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Author Topic: Pros and cons of using Ikea kitchen cabinets?  (Read 6647 times)
Kevin Warnock
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« on: April 17, 2007, 05:18:42 PM »

I am considering using Ikea brand kitchen cabinets on my 1994 RTS I am converting. I like the large variety they come in, and I love that you can buy the doors separate from the shells, so I can start with the cheap Arlig doors, which are about $3 to $6 each! Later, I could upgrade, and the doors just pop off in 1 second with the right tool. I will not be having any overhead cabinets, as I am keeping all the bus windows, and don't want to block them with overhead cabinets. I will use a downdraft range hood mounted in the countertop behind the cooktop.

Has anyone used Ikea cabinets. One con is that they are particle board throughout. Apparently Consumer Reports rated them a Best Buy.

Comments?

Thanks,

Kevin
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Hartley
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« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2007, 05:24:51 PM »

Try to get completely away from particle board as fast as you can.

If they sell solid real wood doors and faces, Then buy them, and make the cabinets out of plywood
to mount them on. You will be much happier and it won't fall apart or off the wall when you least expect
it.

Just my thing after having been there a few times. Particle Board and MDF all stinks in a moving, flexing
and variable moisture environment.

The general rule is; If it expands and falls apart with moisture, It doesn't go into the bus..

Enjoy....

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« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2007, 05:42:11 PM »

I have to agree with the "DrDave" on that. You don't want any Particle Board for your boxes. I made the plywood boxes and got the doors and hardware from a cabinet shop.

You also would have a hard time fitting them to the curve of the wall and ceiling.
Ron

I should add, that I didn't build face frame cabinets like most SS RV's, I built boxes like your kitchen cab's but out of plywood and screwed them together.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2007, 05:44:56 PM by prevost82 » Logged
Hartley
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« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2007, 09:08:30 PM »

 Shocked Shocked Shocked

And...... If your cabinets are stapled together..BIG Mistake....

I was redoing my solid wood cabinets last week, Went to cut a corner and the staples all pulled out and the
Oak Face and Door fell completely off in my hand, And that was just from the vibration of my cordless dewalt
sabre saw...

Now they are all SCREWED together. An application of handy dandy countersink bit and finish grade drywall screws
means that power tools will be the only way to get them apart.

Staples and Brads... Not a good way to do stuff in a vibrating and flexing environment.. Glue even can break if there
isn't anything to lock the parts together.. Been there too...

So Now everything I build is done with drywall screws of many flavors. No nails, No staples...

I buy them in large boxes based on long term needs.
3/4 Inch for trim
1-1/4 inch for cabinets & plywood box edges.
1-1/2 Inch for 1X2 anchoring.
1-1/2 inch drillscrews to attach wood to metal
2" drywall and or deck screws in stainless for bigger stuff.
2-1/2" for 2X2 and 2X3 work
3" for 2X3 & 2X4 anchoring and assemblies.

It will take me another 3 lifetimes to use up or lose all the pounds of screws I have on hand.

I know that wasn't the question but may help someone new to the "hardware" to make things stay together.

Dave....
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« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2007, 09:58:08 PM »

I stapled and glue mine. Have run down some rough roads (including Mexico) with no problem.
Ron
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TomC
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« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2007, 10:23:04 PM »

Well- I'm going to tell my story.  I bought my last truck used with 445,000 miles on it. The original owner never really finished the 8ft sleeper box behind the cabover.  So I went to Home Depot and bought a 3ft and a 1ft base cabinet made out of particle board and put a 4ft formica particle board counter top with a small bar sink.  Also had a 3ft wide over head cabinet, also out of particle board mounted on the floor.  I mounted it in by first screwing a 2x4 to the wall studs and then just simply screwing the cabinet to the 2x4. I only wanted to use those el cheapo cabinets as an experiment to see what I really liked, but instead just kept them since they worked for me.  When I stopped driving I had put on nearly 750,000 miles on the truck and those cabinets.  And if you think a truck rides anything close to a bus, your mistaken.  If those particle board cabinets with solid doors and drawer fronts can survive for 750,000 miles in a truck, don't you think they might last alright in a gently riding bus for less than 100,000 miles?  I do-and I say go for the IKEA cabinets if you like them.  Just make sure you reinforce them and both screw them to the wall and the floor so they can't come loose.  Personally, I used furniture grade 3/4" birch covered plywood with gloss urethane finish on mine all screwed together with no glue (I can take my whole bus apart if needed) just brackets.  Then there is room for flexing.  Works well for me.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2007, 01:35:15 AM »

I have an Ikea kitchen in my house, with the solid Birch doorfronts - the quality is perfectly acceptable. I would be happy to do the same in the bus if Ikea did the same doors in Cherry, but unfortunately they don't, so I will have to go somewhere else and probably pay more for a similar quality product. A lot of Ikea design is very mundane from an aesthetic point of view, but the decent design & manufacturing quality, and very high volumes makes them cheap. The materials used aren't great, but are adequate; the only problem I have ever had with Ikea stuff was when a set of veneered table legs got wet at the bottom due to a dishwasher flood, and the veneer jumped off instantaneously. I also have a veneered table top where the veneer is thinking about lifting due to spilt coffee etc - although that will probably be fine once I have got around to rubbing it down and re-varnishing it.

