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Author Topic: FORD POWERSTROKE  (Read 1214 times)
CrabbyMilton
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« on: November 07, 2017, 04:54:02 AM »

I know that this article is about fire apparatus. But it does show that these smaller engines are indeed capable of producing much more power then years ago. PIERCE isn't stupid and I really don't think they would offer this powertrain unless they are confident that it will be good for a pumper where higher power isn't needed.
My only question is why they just didn't use the CUMMINS ISB which is the same size and HP ratings. Oh well, I'm sure there is a spaghetti plate reason.
http://www.piercemfg.com/fordpowerstroke
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brmax
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« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2017, 05:12:27 AM »

Most likely because its a ford chassis?. Of course we know the powerstroke is actually a renamed navistar engine and ecm. So they have ford over controling the electronics vs navistar standard electronics. Thats always been a weird issue at times.

Good day
Floyd
« Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 05:14:18 AM by brmax » Logged

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CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2017, 05:34:59 AM »

That's not accurate. The 6.7L POWERSTROKE is built by FORD. They started building their own in house version a few years ago because of all of the problems with NAVISTAR's supplied engine. Many lawsuits resulted because for some reason, NAVISTAR decided that quality was no longer important. Not just that POWERSTOKE for FORD SUPERDUTY pickups but among the larger MAXFORCE engines. At one time they built great engines but those days are over.
As for PIERCE, that SABER chassis is a chassis that is built by PIERCE. That is their entry level custom chassis. A CUMMINS ISL is the standard engine in that one.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 05:46:34 AM by CrabbyMilton » Logged
bevans6
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« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2017, 05:57:20 AM »

My understanding is that Ford just came out with a Gen II version of the 6.7 diesel that addresses most of the relatively few issues that it had, turbo, EGR, some sensors.  But it gets very good power and torque from a fairly compact package.  I find that most issues that come with modern diesel engines, including the International/Ford 6.0 (which I've owned for years), 6.4 etc, are down to over-tuning of the package that they got from International without addressing fundamental issues that come with boosting HP and torque by a third from the original design.  But I have to say I ain't buying anything that has variable vane turbo on it ever again...  Mine's on it's third.

Brian
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1980 MCI MC-5C, 8V-71T from a M-110 self propelled howitzer
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Tatamagouche, Nova Scotia
luvrbus
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« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2017, 06:02:01 AM »

The 6.7 Ford diesel is not a bad engine since Ford has the kinks straighten out now nice quite with plenty of power they are starting to use those in Class A motorhomes chassis replacing the V10 gas engine .
Cummins has had good run for several years in the smaller engines now they are getting more and more competitors and losing some of their market share    
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CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2017, 06:26:22 AM »

From what I saw, the FORD 6.8L V10 is the sole engine in their class A. People have asked why there is not POWERSTROKE offered in their class A. The answer has to do with cost and/or demand. You can get the POWERSTROKE in the SUPER DUTY but not the class A stripped.
Word had it that the old V10's days are numbered and will be replaced with a 7.0L V8 in a few years.
I never drove one but I have ridden in several shuttle vans with that V10 over the years and that is one sweet sounding smooth engine and tried and true.
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lostagain
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« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2017, 06:36:36 AM »

I have owned 6.0L Powersmokes since 03 when they came out. They had problems, but when set up properly and "bullet proofed", they are a great engine. (I am rebuilding one now). The new 6.7L, since 2011, is an excellent engine. Ford really has it figured out now.

JC
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JC
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DoubleEagle
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« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2017, 06:38:05 AM »

I've got the IDI 7.3L in one truck, and the first generation 7.3L Powerstroke in another. They both are still doing just fine, and I have no desire to enter into the horrors of the current over-powered versions. When the 6.0L came out it was a disaster initially, until many improvements were made. The newer versions have more power (when they run correctly), and are quieter, but I like to announce my arrival when I pull in, and I like to get my money's worth for more than one decade (or two or three).  Wink
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Walter
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1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
TomC
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« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2017, 07:36:52 AM »

Cummins 6.7 (and 5.9) are one of those well designed small engines that can take it-much like the Chev 350. Cummins marine has a 6.7 power rating of 550hp from the factory. I normally don't like Cummins, but both the ISB 6.7 and ISL 8.9 are well designed engines. All cast iron-compared to most that have gone to aluminum heads (including Ford's 6.7).
Even though Ford doesn't install the V-10 in pickups anymore, they are still making a boat load of the engines for class C Econoline front motorhomes and any gasoline powered class A since Ford is the only chassis manufacturer for gasoline powered motorhomes. And Ford also makes the V-10 for standby gasoline, natural gas, and propane generators.  Good Luck, TomC
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
luvrbus
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« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2017, 08:10:53 AM »

Case was the designer of the 5.9 I saw the first ones being cast at the Case Foundry in Pryor Ok to replace their old 400 cubic engine they used with the balance shafts, they had another 4 banger to replace the old out dated 188 and 208 that had been around for 50 years so don't give Cummins all the credit Tenneco spent millions on development with Cummins back in the late 70's     
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CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2017, 09:27:45 AM »

Well I'm sure CASE didn't go away empty handed in that deal. $$$$
But that was circa 40 years ago and it has the CUMMINS name on it forever now but I guess sometimes names tend to stick.
Some still refer to DETROIT DIESEL as GM even though GM has had no affiliation with them for over 30 years.
Tom is right about that FORD V10 and I'll also add that BLUEBIRD offers that engine in their VISION in gasoline, CNG and propane as an alternative to the CUMMINS ISB and now that new ISV5.0 V8.
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luvrbus
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« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2017, 10:18:31 AM »

Workhorse is the only competition Ford has in the RV chassis lot of people prefer the 8.1 GM engine over the V10, same hp with 2 less cylinders plus you can get it in pusher type.Only thing I never liked about the V10 Ford they eat exhaust manifolds @ over 400 bucks ea from Ford they did upgrade the studs to S/S studs to stop the stud problem
« Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 10:22:23 AM by luvrbus » Logged

Life is short drink the good wine first
CrabbyMilton
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« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2017, 10:41:14 AM »

That's interesting and I didn't know that WORKHORSE was getting back into the RV chassis business again. But nothing on their website yet but perhaps they're working on it.
The early FORD V10's had problems but most of those have long been corrected.
I also read that when WORKHORSE gets rolling again, they'll supposedly have a PSI 8.8L V8 gasoline engine.
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DoubleEagle
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« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2017, 07:13:25 PM »

Speaking of unknown credits, the Series 60 is based on a John Deere block, if I recall correctly, and Penske developed the heads.
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Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
TomC
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« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2017, 07:29:24 AM »

John Deere worked with Detroit to develope the Series 60. If you look at John Deere's 12 liter engine, it looks very much like a Series 60, but with a conventional Bosch type fuel injection pump.
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Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
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