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Author Topic: 1973 05 Eagle Skinner Vlv. information needed  (Read 391 times)
Gary LaBombard
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« on: November 30, 2017, 07:39:06 AM »

Hey guys,
Need more technical data from the guru's.  I will post 3 photos with questions I hope you can help me out with.  I will post them one at a time in this same post so that legitimate answers can be addressed.  Any and all feedback is appreciated.

The first photos is of my skinner valve mounted in bus now.  I have modified my throttle system with Air Throttle copied off Paul Lawry.  But I have problem I am confused on.  On the photo enclosed I labeled all I am concerned about.  I do not intended to use the high throttle solenoid that used to be mounted on the governor but only intend to use the Emergency Air Solenoid.  Now my problem, when the bus airs up the Solenoid "A" in photo feeds the emergency solenoid.  But it makes the solenoid extend out and shut off the fuel to governor.  To start up bus we had to disconnect the emergency solenoid and the engine started up just fine after priming the engine.  Solenoid "B" used to feed the High Throttle which I do not feel I need to use.  Looking at the photo enclosed can I eliminate Skinner "B" and  replumb from "C" control vlv?

Another question, Is there a set pressure that should be used to control the Air Throttle and not over pressurize the system? I have not tried to use pliers to rotate the air controller "C" at this time.  I am just now trying to get info on what to try to do here. If anyone is confused, please comment and I will TRY to explain with less confusion, I hope. Thanks again.  Now for photo #2
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Gary LaBombard
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« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2017, 07:43:45 AM »

Now for Photo #2 the top of my Governor set up with air throttle.  I have chosen not to install the fast idle solenoid as seen in photo.  I have the air line still there but will disconnect. The Emergency Stop solenoid activates or plunges out and shuts off fuel when air is applied to system.  What have I done wrong?  Refer to photo #1 for skinner vlv lay out in my bus at this time. 
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Gary
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« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2017, 07:47:24 AM »

  ...  (snip)  Another question, Is there a set pressure that should be used to control the Air Throttle and not over pressurize the system? ... 

      Can't help you much with your other issues but I used an air speed control made by Williams for a while.  The tech data said to regulate air pressure to 60 psi -- after I caught that, I did but I never had any problems using full system (110 lb. or so Huh) pressure before I put the regulator on it.  I don't know if that applies to the components you're using but it's a point of data for you.
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Bruce H; Wallace (near Wilmington) NC
1976 Daimler (British) Double-Decker Bus; 34' long
6-cyl, 4-stroke, Leyland O-680 engine

(New Email -- brucebearnc@ (theGoogle gmail place) .com)
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« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2017, 07:53:30 AM »

You are confused or I am photo 2 is the normal shut down that works off the skinner valve and key switch be sure the skinner valve closes under 12 v current then it opens to shut down when no power is on the skinner valve, so it normally closed under voltage
« Last Edit: November 30, 2017, 08:02:15 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2017, 08:01:10 AM »

Photo #3. This is how I set up my fuel system for priming if needed and also emergency shut off vlvs installed on the secondary fuel filter in case of run off of engine (I do not have an emergency shut down flap in system of my bus) which everyone had me scared of.  These vlvs immediately cut off the supply of fuel to the heads.  Also in this photo is how I primed the system which can now be used if I ever need to reprime again.  I just have to remember to disconnect the fuel tank fuel line at the primary filter and install a plug then when bus starts, shut her off, remove plug and reinstall fuel line to filter.  I will install a shut off vlv here as well that will prevent priming the entire system all the way back to the tank otherwise.
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« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2017, 08:04:35 AM »

Cliff, You know I do not know what in heck I am doing and I sure can't argue with you.  Now for your help on what to do here?  Do you recommend not using the high idle solenoid?  How do I prevent the normal shut down of fuel solenoid that I thought was emergency shut down from shutting down my fuel?  Do I have it plumbed incorrectly? 
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Gary
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« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2017, 08:07:28 AM »

It will still run for a few minutes with the fuel shut off ,use a regulator for your air throttle and adjust to it your driving habits 45 to 60 pounds I would not go over 60 lbs myself.Gary those skinner valves should not be wired to gather you can use a single air supply,the plumbing looks ok top port is supply and I don't care for a fast idle either so use only 1 skinner valve to the shut down valve    
« Last Edit: November 30, 2017, 08:13:46 AM by luvrbus » Logged

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Gary LaBombard
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« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2017, 08:10:58 AM »

Cliff, I left message on your cell phone
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Gary
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« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2017, 08:19:59 AM »

Check your Email Gary I sent you the new numbers for the cell and house
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Gary LaBombard
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« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2017, 10:34:18 AM »

Cliff, I rewired and replumbed the new skinner vlv as you suggested and it works just fine now. Thanks for the help here, I knew I could count on you. Here is photos.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2017, 01:02:14 PM by Gary LaBombard » Logged

Gary
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« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2017, 03:26:00 PM »

      Can't help you much with your other issues but I used an air speed control made by Williams for a while.  The tech data said to regulate air pressure to 60 psi -- after I caught that, I did but I never had any problems using full system (110 lb. or so Huh) pressure before I put the regulator on it.  I don't know if that applies to the components you're using but it's a point of data for you.

When I put on an air throttle kit back in the nineties from Williams it came with a pressure reducing valve maxed at 60 lbs. I suspect there is a reason why they did it, and it might be inviting failure of something at higher pressures.
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Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
Gary LaBombard
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« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2017, 03:39:59 PM »

Thanks Walt, that is what I intend to do and hopefully not worry about that anymore.  I believe Cliff got me on the correct track today as my skinner vlv worked good on a couple minute of start up again after plumbing it up correctly per Cliff.  Now on Saturday my plan with a old 4104 mechanic to assist me will do a long start up, check all systems for leaks etc. and make sure all my new installations are working, like new air compressor, new air dryer, new power steering, (have to complete filling system) and get out air and see what does and does not work electrically.  So we will be busy.  Were getting closer now but not out of the woods yet. I am not sure as yet where I will put that air throttle pressure reducing valve to control it, any suggestions will be appreciated.   
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Gary
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« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2017, 03:45:53 PM »

Thanks Walt, that is what I intend to do and hopefully not worry about that anymore.  I believe Cliff got me on the correct track today as my skinner vlv worked good on a couple minute of start up again after plumbing it up correctly per Cliff.  Now on Saturday my plan with a old 4104 mechanic to assist me will do a long start up, check all systems for leaks etc. and make sure all my new installations are working, like new air compressor, new air dryer, new power steering, (have to complete filling system) and get out air and see what does and does not work electrically.  So we will be busy.  Were getting closer now but not out of the woods yet. I am not sure as yet where I will put that air throttle pressure reducing valve to control it, any suggestions will be appreciated.   

Mine was located in the compartment under the drivers seat. If I recall correctly, it also supplied the air to the driver's air seat.
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Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
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