Jeremy
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Dave Siegel
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« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2007, 06:48:05 AM »

Kevin, I am a professional, working, kitchen and bath designer (CKD & CBD with KBIS) You will get a lot of conflicting opinions about what cabinets to use. Personally, I would go with the cabinets that fit within your budget. The fact that they are particle board only means that they will be a whole bunch heavier than plywood boxes. (Once covered with Melamine you'll never be able to tell the difference.) I went to the IKEA website and looked at the cabinets and they have a very nice appearance. It is a Euro design, which means that there is no face frame. (Many folks in the industry argue that that fact gives them more and easier storage. ??) I couldn't tell if the boxes come with some assembly required. If they do, the boxes are probably held together with cam locks. When you are assembling the cabinet, use a very good quality wood glue in between all the joints. You can wipe the excess off easily with a damp cloth. Use the same technique if you screw them together. Solidly secure the cabinets to the walls. (I like the fact that IKEA utilizes "clip on" toe kicks. Maybe you can get inventive and build some roll out trays in the toe kick area for extra storage. Use undermount drawer slides.)

I installed particle board cabinets in our bus, as base cabinets. They are fine and work well. I did build some overhead cabinets that I created from plywood so I could pick them up more than anything else.

Be sure to share some pics with your completed project.

Dave Siegel   PD3751 1948 Silversides
(Dave Siegel Designs) Naples, Florida
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Dave & Jan Siegel    1948 GMC  "Silversides"
               Naples, Florida
   Dave is Host to the "Help Assist Pages"
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Chris 85 RTS
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« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2007, 07:45:47 AM »

Kevin,

I used Home Depot cabinets (can't recall the manufacturer right now) which are a particle board box with wood doors.  Cutting them to fit the curve was not a problem, just make a template and cut all the side panels to fit.  In a few cases I had to redo a cam lock location, but that was not that hard.  I also used the same stuff for overhead cabinets, screwing then into a 2x4 screwed into the roof supports, and to a 2x4 across the back.  Are they as strong as plywood, maybe not.  Will they survive a flood, nope.  But the price was right and they were quick and easy.  They have been in the bus for 2 years now, and driven locally somewhat, and I see no signs of loosening.

BTW Kevin, if you are not already a member, I would recommend you join the RTS-bus-nuts Yahoo Group:

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/RTS-bus-nuts/
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kyle4501
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« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2007, 10:00:04 AM »

If you gotta use the mdf or particle board in your bus, don't discount what happens when this stuff gets wet or damp. If at all possible, seal them well after they have been trimmed to fit before you install them.

You don't want a water leak to ruin your hard work. Also if the humidity gets too high, that isn't good for the manufactured wood.

Come to think of it, high himidity won't do much inside your coach any favors.

Good luck with it!
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Dave Siegel
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« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2007, 11:10:20 AM »

Kyle...........that's kinda what I was thinking. If you have to worry about super high humidity or that much moisture in your coach, you just might want to step back and resolve the moisture problems first before you install anything. Because if you have moisture you WILL have mold and when you have MOLD you will be sick.

The cabinets should not flex. The doors may move a little, but that's what adjustable hinges are for. We live in Southwest Florida. I don't think there is anyone on this board that has a more humid and warm weather climate than we do. With that said, our bus is a 1948. Not built to be water tight when new, I have done what I can to seal her up, but it's still not perfect. The cabinets are particle board and have been in our bus for at least 7 years and thay are still fine.

I feel the cabinets he has chosen are nice looking, they fit within his budget. That makes Momma happy, and when Momma's happy everyone is happy. So let's just wish him well and ask to see some install and finished pictures as he goes down the road.

Good luck,

Dave Siegel
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« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2007, 07:16:24 PM »

We did an Ikea kitchen in an MCI 102A3.  This bus gets used a lot and the kitchen is holding up just fine.  Ikea is good quality and it looks good.  After doing the one in the bus in Ikea, I did my house kitchen.  It looks like an $8,000 for $1500.  I really like the dampened drawer slides.  They were $40 at a cabinet shop....$6 at Ikea.

Ross
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captain ron
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« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2007, 08:02:21 PM »

I built my cabinets out of melamine clad particle board, not my first choice but it was free. I pulled them out of my old bus and reused them in my new one. The only reason I would prefer plywood is weight. Particle Board has several different qualities. 60 pound board 80 or 90 if I remember right, the higher the weight # the better and more dense the board is. If I were rich I would use the apple ply Plywood with no voids and very nice ply's. The cabinets I built  over the drivers area are plywood.
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belfert
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« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2007, 01:05:56 PM »

So Now everything I build is done with drywall screws of many flavors. No nails, No staples...

My understanding is that drywall screws are hardened and could snap easily due to vibration or twisting.  I choose to use construction screws and sheet metal screws that supposedly aren't hardened in my bus.

Brian Elfert
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Dave Siegel
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« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2007, 01:31:44 PM »

Construction screws are a good choice. Dry wall screws are hardened and yes they can snap very easily, but usually only during the construction process. I don't think I have ever seen a drywall screw fail once it was tight and snug in a pre-drilled counter sunk hole. They also have a trememdous sheer strength capacity. They also have a finer thread than construction screws so they can go into thinner material with less chance of splitting.

I have been doing some fencing lately and I have been using a tan colored screw designed for outdoor projects. I am not sure if that is the type construction screw you are talking about, but they work great and hold well, but again because of their coarse thread you have to pre drill if you a re very close to an edge.

In summary, if your cabinets are fastened to your bus walls so loosely that they twist and vibrate, you may want to re-think you installation procedures.

Dave Siegel
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Dave & Jan Siegel    1948 GMC  "Silversides"
               Naples, Florida
   Dave is Host to the "Help Assist Pages"
  (Free roadside help for Bus Conversions)
         www.help-assist-list.com
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