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Author Topic: 6V92T problems  (Read 7554 times)
van
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« on: July 31, 2008, 09:47:27 AM »

Hi, am new to the board and having engine(6V92T)problems with my first bus.I have a slight amount of water dribbling from the right side air box tube,motor is very hard to start . When finally started it seems to run fine,have had a multitude of problems bringing bus home.First the fuel pump,replaced with new,had virtualy no turbo boost,found problem to be disinagrated turbo output hose,replaced it and restored the boost up to around 18-19 pounds ,motor was running kinda hat at around 200 degrees,found radiator to have holes in it ,replacied it tryed to start motor it seemed like it would want to lock at certain points .Finnally got motor running ,water initially blew wa small amount of water out  of exhaust  conections leading to the turbo then motor ran fine seemed to have full power , let it idle for about 1 half hour  temp started to clime back to 200 degrees,shut motor down and tryed to re start which it did revved up engine momentarily at which point it when it returned to idle it stalled .any insight would be apreciated ,thanks
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blue_goose
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« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2008, 11:02:23 AM »

With your temp getting that hot with no load you almost have to have a crack in one of the heads.  You should also have more turbo boust, should be up to 24 to 26 lbs.
Jack
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Sojourner
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« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2008, 11:54:19 AM »

Welcome to the board!

Your 6/92T need to be repair for water in cylinder before you have other things fix.
Hi, am new to the board and having engine(6V92T)problems with my first bus.I have a slight amount of water dribbling from the right side air box tube,motor is very hard to start . When finally started it seems to run fine,have had a multitude of problems bringing bus home.First the fuel pump,replaced with new,had virtualy no turbo boost,found problem to be disinagrated turbo output hose,replaced it and restored the boost up to around 18-19 pounds ,motor was running kinda hat at around 200 degrees,found radiator to have holes in it ,replacied it tryed to start motor it seemed like it would want to lock at certain points .Finnally got motor running ,water initially blew wa small amount of water out  of exhaust  conections leading to the turbo then motor ran fine seemed to have full power , let it idle for about 1 half hour  temp started to clime back to 200 degrees,shut motor down and tryed to re start which it did revved up engine momentarily at which point it when it returned to idle it stalled .any insight would be apreciated ,thanks

You said "tryed to start motor it seemed like it would want to lock at certain points"....meaning a possible water hydraulic-ing...trying to do more damage if you keep starting it after setting a while.

Your profile is Boulder, Nevada.....Does any one here from MAK board know any good 2 stroke mechanic near? Hope there help near by!

FWIW

Sojourn for Christ, Jerry
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luvrbus
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« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2008, 04:44:48 PM »

CW, I should be home by Sunday and will give you a call to see if I can help someway
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van
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« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2008, 05:25:29 PM »

You guy's are truly the best Cheryl and I are truly very grateful for the assistance every one in the busing comunity is providing.This eagle was supose to be a dream come true for us,instead has become a night mare as well as a stumbling block for myself with no end in sight.We are still hopeful that things will get resolved some how and that this will only make us more appreciative of the opportunity to get into busing and be traveling together meeting decent folks such as yourselves thank you all from the bottom of our hearts. hopfully one day we will look back on these days and have a good laugh around the camp fire .luvrbus we are looking foward to meeting you when you get home wish you a safe trip home.
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Dreamscape
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« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2008, 05:29:38 PM »

Welcome CW!

Hope you are able to get all the issues resolved so you can enjoy your Eagle!

Clifford (luvrbus) is a wealth of knowledge, he has helped me more than you know.

Good Luck and Happy Trails,

Paul
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NJT5047
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« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2008, 07:58:58 PM »

