Bus Conversions dot Com Bulletin Board
September 20, 2014, 05:07:48 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: 500 Members as of May 5th, 2006.  Smiley  3,499 Members as of October 21, 2012 Cheesy

   Home   Help Forum Rules Search Calendar Login Register BCM Home Page Contact BCM  
Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: looking for exterior side docking lights.  (Read 9830 times)
scanzel
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 514





Ignore
« on: March 11, 2008, 09:34:05 AM »

I have been looking on the internet and cannot find some exterior docking lights that I can mount on the side of my coach to help light up the area when backing in at night. I see them on the premium coaches on ebay etc. Who carries them? I have seen some Marine ones but very pricey.
Logged

Steve Canzellarini
Berlin, CT
1989 Prevost XL
H3Jim
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1398


1995 Prevost H3-41, series 60, B500 Allison




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2008, 09:57:34 AM »

Some of the coaches use the light fixture from older chevy pickup trucks.  It would be the light above the rear window that shines down onto the bed of the truck.  They are chrome and angled down slightly.  You may have seen them all along the side of a lot of teh professionally done coaches.  I'm not sure they are bright enough for your usage, but they will light up the ground enough to see.

Another option is the outside lights that you find on toxbox trailers that folks take to the desert and other places. These lights are recessed and angled and quite bright.  I know Weekend Warrior trailers have these lights.  I had put in a call to them and they would not sell to me since I don't have a WW trailer.  I do have a friend that does, but I never persued it. 

I've ended up just using 35 watt backup lights sold by International Bus and Parts.  They replaced the terribly anemic backup lights my H3 came with.  They are still not as bright as I'd like, but at least I can see.  I have to back up and turn slightly to get into my parking space and home, steep dropoff if I miss.  When I leave, there is 1/4 mile 9 ft wide private drive down a hill, aorund a corner I have to back down, and its really not fun without being able to see.  I generally never leave in the dark, but the I B P lights show enough to keep me out of the ditch.

I'm anxious to hear other solutions too.
Logged

Jim Stewart
El Cajon, Ca.  (San Diego area)

Travel is more than the seeing of sights, it is a change that goes on, deep  and permanent, in the ideas of living.
Nick Badame Refrig/ACC
1989, MCI 102C3, 8V92T, HT740, 06' conversion FMCA# F-27317-S "Wife- 1969 Italian/German Style"
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4868


Nick & Michelle Badame


WWW
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2008, 10:07:20 AM »

Hi Steve,

Do you mean this kind?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BARNEGAT-DOCKING-LIGHTS_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ50437QQihZ006QQitemZ160216639692QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

Nick-
Logged

Whatever it takes!-GITIT DONE! 
Commercial Refrigeration- Ice machines- Heating & Air/ Atlantic Custom Coach Inc.
Master Mason- Cannon Lodge #104
https://www.facebook.com/atlanticcustomcoach
www.atlanticcustomcoach.com
WEC4104
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 779





Ignore
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2008, 10:09:39 AM »

Several years ago, I spent some internet search time looking for these type of lights.  I am assuming you are looking for the recessed lights that project the light at an angle. I was only able to find the boat hull style units that you mentioned. I looked at several well known manufacturers of truck lighting (Grote, etc) and could not find anything in their offerings.

Of course there are also other styles of lights that could serve the purpose, they just wouldn't look as nice.

I would like to make two additional comments related to these lights.   First, with the angled beams,the mounting location should pretty far forward.  A location right behind the front wheels is not bad. Illuminating that tree or sign that is even with the side of your bus is just as important as that object that is 40 feet behind your rear bumper.

Second, if you pick through the Federal and State DOT regs, I think most docking lights are technically illegal. I don't think you are permitted to have side facing white lights.  Not that this would stop me from actually installing a set.  I point this out for the following reason... If you have nicely recessed docking lights that look like they belong on your coach, I doubt any cop would take issue with them. However, the guy that mounts 6" Hellas protruding out the side wall might get more a little more attention than he wants.        
Logged

If you're going to be dumb, you gotta be tough.
Len Silva
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 4085


Angle Parked in a Parallel Universe


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2008, 10:26:21 AM »

I don't know where you might find them but ambulances have some pretty good exterior lights.

Len
Logged


Hand Made Gifts

Ignorance is only bliss to the ignorant.
tekebird
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2263





Ignore
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2008, 11:00:38 AM »

they are boat docking lights, any marine store should be able to get them for you.

west marine for one?

Logged
Sean
Geek.
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2553


'85 Neoplan Spaceliner "Odyssey"


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2008, 11:39:20 AM »

Second, if you pick through the Federal and State DOT regs, I think most docking lights are technically illegal. I don't think you are permitted to have side facing white lights.         


