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Author Topic: Tour Bus rollover in So. Utah  (Read 4243 times)
Reddog
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« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2008, 11:44:50 AM »

Here is a link to some pics of the front of the bus, I can't tell what it is. Doug
http://www.9news.com/imageenlarge.aspx?storyid=84035
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« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2008, 11:51:25 AM »

For any of us to say our bus would not have sustained the same damage is a ridiculous statement. I feel safe in saying not one of us would know what our bus or any other would do after plummeting 40 foot over a cliff and rolling over several times.
Just looking at the damage it's a wonder that more lives weren't lost.
Thoughts and prayers for all those involved.
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gumpy
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« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2008, 04:37:24 PM »

News out of Colorado is indicating a 9th person died today as a result of the crash.
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Craig Shepard
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« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2008, 04:45:54 PM »

The three state patrol photos on all the websites do not even show the damage. There's a video here: http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=2444919. This is just incredible! This is worse than the one that happened a few years back down south and the roof collapsed.

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Craig Shepard
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pabusnut
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« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2008, 05:02:23 PM »

If you watch the video on one of the links above, the reporter states that there were only two people left in the bus after it stopped!
He also states there was nobody uninjured!!! 
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Steve Toomey
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« Reply #20 on: January 07, 2008, 08:33:14 PM »

This is why GM's, Crown's, Gillig's and others have such a rounded roof line-they were made strong and made to roll over.  Whereas the newer buses have nearly square roofs with much smaller support beams in between the windows.  I think this unfortunate accident is proof positive of this.  Good Luck, TomC
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« Reply #21 on: January 07, 2008, 09:30:35 PM »

From carefully looking at the photos, and watching the video, it appears that this was either a "J" or "E" model MCI, based on the curved stairwell up front.  Interesting, because Arrow Stage Lines has a lot of Setras in their fleet, altho this bus was from another Arrow division.

It is tragic that nine folk lost their lives in this, it is also amazing that so many survived with only minor injuries.

Seatbelts may or may not have helped in this situation, that's a debate that could rage for years - unsolved.

Goes without saying that weather was a contributing factor - black ice, anyone?  Driver survived, so his input will be important to investigators as well as his HOS logs.  Coach probably has a Series 60, so it's black box will also be studied, as well as any on-board video recording devices, if equipped.  Same goes for any tachograph or similar instrumentation.  All will take time. . .

Speculation as to whether an older GMC, Crown or Gillig might have withstood this better is simply that, speculation.  The kinetic energy involved in a bus crash is HUGE, compared to an automobile.  Building a coach to survive a roll-over intact at highway speeds would result in a vehicle similar to a military tank, with gallons per mile fuel economy.  Not going to happen.

However, I would not be surprised to see the USDOT or NHTSA propose new structural integrity requirements out of this.  It's pretty obvious, looking at all the glass in a new coach, compared to the older models, that the roof is not supported as well as before - at least to the layman.

Regardless of all this, our main thoughts and prayers should be for the families involved in this tragedy.

FWIW & HTH. . .

 Cry
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RJ Long
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« Reply #22 on: January 07, 2008, 10:26:30 PM »

Very sad indeed and still along ways to get help from lonely area….very sad.

It appears to be similar of a J4500 MCI, according to the detail of front and fender opening.

If average passenger weighs about 185 lbs each….that is near 10000 lbs of people to put extra strain on roof & window’s post to weaken via flexing till it breaks away from rolling a few times. As per what TomC said is true about large radius curve roof will put less strain on posts. Perhaps it will be rolling still faster like a barrel because of rounder roof top & sides.

I believe bus conversion would be less severe damaging due to less payload plus extra walls partition bracing & anchored. Better yet who is driving & owner have more choices as to not drive at this time of the night of possible slippery condition. The charter company job is to get them home safely in a given time frame.

Yes prayers are needed!

Sojourn for Christ, Jerry
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edvanland
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« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2008, 08:54:01 AM »

Most of the dead and injured were from Phoenix, AZ.  Two of the kids were from one school.  Father survived his son did not.  It has hit Phoenix pretty hard.
Lets pray for the families of the dead and injured.
ED
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Ed Van
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Nick Badame Refrig/ACC
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« Reply #24 on: January 08, 2008, 09:17:02 AM »

Hi Guy's,

Very Horrific.... I'm offering my prayers!

How many times did the bus roll?  I can't beleve that any of the passengers walked away with pics I saw and Craig's video link..

Nick-
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gumpy
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« Reply #25 on: January 08, 2008, 11:23:49 AM »

Most of the dead and injured were from Phoenix, AZ.  Two of the kids were from one school.  Father survived his son did not.  It has hit Phoenix pretty hard.
Lets pray for the families of the dead and injured.
ED
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There were three members of one family who were killed (two teenagers and their aunt). Their father, mother and two siblings were injured. Their mother was listed in critical condition this morning.

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Craig Shepard
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Paladin
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« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2008, 11:48:05 AM »

Hi Guy's,

Very Horrific.... I'm offering my prayers!

How many times did the bus roll?  I can't beleve that any of the passengers walked away with pics I saw and Craig's video link..

Nick-




I just saw an interview with one of the survivors and he said that it rolled at least 3 times, he remembered each impact.
My question though is what is the definition of a roll? Mine is a complete circle of 360 degrees although I often see people call a 180 which is rolling upside down as a roll.
I sort of have a hard time imagining such a large and heavy machine rolling 3 complete circles, that's a whole lot of mass and physics but.....
Either way it's pretty bad and I wouldn't want to be in there.



« Last Edit: January 08, 2008, 11:50:34 AM by Paladin » Logged

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« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2008, 12:07:56 PM »

Passengers want big windows...=  less roof support on roll over.

I have seen a bunch of G bus accident photos.....not may were a total loss like this one.

also helps to be made of all metal and have everything be structural in some way........oh yeah....big meaty c, d, e, f, g pillars
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gumpy
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« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2008, 03:21:03 PM »

One think interesting I noticed on this one is that the entire side panels between the windows and the bays was torn off. I suspect it was fiberglass and glued onto the frame.

Not that it would have added any support to the roof, but it sure makes for a lot of shrapnel in a crash of this magnitude.

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Craig Shepard
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Kristinsgrandpa
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« Reply #29 on: January 08, 2008, 03:37:56 PM »

How did a bus that is about 40' in circumference roll over 3 times in 41'?

  Even if it was a 41' vertical elevation change it would be only 61.5' if on a 45 deg. angle.

Ed
« Last Edit: January 08, 2008, 03:40:17 PM by Kristinsgrandpa » Logged

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