From what you describe, could be time to look for another engine.   Yours has major issues.
The notching over and then starting, and blowing water out of the exhaust manifold....that's bad news.   Sounds like water on top of one or more pistons.  Might have pounded out a rod (s) bearings, cracked heads, etc.  The etc list is endless.
A good used takeout MUI would be much less expensive than trying to rebuild yours... Undecided
A good RH 6V92TA MUI could be bought for $3K...labor to install wouldn't be a show stopper.
Labor to rebuild yours will likely be a show stopper. 
Most shops don't want to deal with two strokes anyway, but those that will get proximal to $12K-$15K to rebuild a 6V92.
Be careful with allowing high priced mechanics to diagnose your problem. 
Don't intend to sound negative, but your engine has taken a hit.  Even if you replaced an offending head, aftercooler, gaskets or whatever, the bottem end is likely damaged. 
Jerry Campbell, in North Carolina (engine may be in Florida?) had a good 6V92TA MUI for sale back in spring....Jack?   
Get a good dependable engine in your bus and the project will look a little brighter.
Be sure that no other 'gremlin$' are lurking. 
How far have you driven the bus? Does the transmission, clutch (if manual), or anything else jump out at you?   Has the bus been checked by an Eagle dude for rust? 
Not sure what you have exactly, but be sure that the finished project merits the expenditure of replacing an engine. 
Even if Jerry's motor has been sold, you shouldn't have any problems finding a good used 6V92.  You can probably find an engine that you can 'drive' home for cheap these days. 
Get some good DD diesel advice when buying a takeout.   
Do you have the skills (or maybe better, a family member that's a mechanic? Or anyone that really like to get dirty!) to pull the heads and pan? 
By just pulling the rocker covers, inspection covers and pan, you often can see water trickling out of the affected cylinder ports.  Helps to know where to look when tearing down an engine. 
If you could do this sort of work, you could inframe your engine....could.  Still be a lot work. 
Welcome to bus'n!   Hope the journey becomes a lot smoother!   These sorts of issues build 'busnut' character.  You'll know more, and be better prepared for future setbacks...of which we'll hope are few! 
Are any pix of your project posted on the board?
JR




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JR Lynch , Charlotte, NC
87 MC9, 6V92TA DDEC, HT748R ATEC

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« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2008, 10:21:22 PM »

Welcome Van,

I think a lot of us get surprises we didn’t expect when we got our buses; some surprises are more costly than others are though, so you are in good company. I don’t know much about Eagles other than I like the looks. But what about a repower to a four stroke if you have to swap a motor anyways? Every time I spend a dollar on my bus my wife says, “When you bought it, I thought you said it didn’t need anything else”. I now try to explain that I meant it already had jakes, spring brakes, power steering etc. I soon found out that even when you start out with a decent machine the opportunities to spend money on it are endless. However, it was a hobby/life style choice, and so far it has been enjoyable. I think once you get your power unit working right you will be grinning ear to ear.

Good luck,

Laryn
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« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2008, 05:21:37 AM »

Van
You live close to B&B in Vegas might be good to go over an talk with them.  There is lots of know how there and they have worked on lots of Eagles.  Takes a while to get over the hard spots but they last a long time after that.
Jack
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van
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« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2008, 11:36:42 AM »

ok now that I've recovered from having a near stroke ,and my wife and mom having an emotional break down,we've heard the worst that could possibly be wrong with our power plant could there some how be a best case scenareo or am I just plain S.O.L. See we are not as fortunate to have deep pockets as other folks might be at this time, I'm sorry for sounding so frustrated ,

thanx
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« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2008, 08:08:00 PM »

