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Author Topic: hydrogen generator?  (Read 4646 times)
kyle4501
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« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2008, 08:45:27 AM »

Huge chasm between concept test & viable marketable vehicle.

Some times building the bridge between the two isn't possible . . . .

But good luck to the bridge builders anyway.
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JohnEd
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« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2008, 08:45:43 AM »

Kyle,

I was deeply in your camp early on.  What sorta turned me around was clearing up some issues I had.  Firstly, the salt and sugar issues.  Neither of those is good for an internal combustion engine and both are used heavily in cooking.  Turns out that neither salt or sugar is soluble in VO so that is a non issue.  The component in WVO that does the most damage is suspended WATER.  Water cannot me mechanically filtered but it certainly can be completely removed with a centrifuge or other means.  Solid particulate will clog the D's fuel filter and those are spendy but that isn't trashing an engine and they are removed to the submicron level in the centrifuge process.  The "pure" WVO that remains still has a host of stuff in there that is chemical gobbledygook but adds up to mostly animal fat.  The University evals ran their test engine for only a comparatively few number of hours and then tore the engine down for eval.  They discovered that there were deposits in the engine that exceeded what would be experienced with Dino and extrapolated engine failure in the 100's of hours.  That flys in the face of actual experience if only in that there are a slew around that have been going strong for years.  In the mid sixties I attended the Berlin Grand Pre in Germany.  I was surprised that "caster bean" oil was used in the race car and motor cycle fuels.  Seems that stuff is a superior lube to any Dino and is only beat by Syn.  Caster will gum up rings in a short time and all engines had to be disassembled and flushed with alcohol after each race so there is precedent for your missgivings.  Caster bean being lethal it doesn't often find its way into the food chain except in China so it isn't an issue with WVO. Tongue  UI think almost all the VO stock is a superior lube to Dino but I can't site any charts or studies except for reports I have read in WVO supporters lit.

Again, I was in your camp but I kept running into "reality" and we all know that reality is a crutch for people that can't tolerate drugs and alcohol.  Stay frosty! Cool

Kyle, I think the proof is in the pudding on this.  I can't argue this on any technical/scientific footing but I think the shoes should be put on different feet.  WVO is a successful fuel and that is proven so I think those that feel that is not true should be coming up with the documented failures.  It doesn't fly that all those that have experienced that are so ashamed that they won't admit it.  Heck, just look at me....I was married once. Grin
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cody
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« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2008, 08:51:47 AM »

http://www-news.ucdavis.edu/search/news_detail.lasso?id=6217       how can they continue to lie about this, is it mass hypnosis?, or do they actually have those things being tested, this particular one is a fuel cell, remember? the one that can't be done?                               http://www.ecofriendlymag.com/sustainable-transporation-and-alternative-fuel/hydrogen-on-demand-makes-1st-appearance-at-l-a-auto-show/     I sure wish they could do something like this too.                                   http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f81/purdue-university-engineers-develop-cost-competitive-hydrogen-demand-system-61083/              http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Content/Uniquely/FutureTechnologies/Hydrogen.aspx?enc=t0eBkkksaeOlO9zOt8gzADZCvgwlYpsTNlAXDAkk1+s=  I guess none of this exists tho it's been well documented by many sources.  
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Jeremy
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« Reply #33 on: December 04, 2008, 09:25:28 AM »

For the benefit of other readers I've just had a quick look at each of the four links that Cody provided:

The first one is about a Toyota fuel-cell vehicle - nothing to do with on-board generation here (remember, fuel cells neither create or store hydrogen)

The second link is about on-board generation, but is from an organisation that I've never heard of (HydroLectricPower LLC) and certainly wouldn't trust at face value

The third link (Purdue University) is about a way of spliting H20 into hydrogen and oxgen by using metal hydrides rather than electrolosis. This in itself is nothing new. The article is very short and is only introducing the theory - no claims are made about likely hydrogen outputs, and there is certainly no suggestion that any working vehicle-powering system has been built.

The fourth link is about the BMW's hydrogen powered 7-series. No on-board generation here either - in fact this is the simplest of the lot - just a tank of hydrogen and the standard BMW V12 piston engine

Jeremy

"Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know."  Michel Eyquem de Montaigne (1533-1592) French philosopher and essayist.
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cody
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« Reply #34 on: December 04, 2008, 09:52:09 AM »

Clearly you have no understanding of the concept, I'm done with the topic, I'm really sorry I even tryed to show anyone what already exists.
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kyle4501
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« Reply #35 on: December 04, 2008, 10:14:38 AM »

johned, re read what I said. In the first line I said "WVO will work as a fuel"

It is NOT a direct drop in replacement. As you have said, it must be handled a certain way or the suspended water will cause problems. That was what I was pointing out. I've talked to many that rushed out to burn straight WVO in their diesels only to ruin the motor because they didn't correctly prepare the WVO.

WVO's success depends on your criteria.
use as a direct drop in replacement for regular diesel - no
use as an alternative fuel with required additional end user processing - yes
use as an additive to regular diesel - only if properly processed.
cheaper than regular diesel - maybe, depends on how much free time you have & your ability to amortize the costs associated with the processing.


You won't find documented failures because those who have the capacity to accurately document their 'testing' typically are smart enough to do the proper processing.

BTW, All the ones I know that have used WVO & had failures won't admit it publicly. Be it from embarrassment or the vicious attacks from within the WVO community accusing them of various things like lying & planned sabotage.
The failures include gummed up motors, excessive carbon buildup in the exhaust, failed turbos, processing station fire, WVO spills in 'the good car', etc.


For those that missed the point,
I will do what I can to help anyone. That help includes assistance in making an informed decision. Once you have made the decision, I'll assist in what ever way I can to help you succeed. I will not try to sabotage your efforts by with holding information.

I do not find happiness in the failure of others that have made informed decisions.

However, I have been known to laugh at those who refuse to think . . . .



Jeremy, Maybe you & I need the same glasses. I came to similar conclusions.

Kinda makes you wonder about the concept some have concerning reading comprehension . . .  Roll Eyes
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I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (R.M. Nixon)
cody
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« Reply #36 on: December 04, 2008, 10:25:43 AM »

Interestingly, when asked to document the stated credentials. the subject suddenly gets changed, that in itself tells me all I need to know, smoke is still smoke.
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kyle4501
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« Reply #37 on: December 04, 2008, 10:44:49 AM »

cody,
you are doing just fine & don't need any help from me with your smoke screen.

 Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin



BTW, anyone seen the horse lately? I know it's been dead a while, but after all this beating, the pieces are getting harder to find . . . . .
« Last Edit: December 04, 2008, 10:46:50 AM by kyle4501 » Logged

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (R.M. Nixon)
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