Not true.

First of all, there are really no applicable "Federal" regulations for non-commercial motor vehicles, other than the fact that all states are forced (by threat of withholding federal highway funding) to adopt FMVSS 108, which specifies, among other things, minimum lighting standards.

Most states have additional regulation over and above what is in FMVSS 108.  But almost all of them have allowance for "work" lighting -- white is universally allowed, and some states allow other colors such as amber.  Think about it: without this exemption all those RV "patio" lights would be illegal, and yet every motorhome made includes one.

The key, though, is that most states forbid these lights to be illuminated while the vehicle is being "operated" on a "highway" or "roadway".  So you could be pulled over, for example, for driving with that wimpy little patio light on.  Also, many states require that any forward-facing white lights other than those legal for driving use be covered while under way.  (We've got giant Hella HID flood lights, like the ones on excavators, mounted on the roof, however, and nary a word has ever been said to us -- I'm prepared to cover them, though, if need be.)

Once you're off the road and backing into your camp site, you can use all the white work lights you want.

So "docking lights" and all those extra patio lights that the big conversions use are all legal.

BTW, I've got the part numbers someplace for the Chevy pickup bed lights that Jim mentioned.  Marathon, Vantare, etc, used these for a long time as patio lights, with one mounted above each bay.  You need to order it from a Chevy dealer as four separate parts (gasket, body, lamp holder, and lens), and when you add it all up it ain't cheap -- somewhere around $50 IIRC.

What we did for a patio light was to buy a Whelen "scene light" such as are used on ambulances and fire apparatus.  It really lights up the night, probably to the annoyance of any neighbors, but it's great when we are in the boonies.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com
Logged

Full-timing in a 1985 Neoplan Spaceliner since 2004.
Our blog: http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com
scanzel
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 514





Ignore
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2008, 12:14:38 PM »

The ones Nick shows on ebay I have already checked out, they would shine back. I was shopping for some that shine down at about 15 to 20 degrees to light up the ground area when backing, these would be on a switch that is turned on when needed. The boat lights look like you would need to cut a large hole in your siding to install. I will have to keep looking.
Logged

Steve Canzellarini
Berlin, CT
1989 Prevost XL
luvrbus
Guest

« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2008, 12:24:27 PM »

Steve, if your are talking about docking lights they all need holes cut in the siding because of the angle on the lights but a patio light can be flush mounted      good luck
Logged
H3Jim
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1398


1995 Prevost H3-41, series 60, B500 Allison




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2008, 12:55:42 PM »

Scanzel,
The chevy lights do not need to be recessed, but are surface mount, and are angled down slightly, they sound lke just what you are looking for. Sean, do you by any stretch, have pictures to go with the part numbers?  and do you have any more info on that Whelen scene light?

My prevost has 55 watt sealed beam white lights, flush mount, by the front wheels that shine straight out out from the bus.  They automatically come one whenever I use a turn signal. They only come on on the side I'm turning to.

 I guess its to let people know I'm coming over.  These are stock.  I don't believe they could do that if there was a law against them.  I've never been pulled over for them.  30,000 miles
Logged

Jim Stewart
El Cajon, Ca.  (San Diego area)

Travel is more than the seeing of sights, it is a change that goes on, deep  and permanent, in the ideas of living.
TomC
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6785





Ignore
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2008, 01:16:09 PM »

I mounted my "docking lights" just rear of the front wheel.  They are bright, but are more of a spot light.  Also, make sure the docking lights are flat-some are curved to fit a boat hull.  Camping World has a "light bucket" that can be recessed into the side and then mount your own light-like a halogen work light-then you'll have some light!  Good Luck, TomC
Logged

Tom & Donna Christman. '77 AMGeneral 10240B; 8V-71TATAIC V730.
oldmansax
Tom & Phyllis
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 994


'82 Bluebird Wanderlodge PT40




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2008, 01:18:53 PM »

The Whelen scene lights are what you want if you don't mind doing the work to mount them. We use them on the ambulances all the time while on accident scenes.

I bought a set of Eplace but I haven't had time to mount them yet.

TOM
Logged

'82 BlueBird WanderLodge PT40 being rebuilt
Delaware

DON'T STEAL! The government hates competition!
Ednj
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 997


Ed & Sue Skiba




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2008, 01:43:58 PM »

I have been looking on the Internet and cannot find some exterior docking lights that I can mount on the side of my coach to help light up the area when backing in at night. I see them on the premium coaches on ebay etc. Who carries them? I have seen some Marine ones but very pricey.