Sadly, depending on the number of mechanics in your 'circle', SOL?   
However, if you know anyone that could assist you with diagnosing the engine, you may be able to salvage the thing. 
Try to repair it in a workmanlike manner.  The engine could be crapped together and run well, but it'll take a dump when you least need such events.  Get it fixed right, and you'll never have to deal with it again....probably.  You just about cannot wear a bus conversion engine out.
First, before removing anything, figure out where (what cylinders) the water is leaking into and what cylinders are affected,  pull the heads, have a quality machine shop check and replace what may be damaged or cracked.  Or get some rebuilt heads, or head, as the situation warrants. 
Drain the oil.  If water comes out...bummer.  Again, drain the water and oil, pull the pan, and remove a couple caps and see what may be pounded or galled.   Check the rod bearings that are on the cylinders with water incursion.  The rods could be bent. Water will bend a rod right now.  Be sure someone that is familiar with torquing mains and rod bolts are assisting you with this process...if the project gets this far.. 
If you find damaged rod or main bearings, time to quit and look for a used engine.
Read the manual before you start working on the engine.
With the heads off, check the cylinders for scuffing, rust, wear, cracks...you name it. 
If the cylinders are in good condition, the rod bearings are not damaged, you don't find water in the oil, then you may salvage the engine.   
You've likely got a head that is leaking water.  Cracked, injector tube, whatever. 
Keep in mind that you can find good engines for $3K...or even less if motivated to look around.  They are literally everywhere.  A 6V92TA MUI can sit for several years and not be harmed.  As long as the intake isn't open to atmo, and essentially it's still installed in something.   Used bus engines are probably best.   Fire apparatus and marine applications are higher HP engines, which may be impossible to cool in a bus.   Truck 6V92 engines are not common anymore...probably DOA when it was parked.   
Your engine has major issues.  Unless you wish to tackle some of this work utilizing friends and family with mechanical skills, it's going to get expensive.   
Your failure sounds related to overheat problem.  The damage may have occured prior to when you bought the bus.   The fact that the engine can get to 200* idling is a sign of cooling system issues yet to be resolved.  Probably no more than aireation of the coolant due to cracks or leaks in the head (s).   "No more" being a relative term. 
Heads aren't especially expensive, and you can have the heads checked for leaks and cracks..once removed. 
Parts aren't particularly expensive, and they're readily available. 
Labor is expensive.   You gotta find a way to offset the labor. 
Buy a DD V92 repair manual and have a go at the engine.   Eplace...$20 bucks on CD.
The engine should be disassembled and serviced ASAP.  If water is circulating thru the engine, it is now sitting there rusting.   
It the liners are damaged, it's time to regroup.  Without highly skilled help, the liners are not a backyard job...however, with skilled help, these could be replaced in your backyard. 
I'm familiar with MCIs not Eagles, but, as I recall, the top-end of the engine is accessable thru the floor?   Is your bus converted?  Is the floor hatches still accessable? Hope so.
If you decide to remove the heads, be sure and mark everything so that the components can be returned to their original location.  Take dig pix for ref.   Don't disassemble any assemblies that don't require disassembly...such as rocker shafts, gov...
Get ready for some exercise!  And get ready to get down and dirty!  Wink
Other busnuts may have better ideas...??  But it's time to get started..before the engine rusts and locks up on you. 
JR 

 
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JR Lynch , Charlotte, NC
87 MC9, 6V92TA DDEC, HT748R ATEC

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« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2008, 09:14:14 PM »

My 89 is DDEC 2. It would be nice to have MUI but more work than its worth.
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van
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« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2008, 10:35:20 PM »

 Cheryl and every one here thinks the world of every one who has helped out , we thank you all .this reminds me of the time I sat on a motor cycle for the very first time ,burnt my leg on the exhaust pipes really bad but some how still developed a love for harleys and have been riding them ever since .I have always had a thing for bus's  rode on them all through out my child hood growing up back in brooklyn NY even lived right next to one of the largest nyc bus terminals in BKLYN ,now I have one that is my own the journey begins once more ,but the best thing of all is that I have people to share it with,The bug has bitten I'M HOOKED
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Sojourner
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« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2008, 11:42:19 PM »

Sorry about the ordeal but if you do need to replace engine, there is chances for transit buses with a decent 6/92T motor. Many small charter bus company find a salvage bus and take out what they needs to get their own one running back on the road. Many 8/71 and 6/92 will go more miles then we could ever put in. Have a two cycle mechanic with you while searching the bus. Have it running for you before you pay.

You could talk to a charter bus or city bus shop to give a location for one.

Hang in there and keep posting the up date.

FWIW

Sojourn for Christ, Jerry

PS...who know what you might find out there for a $500 that is running
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van
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« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2008, 12:09:05 PM »

I removed the air box cover plates was able to look into all the cylinders   by jogging the engine around and peering thru the holes in the sleeves .From what i could see the cylinder walls looked clean and what I could see of the rings did not look too bad either ,checked for water in the oil pan,found none. with the air box plates still removed refilled coolant system with water and saw water trickling into the first cylinder only on the r/h side and the first and second cylinders on the l/h side,redrained the coolant system ,once emptyed spun engine over again to make shure no water was left in the cylinders.while turning the engine over (with the fuel shut off arm wired in the off position)did not notice any unusual noises or grinding, replaced pan and air box covers and did not refill coolant system.I would imagine that if I were to try and restart the engine it would probably fire right up again(which I won't).The same thing occured after putting in the new radiator last monday filled the system with water and the engine seemed to hydroloc it'self ,drained the water from the system tried to start engine a couple of more times and the thing fired up and ran like nothing was ever wrong and was able to move it back to it's parking spot , I did however refill the system with water again before I moved it .does this sound like it could be either worn injector tubes or mushed o-rings on the cyl sleeves?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2008, 12:12:11 PM by van » Logged
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