both been "TOAST' if I had been.

So yes if in bad weather by all means use common sense and manually control the jakes along with yer service brakes!  As a note above I was loaded (about 79,800 lbs) and had brand new lug style tires on! So it wasn't a "light load or slick tires" that caused the slide!
BK  Grin
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Busted Knuckle aka Bryce Gaston
KY Lakeside Travel's Busted Knuckle Garage
Huntingdon, TN 12 minutes N of I-40 @ exit 108
www.kylakesidetravel.net

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NJT 5573
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« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2007, 12:12:30 PM »

Ron, a jake on a detroit is like dragging your foot! a retarder on high is a different story. jakes and retarders work on driven wheels service brakes work on all wheels, rare for service brakes to cause a 180 spin. another note, if you don't drag the brakes and keep them dry they are indeed very unpredictable in rain and ice.
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"Ammo Warrior" Keepers Of The Peace, Creators Of Destruction.
Gold is the money of Kings, Silver is the money of Gentlemen, Barter is the money of Peasants, Debt is the money of Slaves.

$1M in $1000 bills = 8 inches high.
$1B in $1000 bills = 800 feet high.
$1T in $1000 bills = 142 miles high
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