I was at my local bus dismantler today and it totally slipped my mind to check (I hate when that happens).
Last time I was headed down to Delaware on the New Jersey Turnpike, a NJT MCI equipped with a wheel chair lift was riding right next to me on my left.
It had 8 lights on the curbside that pointed in different directions. (None on the driverside)
I guess they want to light the whole loading area.
Look here the new coaches have them.

D4500/D4000 CT
http://www.mcicoach.com/morePhotos/commuter01.htm
Lights
http://www.mcicoach.com/morePhotos/commuter03.htm

This bus has 4

http://www.mcicoach.com/enTouchCMS/app/viewDocument?docID=562

Really I forgot all about these, it might be a good source for us converters.


Ed
Logged

MCI-9
Sussex county, Delaware.
See my picture's at= http://groups.yahoo.com/group/busshellconverters/
That's Not Oil Dripping under my Bus, It's Sweat from all that Horsepower.
----- This space for rent. -----
WEC4104
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 779





Ignore
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2008, 02:08:13 PM »


Not true.

First of all, there are really no applicable "Federal" regulations for non-commercial motor vehicles, other than the fact that all states are forced (by threat of withholding federal highway funding) to adopt FMVSS 108, which specifies, among other things, minimum lighting standards.

Most states have additional regulation over and above what is in FMVSS 108.  But almost all of them have allowance for "work" lighting -- white is universally allowed, and some states allow other colors such as amber.  Think about it: without this exemption all those RV "patio" lights would be illegal, and yet every motorhome made includes one.

The key, though, is that most states forbid these lights to be illuminated while the vehicle is being "operated" on a "highway" or "roadway".  So you could be pulled over, for example, for driving with that wimpy little patio light on.  Also, many states require that any forward-facing white lights other than those legal for driving use be covered while under way.  (We've got giant Hella HID flood lights, like the ones on excavators, mounted on the roof, however, and nary a word has ever been said to us -- I'm prepared to cover them, though, if need be.)

Once you're off the road and backing into your camp site, you can use all the white work lights you want.

So "docking lights" and all those extra patio lights that the big conversions use are all legal.



Let me clarify.  Yes there is no Federal Reg, however most states start by referencing FMVSS108, and then append their own provisions.  These provisions vary from state to state, but they often include some wording that would make most docking light setups illegal.

From Michigan's Code:

(4) Unless both covered and unlit, a vehicle driven on the highways of this state shall not be equipped with a lamp or a part designed to be a reflector unless expressly required or permitted by this chapter or that meets the standards prescribed in 49 C.F.R. 571.108. A lamp or a part designed to be a reflector, if visible from the front, shall display or reflect a white or amber light; if visible from either side, shall display or reflect an amber or red light; and if visible from the rear, shall display or reflect a red light, except as otherwise provided by law.

From Pennsylvania's Code:  (see full details here:  http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/067/chapter175/s175.96.html

(h)  Ornamental lamps. A lamp not enumerated in this section, and not located as described in Tables III—V of this chapter, is prohibited unless it is available as original equipment. An illuminated sign is prohibited except on taxicabs, ambulances and trucks. Flashing or revolving lights are not ornamental lamps. Provisions relating to flashing or revolving lights are in Chapters 15 and 173 (relating to authorized vehicles and special operating privileges; and flashing or revolving lights on emergency and authorized vehicles).   [Note:  There is no reference to docking lights, so unless they are original equipment, or you want to call them cargo lights, they are not permitted.]

On a state-by-state basis you will find restrictions that spell out one or more of the following:

1) If they are not FMVSS108 listed they must be covered and unlit while driving. The "covered" requirement does not only apply to forward facing lights.
2) They may not project white light in the side or rear direction unless they are back-up lights, and most have a requirement that back-up lights must be rear mounted.
3) They may only be operational when vehicle is parked.
4) They must be automatically switched off when vehicle travels in forward direction.
5) Requirement that all exterior lights have a lens and reflector that meets specific criteria/approvals

(In addition, there are specific exceptions allowed for ambulances, truck unloading, and "original manufacturer equipment". Most of us are dealing with bus conversions that did not have them originally [H3Jim excluded], so we don't qualify)

I'll rephrase my original statement to be more clear and state: "Most of the docking lights that are installed on our converted buses are not legal in all 50 states."
  
Logged

If you're going to be dumb, you gotta be tough.
tekebird
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2263





Ignore
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2008, 02:55:52 PM »

the lights regs in vehicle codes is refering to lights and reflectors that are used while the vehicle is in operation of public roads.

Docking lights provided they are not turned on on the highway are perfectly legal in all 50 states, canada and mexico

as with most codes...you cannot look at just one section or paragraph...you have to look at the whole thing.



Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!